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	<title>Comments on: Diplomacy – a la MM Lee</title>
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	<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/</link>
	<description>a community of Singaporeans</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: lesile</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1517</link>
		<dc:creator>lesile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 13:43:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1517</guid>
		<description>If indeed materialistic Singaporean who want to achieve the 5C will be better of migrating to other countries where it is more easily obtainable without huge liabilities.

In Malaysia, cars and petrol are so cheap, but you better show off getting cheaper cars in case it might be stolen, and bungalow is such a commodities that it takes someone who work 2 years accumulating $120,000 to cash buy the house for a similar house that cost greater than a millions dollars here. And you don&#039;t have to bloated down by loan of 30years ! Country club ? You have ample choice to choose from.

I not comparing anything but just to let people understand that there&#039;s more life than simply chasing the 5C blindly.

It is highly that most chase the 5C in order to fill the empty void and aimlessness of being a Singaporean here.

Many choose to migrate because they feel that not only Singaporean did not get respect from gov, they also marginalised by its people around.

There also lack of unity among Singaporean and it is all-man to themselves because the bond of a nation is never there in first place, let alone nation building.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If indeed materialistic Singaporean who want to achieve the 5C will be better of migrating to other countries where it is more easily obtainable without huge liabilities.</p>
<p>In Malaysia, cars and petrol are so cheap, but you better show off getting cheaper cars in case it might be stolen, and bungalow is such a commodities that it takes someone who work 2 years accumulating $120,000 to cash buy the house for a similar house that cost greater than a millions dollars here. And you don&#8217;t have to bloated down by loan of 30years ! Country club ? You have ample choice to choose from.</p>
<p>I not comparing anything but just to let people understand that there&#8217;s more life than simply chasing the 5C blindly.</p>
<p>It is highly that most chase the 5C in order to fill the empty void and aimlessness of being a Singaporean here.</p>
<p>Many choose to migrate because they feel that not only Singaporean did not get respect from gov, they also marginalised by its people around.</p>
<p>There also lack of unity among Singaporean and it is all-man to themselves because the bond of a nation is never there in first place, let alone nation building.</p>
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		<title>By: scb</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1518</link>
		<dc:creator>scb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 12:25:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1518</guid>
		<description>Although it is very heartwarming to read substantial, knowledgeable and enlightening materials posted by the many intellectual bloggers in Cyberspace, I still do not foresee any political changes in the near future. The opposition parties in Singapore have to face the crippling strategies and castrating ploys of the Ruling Party. They are also not able to attract much people to support them or join them though the Blogging Community seems to have many capable men that they(opposition) can and should recruit or forge partnerships. On the other hand, although there are much sound and fury, the sociopolitical bloggers themselves are not actively involved in political affairs though they are very concerned with state(social/people) affairs. Personally, I am very disappointed that capable Singaporeans have chosen to be so apathetic to local politics. Many have in fact left the Land for good; it could be due to total lack of confidence in themselves to cope up with the sociopolitical culture. Or simply no confidence in the future of the Country itself as there is no denial that it is resourceless, overcrowded, expensive and overdeveloped. In our ideals of living, many of us will appreciate space, freedom, landscape(scenery) culture and arts. And for Singaporeans staying put here, they will not get to enjoy them. A new phenomenon has also emerge lately, likely an inculcation of money-loving culture, the people are getting greedy and depraved; at least the signs have been around since the 5Cs were in vogue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although it is very heartwarming to read substantial, knowledgeable and enlightening materials posted by the many intellectual bloggers in Cyberspace, I still do not foresee any political changes in the near future. The opposition parties in Singapore have to face the crippling strategies and castrating ploys of the Ruling Party. They are also not able to attract much people to support them or join them though the Blogging Community seems to have many capable men that they(opposition) can and should recruit or forge partnerships. On the other hand, although there are much sound and fury, the sociopolitical bloggers themselves are not actively involved in political affairs though they are very concerned with state(social/people) affairs. Personally, I am very disappointed that capable Singaporeans have chosen to be so apathetic to local politics. Many have in fact left the Land for good; it could be due to total lack of confidence in themselves to cope up with the sociopolitical culture. Or simply no confidence in the future of the Country itself as there is no denial that it is resourceless, overcrowded, expensive and overdeveloped. In our ideals of living, many of us will appreciate space, freedom, landscape(scenery) culture and arts. And for Singaporeans staying put here, they will not get to enjoy them. A new phenomenon has also emerge lately, likely an inculcation of money-loving culture, the people are getting greedy and depraved; at least the signs have been around since the 5Cs were in vogue.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Teh Kok Hua</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1519</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Teh Kok Hua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 03:48:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1519</guid>
		<description>Raymondchua,

What you have suggested is a total revamp, which include a change of government which is now in a state of denial or protectionism due to their entrenchment of power through legalistic wrangling of laws and regulations to suit their own agendas.

I agree with you fully that the government is now in a state of denial using hypocrisy and look-good presentations to mull over people&#039;s problems.

Let us hope people the next generation of leaders other than the few current crop of MPs and connected elites will come forward to make change happen by registering themselves, making their voices heard and standing for election with proactive actions taken through legitimate means.

This website is a small way of identifying such views, and getting people interested and involved to effect such change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Raymondchua,</p>
<p>What you have suggested is a total revamp, which include a change of government which is now in a state of denial or protectionism due to their entrenchment of power through legalistic wrangling of laws and regulations to suit their own agendas.</p>
<p>I agree with you fully that the government is now in a state of denial using hypocrisy and look-good presentations to mull over people&#8217;s problems.</p>
<p>Let us hope people the next generation of leaders other than the few current crop of MPs and connected elites will come forward to make change happen by registering themselves, making their voices heard and standing for election with proactive actions taken through legitimate means.</p>
<p>This website is a small way of identifying such views, and getting people interested and involved to effect such change.</p>
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		<title>By: raymondchua</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1515</link>
		<dc:creator>raymondchua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 02:30:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1515</guid>
		<description>Of course, it is idealistic to even change the gov because LKY say that military will interfere. With so much to lose, the only change that acceptable is those that fit LKY&#039;s agenda.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, it is idealistic to even change the gov because LKY say that military will interfere. With so much to lose, the only change that acceptable is those that fit LKY&#8217;s agenda.</p>
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		<title>By: raymondchua</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1514</link>
		<dc:creator>raymondchua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 02:28:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1514</guid>
		<description>For every feedback we give to gov, all we get back is more committee, more regulation, more rules, more money from us to spend on admin cost, more talkRot, more problem than solution.

The problems are simply throw back to you citing you is the problem, therefore solution lies within you !</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For every feedback we give to gov, all we get back is more committee, more regulation, more rules, more money from us to spend on admin cost, more talkRot, more problem than solution.</p>
<p>The problems are simply throw back to you citing you is the problem, therefore solution lies within you !</p>
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		<title>By: raymondchua</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1513</link>
		<dc:creator>raymondchua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 02:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1513</guid>
		<description>Robert Teh Kok Hua ,
what we need is really a change in government. Rather than fix so much existing and inherited problem, it is better to start from new. Just like a car that cause so much problem after 7 years, one better off buying a new car.

Our gov&#039;s problem is not worth fixing because for every fix you put in, endup more things to fix.

The system itself is a liabilities and fixing it doesn&#039;t make it any more an asset.

Gov that in constant denial is actually a form of protectionism for themselves. This has been going on for decades, and near impossible to even change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robert Teh Kok Hua ,<br />
what we need is really a change in government. Rather than fix so much existing and inherited problem, it is better to start from new. Just like a car that cause so much problem after 7 years, one better off buying a new car.</p>
<p>Our gov&#8217;s problem is not worth fixing because for every fix you put in, endup more things to fix.</p>
<p>The system itself is a liabilities and fixing it doesn&#8217;t make it any more an asset.</p>
<p>Gov that in constant denial is actually a form of protectionism for themselves. This has been going on for decades, and near impossible to even change.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Teh Kok Hua</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1516</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Teh Kok Hua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 16:40:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1516</guid>
		<description>What is leadership, talents, insight, foresight or all the assumptions like meritocracy or contribution of foreign talents?

Are such concepts or assumptions even practicable or are they just some kind of self-promotion to glorify one&#039;s oneself?

Is such a leadership system liable to abuse of power where the so-called leader is able to override the wishes of his subjects and even oppress good people who could otherwise contribute to the greater good by their diversities.

Is he a good leader who keeps talking about his own leadership, vision, foresight and who keeps increasing costs of living by taxing and profiteering on lands and facilities owned by the people?

Is he a leader who keep suing his political opponents for the slightest criticism in the course of electioneering through legalistic wrangling of the civil libel?

Could such a leader actively motivate his people to participate in his rule to produce the mass participation in practical knowledge application to benefit all citizens.

Is he a good leader who ignored people&#039;s complaints for years about malpractices like the nkf or shin corp unwilling to serve them with accountability, procedures, processes, codes of corporate governance, passion, moral uprightness or nobility of spirit?

What kind of leadership qualities did citizens expect from our leaders today ?

Despite all the feedbacks of the citizens, what we are seeing is a system of legalistic wrangling of laws and regulations aimed at taxing and recovering fullest costs depriving people of essential services in housing, transportation, utilities and medical care.

The ordinary citizens are suffering from dropping wages, loss of employment opportunities due to rising costs of doing business with a domestic economy being squeezed out by such rising costs and by government&#039;s getting into businesses of all sorts to compete with its own citizens.

What happen to all the talents of our own citizens or do we have no talents?

The Asian Financial crisis has exposed self-centredness as the ultimate cause of financial instability.

Why is it that during the Asian Financial crisis none of our so-called second generation or present team of ministers were able to take action to restructure the economy but instead were seen as blaming the crisis on the people and not their inability to motivate the people due to their own individualism and self-centredness resulting in malpractices in all the NKF going on in so many organizations.

Apparently something has gone wrong with the team since ministers like Dr. Goh Keng Swee or Lim Kim San, Dr. Toh Chin Chye have left the scene being retired early for perhaps deeper reason like being unable to get along with our supremely self-centred leader.

In the fast-paced age of technology, we need leaders who could command the whole organization and population to use their respective leadership and talent to produce maximum results instead of giving excuses and denying problems like NKF or Nicol Highway collapse instead of self-glorifying bigots who only talk about policies and hardly able to translate them into coordinated work processes to reach results.

We need leaders who talk less but are more committed to down-to-earth broad-based technology and knowledge application by the masses.

We need leaders who could translate diverse challenges and decisions into attainable work processes which allow staff to take actions with broad-based knowledge application and teamwork.

We need to leaders who could solve the &quot;20 major major government policy errors&quot; as posted to the Feedback Unit since 2002.

We need ministers and civil servants who could take comprehensive actions to restructure the economy to value-adding technology-driven economy talked about for years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is leadership, talents, insight, foresight or all the assumptions like meritocracy or contribution of foreign talents?</p>
<p>Are such concepts or assumptions even practicable or are they just some kind of self-promotion to glorify one&#8217;s oneself?</p>
<p>Is such a leadership system liable to abuse of power where the so-called leader is able to override the wishes of his subjects and even oppress good people who could otherwise contribute to the greater good by their diversities.</p>
<p>Is he a good leader who keeps talking about his own leadership, vision, foresight and who keeps increasing costs of living by taxing and profiteering on lands and facilities owned by the people?</p>
<p>Is he a leader who keep suing his political opponents for the slightest criticism in the course of electioneering through legalistic wrangling of the civil libel?</p>
<p>Could such a leader actively motivate his people to participate in his rule to produce the mass participation in practical knowledge application to benefit all citizens.</p>
<p>Is he a good leader who ignored people&#8217;s complaints for years about malpractices like the nkf or shin corp unwilling to serve them with accountability, procedures, processes, codes of corporate governance, passion, moral uprightness or nobility of spirit?</p>
<p>What kind of leadership qualities did citizens expect from our leaders today ?</p>
<p>Despite all the feedbacks of the citizens, what we are seeing is a system of legalistic wrangling of laws and regulations aimed at taxing and recovering fullest costs depriving people of essential services in housing, transportation, utilities and medical care.</p>
<p>The ordinary citizens are suffering from dropping wages, loss of employment opportunities due to rising costs of doing business with a domestic economy being squeezed out by such rising costs and by government&#8217;s getting into businesses of all sorts to compete with its own citizens.</p>
<p>What happen to all the talents of our own citizens or do we have no talents?</p>
<p>The Asian Financial crisis has exposed self-centredness as the ultimate cause of financial instability.</p>
<p>Why is it that during the Asian Financial crisis none of our so-called second generation or present team of ministers were able to take action to restructure the economy but instead were seen as blaming the crisis on the people and not their inability to motivate the people due to their own individualism and self-centredness resulting in malpractices in all the NKF going on in so many organizations.</p>
<p>Apparently something has gone wrong with the team since ministers like Dr. Goh Keng Swee or Lim Kim San, Dr. Toh Chin Chye have left the scene being retired early for perhaps deeper reason like being unable to get along with our supremely self-centred leader.</p>
<p>In the fast-paced age of technology, we need leaders who could command the whole organization and population to use their respective leadership and talent to produce maximum results instead of giving excuses and denying problems like NKF or Nicol Highway collapse instead of self-glorifying bigots who only talk about policies and hardly able to translate them into coordinated work processes to reach results.</p>
<p>We need leaders who talk less but are more committed to down-to-earth broad-based technology and knowledge application by the masses.</p>
<p>We need leaders who could translate diverse challenges and decisions into attainable work processes which allow staff to take actions with broad-based knowledge application and teamwork.</p>
<p>We need to leaders who could solve the &#8220;20 major major government policy errors&#8221; as posted to the Feedback Unit since 2002.</p>
<p>We need ministers and civil servants who could take comprehensive actions to restructure the economy to value-adding technology-driven economy talked about for years.</p>
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		<title>By: LCC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1505</link>
		<dc:creator>LCC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Aug 2007 13:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1505</guid>
		<description>Hmm... Okay... MM Lee is a partial role model (his good attribues are worth modelling after)to me.

However, it seems that, to some out there, saying anything nice about MM is equivalent to trying to bootlick him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm&#8230; Okay&#8230; MM Lee is a partial role model (his good attribues are worth modelling after)to me.</p>
<p>However, it seems that, to some out there, saying anything nice about MM is equivalent to trying to bootlick him.</p>
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		<title>By: scb</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1498</link>
		<dc:creator>scb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Aug 2007 11:01:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1498</guid>
		<description>Btw, one is damned for doing or not doing a thing when the deed benefits nobody except the perpetrator.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Btw, one is damned for doing or not doing a thing when the deed benefits nobody except the perpetrator.</p>
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		<title>By: scb</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1497</link>
		<dc:creator>scb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Aug 2007 10:53:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1497</guid>
		<description>Although it is obvious that I meant LKY whose gut I incidentally admire very much too though not his ruthlessness; with your question, I now doubt if LKY has got your admiration. Maybe I was wrong and do forgive me if I am wrong, regards !</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although it is obvious that I meant LKY whose gut I incidentally admire very much too though not his ruthlessness; with your question, I now doubt if LKY has got your admiration. Maybe I was wrong and do forgive me if I am wrong, regards !</p>
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		<title>By: LCC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1506</link>
		<dc:creator>LCC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Aug 2007 03:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1506</guid>
		<description>Hmm... Okay... Perhaps I am but just one quick question: when you said &quot;maybe you admire his gut&quot;, whose gut are you referring to? Mr. Teh&#039;s or MM Lee&#039;s?

Apologise for asking this seemingly obtuse question but I am really confused.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm&#8230; Okay&#8230; Perhaps I am but just one quick question: when you said &#8220;maybe you admire his gut&#8221;, whose gut are you referring to? Mr. Teh&#8217;s or MM Lee&#8217;s?</p>
<p>Apologise for asking this seemingly obtuse question but I am really confused.</p>
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		<title>By: scb</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1511</link>
		<dc:creator>scb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 14:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1511</guid>
		<description>&quot;Hmm, damned if he do, damned if he don&#039;t?&quot;. LCC, me think you underestimate LKY, he is the one that is perpetually qualify to damn others. Robert Teh said it very clearly at Post 4 and you(LCC) are finding reasons which you are not too sure to make guessings of possibilities. Maybe...you admire his gut.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Hmm, damned if he do, damned if he don&#8217;t?&#8221;. LCC, me think you underestimate LKY, he is the one that is perpetually qualify to damn others. Robert Teh said it very clearly at Post 4 and you(LCC) are finding reasons which you are not too sure to make guessings of possibilities. Maybe&#8230;you admire his gut.</p>
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		<title>By: LCC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1510</link>
		<dc:creator>LCC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 07:29:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1510</guid>
		<description>Nahh... I no need to ...  and was not trying to ... (was just trying to provide my own viewpoint without, ... insulting those who disagree with it).

*Edited to remove personal insults and reference to genitalia :) We are a family-oriented blog. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nahh&#8230; I no need to &#8230;  and was not trying to &#8230; (was just trying to provide my own viewpoint without, &#8230; insulting those who disagree with it).</p>
<p>*Edited to remove personal insults and reference to genitalia :) We are a family-oriented blog. :)</p>
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		<title>By: Pui yee</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1503</link>
		<dc:creator>Pui yee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 06:22:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1503</guid>
		<description>lcc, you very funny leh... you said &quot;to sacrifice honesty for basic manners would perhaps be too big a sacrifice&quot;. you never looked into sg history izzit? old harry is not known for his honesty, but his manipulative way. go on, look into the recently de-classified british documents.

to answer your second part of your earlier comment: lky and his cronies hor, always find foreigners critising spore deplorable, inflammatory , and &quot;sue-able&quot;.

*Edited to remove personal insults</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lcc, you very funny leh&#8230; you said &#8220;to sacrifice honesty for basic manners would perhaps be too big a sacrifice&#8221;. you never looked into sg history izzit? old harry is not known for his honesty, but his manipulative way. go on, look into the recently de-classified british documents.</p>
<p>to answer your second part of your earlier comment: lky and his cronies hor, always find foreigners critising spore deplorable, inflammatory , and &#8220;sue-able&#8221;.</p>
<p>*Edited to remove personal insults</p>
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		<title>By: LCC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1512</link>
		<dc:creator>LCC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 05:29:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1512</guid>
		<description>Hmm... Don&#039;t be mistaken. I am no die-hard fan and/or apologist of MM Lee; I am just trying to look at this whole issue from a non-partisan/objective standpoint.

Okay, allow me to make 2 quick responses to the critical responses to my earlier comment.

i) I may be wrong but it seems to me that it is not entirely clear whether MM Lee voluntary made those critical comments about the Indonesian Constitution or that he made them in response to a question. If he had made them in response to a question (e.g. &quot;What do you think about the Indonesian Constitution?&quot;), I suppose it would be a quite different situation from if he made them without external prompting.

ii) Again, I may be wrong but I think MM Lee was invited to go to Indonesia to speak at an event, which was scheduled for earlier this year but postponed due to floods, organised by Citibank i.e. it was not a visit initiated by him. Thus, the point about how MM Lee should visit less of a country if he is displeased with it cannot really stand, considering that he was invited to go there. It is perhaps coincidental that MM Lee&#039;s recent visit coincided with the current rough patch in Singapore-Indonesian relations. Of course, that said, I cannot deny the possibility that the invitation to speak at the Citibank event could perhaps be a &quot;smokescreen&quot;.

Also, maybe it is just me but it seems that to sacrifice honesty for basic manners would perhaps be too big a sacrifice.

And, similar to what Gerald said (i.e. &quot;Well intentioned but unsolicited advice&quot;), I think there is a Chinese saying, which can be roughly translated into &quot;Honest words may be unpopular words&quot;. (&quot;Chong yan ni er&quot;), that is rather applicable in this situation.

Moving on, it is rather curious that while critical responses have been made in reply to the first part of my earlier comment, the second part of it have been strangely overlooked. Thus, I think I would just reiterate it (the second part) below.

&lt;i&gt;&quot;Anyway, it would seems to me that if MM Lee, instead of criticising the Indonesian system, had praised the Indonesian system during his visit, I suppose there would be people who would insinuate that he, succumbing to pressure, did so to &#039;please&#039; Indonesia, in order to have the DCA ratified.

Hmm… Damned if he do, damned if he don’t?&quot;&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm&#8230; Don&#8217;t be mistaken. I am no die-hard fan and/or apologist of MM Lee; I am just trying to look at this whole issue from a non-partisan/objective standpoint.</p>
<p>Okay, allow me to make 2 quick responses to the critical responses to my earlier comment.</p>
<p>i) I may be wrong but it seems to me that it is not entirely clear whether MM Lee voluntary made those critical comments about the Indonesian Constitution or that he made them in response to a question. If he had made them in response to a question (e.g. &#8220;What do you think about the Indonesian Constitution?&#8221;), I suppose it would be a quite different situation from if he made them without external prompting.</p>
<p>ii) Again, I may be wrong but I think MM Lee was invited to go to Indonesia to speak at an event, which was scheduled for earlier this year but postponed due to floods, organised by Citibank i.e. it was not a visit initiated by him. Thus, the point about how MM Lee should visit less of a country if he is displeased with it cannot really stand, considering that he was invited to go there. It is perhaps coincidental that MM Lee&#8217;s recent visit coincided with the current rough patch in Singapore-Indonesian relations. Of course, that said, I cannot deny the possibility that the invitation to speak at the Citibank event could perhaps be a &#8220;smokescreen&#8221;.</p>
<p>Also, maybe it is just me but it seems that to sacrifice honesty for basic manners would perhaps be too big a sacrifice.</p>
<p>And, similar to what Gerald said (i.e. &#8220;Well intentioned but unsolicited advice&#8221;), I think there is a Chinese saying, which can be roughly translated into &#8220;Honest words may be unpopular words&#8221;. (&#8220;Chong yan ni er&#8221;), that is rather applicable in this situation.</p>
<p>Moving on, it is rather curious that while critical responses have been made in reply to the first part of my earlier comment, the second part of it have been strangely overlooked. Thus, I think I would just reiterate it (the second part) below.</p>
<p><i>&#8220;Anyway, it would seems to me that if MM Lee, instead of criticising the Indonesian system, had praised the Indonesian system during his visit, I suppose there would be people who would insinuate that he, succumbing to pressure, did so to &#8216;please&#8217; Indonesia, in order to have the DCA ratified.</p>
<p>Hmm… Damned if he do, damned if he don’t?&#8221;</i></p>
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		<title>By: Lai CF</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1508</link>
		<dc:creator>Lai CF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 04:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1508</guid>
		<description>In demagogeury, who cares about logic and truth?
For Singapore to engage in &quot;a balance of mutual benefit&quot;, Lee Kuan Yew, a much hated figure amongst Malaysian bumiputera, Indonesians associate dhim with Suharto, how much of a shrewdness he has in the new REALPOLITIK in ASEAN?

In China, he said: &quot;We are Deferential; but not Submissive..&quot;
In Indonesia, he said: &quot;We cannot allow changes..else...no rule of law??&quot;

it is not shrewdness but plain stupidity without udnerstanding the nature of your opponents who ahs an axe to grind with SIngapore; with present legalistic approach only make it worse.

A change of tack is required...by first removing Lee Kuan Yew from ASEAN politiking.

Do you mena that after 43-year sof nation-building, SIngpaore will collapse instantly when Lee Kuan Yew is no more in Government?

Then, what the heck are tax-payers paying S$1.6-million per annum per person to George Yeo, Teo Chee Hean, Jayakumar and Lim Hng Kiang for?

All four of them should be able to takeover Lee Kuan Yew&#039;s job load in ASEAN Politics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In demagogeury, who cares about logic and truth?<br />
For Singapore to engage in &#8220;a balance of mutual benefit&#8221;, Lee Kuan Yew, a much hated figure amongst Malaysian bumiputera, Indonesians associate dhim with Suharto, how much of a shrewdness he has in the new REALPOLITIK in ASEAN?</p>
<p>In China, he said: &#8220;We are Deferential; but not Submissive..&#8221;<br />
In Indonesia, he said: &#8220;We cannot allow changes..else&#8230;no rule of law??&#8221;</p>
<p>it is not shrewdness but plain stupidity without udnerstanding the nature of your opponents who ahs an axe to grind with SIngapore; with present legalistic approach only make it worse.</p>
<p>A change of tack is required&#8230;by first removing Lee Kuan Yew from ASEAN politiking.</p>
<p>Do you mena that after 43-year sof nation-building, SIngpaore will collapse instantly when Lee Kuan Yew is no more in Government?</p>
<p>Then, what the heck are tax-payers paying S$1.6-million per annum per person to George Yeo, Teo Chee Hean, Jayakumar and Lim Hng Kiang for?</p>
<p>All four of them should be able to takeover Lee Kuan Yew&#8217;s job load in ASEAN Politics.</p>
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		<title>By: Pui yee</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1509</link>
		<dc:creator>Pui yee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 04:45:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1509</guid>
		<description>It seems like we are paying an old gizzard and his offspring millions of money to create diplomatic mess for Singapore.

And the reason why he thinks he can do that with impunity is that he and his family hold the purse-strings of our money - $100 billion. That is a helluva lot of money for subsequent necesary clean-up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems like we are paying an old gizzard and his offspring millions of money to create diplomatic mess for Singapore.</p>
<p>And the reason why he thinks he can do that with impunity is that he and his family hold the purse-strings of our money &#8211; $100 billion. That is a helluva lot of money for subsequent necesary clean-up.</p>
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		<title>By: Dead Poet</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1499</link>
		<dc:creator>Dead Poet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 01:06:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1499</guid>
		<description>I think we are grossly under-estimating the political shrewdness of the man. History has proven beyond doubt that he is capable of manipulating both allies and enemies to achieve his political aim. What ever the man says, it is calculated to achieve the desired results. While the DCA is doomed to fail, so will be extrediction agreement and the blame will of course be with the Indons. Without even having to disagree or taking his young cabinet&#039;s action, he has vetoed it with a few short comments and speeches, ensuring the billions remain in Singapore. He is simply too brilliant for our neighbours to understand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we are grossly under-estimating the political shrewdness of the man. History has proven beyond doubt that he is capable of manipulating both allies and enemies to achieve his political aim. What ever the man says, it is calculated to achieve the desired results. While the DCA is doomed to fail, so will be extrediction agreement and the blame will of course be with the Indons. Without even having to disagree or taking his young cabinet&#8217;s action, he has vetoed it with a few short comments and speeches, ensuring the billions remain in Singapore. He is simply too brilliant for our neighbours to understand.</p>
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		<title>By: Gerald</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1504</link>
		<dc:creator>Gerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 00:46:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1504</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think LKY went with the intention of insulting the Indons. If Indon were some far of land, he wouldn&#039;t bother to comment. But because Indon is our gigantic neighbour whose progress (or failure) has significant bearing on Singapore, LKY probably felt by making certain statements, he could do something to improve things there.

It&#039;s kinda like your mother-in-law coming to your home and telling you how to put your home in order. Well intentioned but unsolicited advice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think LKY went with the intention of insulting the Indons. If Indon were some far of land, he wouldn&#8217;t bother to comment. But because Indon is our gigantic neighbour whose progress (or failure) has significant bearing on Singapore, LKY probably felt by making certain statements, he could do something to improve things there.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s kinda like your mother-in-law coming to your home and telling you how to put your home in order. Well intentioned but unsolicited advice.</p>
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		<title>By: Lai CF</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/comment-page-1/#comment-1502</link>
		<dc:creator>Lai CF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2007 00:04:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/2007/08/01/diplomacy-%e2%80%93-a-la-mm-lee/#comment-1502</guid>
		<description>He never learn isn&#039;t it since the 90s bruhohaha over his &quot;high crime rate&quot; in Johor?

he forgot that no matter what he said in this region; it will invariably ended up in attacks on SIngapore by demagogues of all kind...from left to right....

he should play the elderly statesman and comment on anywhere, except Middle East, China, India and ASEAN.

Leave Middle East and Idnai to GOh Chok TOng.
Chian to Lee Hsien Loong,
and ASEAN to George yeo.

Lee Kuan Yew is more of a liability in regional politics and he still does not realise it yet.

As the CHiense saying goes: &#039;Teh older you are, the muddlier you become.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He never learn isn&#8217;t it since the 90s bruhohaha over his &#8220;high crime rate&#8221; in Johor?</p>
<p>he forgot that no matter what he said in this region; it will invariably ended up in attacks on SIngapore by demagogues of all kind&#8230;from left to right&#8230;.</p>
<p>he should play the elderly statesman and comment on anywhere, except Middle East, China, India and ASEAN.</p>
<p>Leave Middle East and Idnai to GOh Chok TOng.<br />
Chian to Lee Hsien Loong,<br />
and ASEAN to George yeo.</p>
<p>Lee Kuan Yew is more of a liability in regional politics and he still does not realise it yet.</p>
<p>As the CHiense saying goes: &#8216;Teh older you are, the muddlier you become.&#8221;</p>
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