Comments on: ICA, MOM refuse to release Burmese statistics http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/ Singapore's #1 Socio-Political Site Fri, 25 May 2012 03:31:55 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: tiredman http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8570 tiredman Sat, 24 May 2008 11:33:09 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8570 What if in future, foreigners become too important to let go? I believe I would not be surprise that Singaporeans would be overpowered by foreigners. Just like what my mom told me foreign factory workers ganged up to bully a local. What if in future, foreigners become too important to let go? I believe I would not be surprise that Singaporeans would be overpowered by foreigners. Just like what my mom told me foreign factory workers ganged up to bully a local.

]]> By: Fever Guy http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8496 Fever Guy Fri, 23 May 2008 14:02:00 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8496 Anyone can pick up a stone and throw anywhere there are people and you can hit a foreigner! It is so bad. We are SWARMED with foreigners. SWARMED is the WORD to use. It is going to get worse until GE2010. Singapore is feeling more like SINKAPORE. Anyone can pick up a stone and throw anywhere there are people and you can hit a foreigner! It is so bad. We are SWARMED with foreigners. SWARMED is the WORD to use. It is going to get worse until GE2010. Singapore is feeling more like SINKAPORE.

]]> By: Perry Tong http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8388 Perry Tong Thu, 22 May 2008 14:37:16 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8388 Deduction and reasoning through elimination through various sources .... try .... http://www.singstat.gov.sg/pubn/catalogue.html#sib Deduction and reasoning through elimination through various sources …. try …. http://www.singstat.gov.sg/pubn/catalogue.html#sib

]]> By: Sylvie http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8267 Sylvie Wed, 21 May 2008 05:33:11 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8267 At one time, the authorities refused to reveal how many China nationals/PRs are in Singapore but Forbes recently repored the figure to have crossed 1 million. From the report "Singapore's Unloved Chinese Labor Boom": (http://www.forbes.com/2008/05/08/singapore-chinese-immigration-markets-econ-cx_jc_0508markets04.html): "Chinese workers are just one constituency in Singapore's fast-growing foreign population, but they are the largest component of an expatriate contingent that crossed the 1 million mark in October..." At one time, the authorities refused to reveal how many China nationals/PRs are in Singapore but Forbes recently repored the figure to have crossed 1 million.

From the report “Singapore’s Unloved Chinese Labor Boom”: (http://www.forbes.com/2008/05/08/singapore-chinese-immigration-markets-econ-cx_jc_0508markets04.html):
“Chinese workers are just one constituency in Singapore’s fast-growing foreign population, but they are the largest component of an expatriate contingent that crossed the 1 million mark in October…”

]]> By: Insulted http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8132 Insulted Mon, 19 May 2008 15:16:55 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8132 India was the most recent country to enact the FOI or Freedom Of Information Act. For a country which has been consistantly been ranked high on corruption it is a notable achievement. Is is not strange that a country which prides itself on its governance, accountability and transparency is not willing to indulge to its own citizens information which would be public knowledge even in third world countries. Instead we are seeing so many new laws being put in place to secure secrecy and blatant excuses for not providing adequate information. Perhaps it true when the government says "You can't handle the truth". India was the most recent country to enact the FOI or Freedom Of Information Act. For a country which has been consistantly been ranked high on corruption it is a notable achievement. Is is not strange that a country which prides itself on its governance, accountability and transparency is not willing to indulge to its own citizens information which would be public knowledge even in third world countries. Instead we are seeing so many new laws being put in place to secure secrecy and blatant excuses for not providing adequate information. Perhaps it true when the government says “You can’t handle the truth”.

]]> By: foreigners are here for your benefit? http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8109 foreigners are here for your benefit? Mon, 19 May 2008 10:00:24 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8109 Depending on the arrivals of these talents (many from expected to resume employment here in the wake of subprime retrenchments in the US), the horizontal and vertical mobility of local professionals are affected. Is there assurance that this wont happen? When a local engineer is retrenched from say Motorola, he will have to queue behind unlimited applicants from less developed countries for a job. If he cant make it due to these liberal immigration policies, he can consider new vocations as a taxi driver or manager at macdonald's. Isnt it fair then that the G should dip into its tax collections and the long term benefits it will received from the foreigners, to compensate ( in terms of unemployment benefits) locals who are directly affected by these policies, instead of letting them rot away? Depending on the arrivals of these talents (many from expected to resume employment here in the wake of subprime retrenchments in the US), the horizontal and vertical mobility of local professionals are affected.

Is there assurance that this wont happen? When a local engineer is retrenched from say Motorola, he will have to queue behind unlimited applicants from less developed countries for a job. If he cant make it due to these liberal immigration policies, he can consider new vocations as a taxi driver or manager at macdonald’s. Isnt it fair then that the G should dip into its tax collections and the long term benefits it will received from the foreigners, to compensate ( in terms of unemployment benefits) locals who are directly affected by these policies, instead of letting them rot away?

]]> By: Raymond http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8066 Raymond Mon, 19 May 2008 00:23:54 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8066 It could simply be that nobody thought of compiling the information - and that as an afterthought, admitted that yes the information is afterall available but classfied. It could simply be that nobody thought of compiling the information – and that as an afterthought, admitted that yes the information is afterall available but classfied.

]]> By: tiredman http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8049 tiredman Sun, 18 May 2008 18:22:47 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8049 Yesterday afternoon, I was sitting in McDonald’s and overheard two mainland Chinese (FT base on their dress code) discussing about that Singaporeans are having some kind of hard feeling towards foreigners. One decides to leave and the other kept quiet and decided not to probe more. I do not know how to comment in this situation, however, this shows that even foreigners know this. Anyway, the field just beside JE MRT has become a mini-little india. Just too many foreigners. Tom, Dick and Harry are also welcome.... just joking... cheerzzz.... Yesterday afternoon, I was sitting in McDonald’s and overheard two mainland Chinese (FT base on their dress code) discussing about that Singaporeans are having some kind of hard feeling towards foreigners. One decides to leave and the other kept quiet and decided not to probe more. I do not know how to comment in this situation, however, this shows that even foreigners know this.

Anyway, the field just beside JE MRT has become a mini-little india. Just too many foreigners. Tom, Dick and Harry are also welcome…. just joking… cheerzzz….

]]> By: Daniel http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8046 Daniel Sun, 18 May 2008 17:47:20 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8046 Fever Guy, the answer is that we have no human right here. Information is withdrew from the layman. And MSM never did cover any of the news that jeopardise commerical interest. What other country which respect human right does not want to deal with non-democratic country due to fear of backlash by their own people on the government, our shameful government knows very well nothing will happen to them even they rob, support, price-fixing, collusion, monopolize and work with nefarious government etc because they know Singaporeans can't do anything much after 4 decades of PAP programming and propaganda. That's why they withhold information and says it confidential. What's an insult to intelligence of Singaporean. The problem with our society is that we are taught to argue and fight with fact and evidence, and hence by withholding the crucial information which is the key, the government knew educated and intellectual citizen will be helpless and despondent. It is the same thing with NKF, EDB NSWA saga, ShinCorpse... Ironically most of information is given by related outsider than our coffers. But I sense one day, Singaporeans will wakeup their **** idea and do what need to be done to regain their dignity and pride. <em><strong> TOC Moderator: Sorry, Daniel. Expletives are not allowed here. </strong></em> Fever Guy,
the answer is that we have no human right here. Information is withdrew from the layman. And MSM never did cover any of the news that jeopardise commerical interest. What other country which respect human right does not want to deal with non-democratic country due to fear of backlash by their own people on the government, our shameful government knows very well nothing will happen to them even they rob, support, price-fixing, collusion, monopolize and work with nefarious government etc because they know Singaporeans can’t do anything much after 4 decades of PAP programming and propaganda. That’s why they withhold information and says it confidential. What’s an insult to intelligence of Singaporean.

The problem with our society is that we are taught to argue and fight with fact and evidence, and hence by withholding the crucial information which is the key, the government knew educated and intellectual citizen will be helpless and despondent. It is the same thing with NKF, EDB NSWA saga, ShinCorpse… Ironically most of information is given by related outsider than our coffers.

But I sense one day, Singaporeans will wakeup their **** idea and do what need to be done to regain their dignity and pride.

TOC Moderator:
Sorry, Daniel. Expletives are not allowed here.

]]> By: Fever Guy http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-8008 Fever Guy Sun, 18 May 2008 08:23:25 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-8008 You know the shocking news i have from FM G.Y is that we are trading with North Korea $86 million last year. Improving ties with them? Aren't they a nuclear aspiration nation? Just like IRAN? Which our singapore also trying to woo? I shake my head at this type of unmoral foreign policy. Why do Singapore Gahmen loves to trade with nations like Burma, IRAN and N.Korea? Countries with very poor human rights records and having nuclear ambitions. Why? What is our foreign policy? Trading with nations that has no moral authority just like ours? What a let down! You know the shocking news i have from FM G.Y is that we are trading with North Korea $86 million last year. Improving ties with them? Aren’t they a nuclear aspiration nation? Just like IRAN? Which our singapore also trying to woo? I shake my head at this type of unmoral foreign policy.

Why do Singapore Gahmen loves to trade with nations like Burma, IRAN and N.Korea? Countries with very poor human rights records and having nuclear ambitions. Why? What is our foreign policy? Trading with nations that has no moral authority just like ours? What a let down!

]]> By: SNOVA http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7980 SNOVA Sun, 18 May 2008 04:21:14 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7980 On balance, I believe that there may be some bigger purposes, other than the usual reasons given for foreign talents, foreign workers, etc... Sensitivity was the key work in the 1980s; it may be the key word now, too. I am an unhappy & presently unemployed Singaporean, but bearing up; I had hoped though that there will be more "Tan Cheng Bock"s around. Thank you. On balance, I believe that there may be some bigger purposes, other than the usual reasons given for foreign talents, foreign workers, etc…
Sensitivity was the key work in the 1980s; it may be the key word now, too.
I am an unhappy & presently unemployed Singaporean, but bearing up; I had hoped though that there will be more “Tan Cheng Bock”s around.
Thank you.

]]> By: Leo http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7966 Leo Sun, 18 May 2008 01:42:39 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7966 whats is so secret about foreigners' numbers in Singapore? Do we all as citizens got the right to know? Guess the govt knows this item is very unpopular in Singapore thats why they classified it. Makes you wonder why kind of transparency they were trying to preach about. whats is so secret about foreigners’ numbers in Singapore? Do we all as citizens got the right to know? Guess the govt knows this item is very unpopular in Singapore thats why they classified it. Makes you wonder why kind of transparency they were trying to preach about.

]]> By: Reveal reserves http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7960 Reveal reserves Sun, 18 May 2008 00:03:17 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7960 Interesting article in ST on Sat about UNSW fiasco - final tally from the losses were disclosed. And it indicated issues where the Asia President of UNSW was also sitting in the EDB board. That show a red flag for Singapore governance system - where our MM is also Chairman of GIC and insists that accountability of GIC performance be given only once every 5 years or something - over the long term. Really, who 'audits' GIC and checks and guides the management in case of poor governance issues? President Ong has brought up this case and there is still no resolution till today. Even when they do publish some data, you get something like the Mas selamat COI report - akin to Mee Siam mai harm..... Interesting article in ST on Sat about UNSW fiasco – final tally from the losses were disclosed. And it indicated issues where the Asia President of UNSW was also sitting in the EDB board.
That show a red flag for Singapore governance system – where our MM is also Chairman of GIC and insists that accountability of GIC performance be given only once every 5 years or something – over the long term.
Really, who ‘audits’ GIC and checks and guides the management in case of poor governance issues? President Ong has brought up this case and there is still no resolution till today.

Even when they do publish some data, you get something like the Mas selamat COI report – akin to Mee Siam mai harm…..

]]> By: Lucky Tan http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7952 Lucky Tan Sat, 17 May 2008 22:28:45 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7952 Does it matter many? When you take the MRT you're sorrounded by Foreign Talents here to create jobs for us. Our govt is just being modest about how much good they have done for Singaporeans and they don't want our competitors to know and have an edge. That is also why GIC accounts and performance has to be kept a secret so that our competition is not given a leg up. It is amazing how western govt undermine themselves by having a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) which requires them to release all information so long as it does not compromise national security. But in Singapore, every piece of info. compromises national security - so we have the reverse of the FOIA which is known as the OSA (Official Secrets Act) - a civil servant can't even tell you his overtime allowance without violating this act. Does it matter many? When you take the MRT you’re sorrounded by Foreign Talents here to create jobs for us. Our govt is just being modest about how much good they have done for Singaporeans and they don’t want our competitors to know and have an edge. That is also why GIC accounts and performance has to be kept a secret so that our competition is not given a leg up.

It is amazing how western govt undermine themselves by having a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) which requires them to release all information so long as it does not compromise national security. But in Singapore, every piece of info. compromises national security – so we have the reverse of the FOIA which is known as the OSA (Official Secrets Act) – a civil servant can’t even tell you his overtime allowance without violating this act.

]]> By: nair http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7945 nair Sat, 17 May 2008 18:57:30 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7945 u still hope this garmen to be transparent with us ??? you wait long long till earthquake hit singapore . pui !!! translucent also don't have ah.... opague all the way till cyclone nagis hit them. u still hope this garmen to be transparent with us ??? you wait long long till earthquake hit singapore . pui !!! translucent also don’t have ah…. opague all the way till cyclone nagis hit them.

]]> By: Gerald http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7930 Gerald Sat, 17 May 2008 16:35:33 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7930 SawSwee - Are you Prof Saw Swee-Hock? Anyway, I attended the presentation by Prof Saw Swee-Hock at ISEAS some time back (and bought his book too). He mentioned that sometimes the only way to get info out of the govt is to get an MP to ask for it in Parliament. Until we get our Freedom of Information Act, that might be the only way for now. SawSwee – Are you Prof Saw Swee-Hock?

Anyway, I attended the presentation by Prof Saw Swee-Hock at ISEAS some time back (and bought his book too). He mentioned that sometimes the only way to get info out of the govt is to get an MP to ask for it in Parliament. Until we get our Freedom of Information Act, that might be the only way for now.

]]> By: opaque http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7914 opaque Sat, 17 May 2008 13:24:29 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7914 it is ike that in Singapore what. Other questions - how many Foreigners in NUS / NTU / SMU on full scholarship. I (44 years old) just found out the fees can be as high as SGD20,000 Gulp. How can I afford that amount of money?? And here we are, govt paying foreigners to come in here, while my sons serve NS and proceed to pay Uni fees in full. What the hell!! MM Lee and Mrs Lee. She was warded on Monday, and newspapers reported it on Thursday. Why does Sammyboy forum have to report it first? I hope PAP learns a lesson, like China has learnt its lesson on transparency from the sichuan earthquake issue. But with all these opaqueness, PAP will fall. TOC and other bloggers need to highlight all these, Yes the NTUC / CASE issues was a real nugget!! it is ike that in Singapore what.

Other questions – how many Foreigners in NUS / NTU / SMU on full scholarship. I (44 years old) just found out the fees can be as high as SGD20,000 Gulp. How can I afford that amount of money?? And here we are, govt paying foreigners to come in here, while my sons serve NS and proceed to pay Uni fees in full. What the hell!!

MM Lee and Mrs Lee. She was warded on Monday, and newspapers reported it on Thursday. Why does Sammyboy forum have to report it first?

I hope PAP learns a lesson, like China has learnt its lesson on transparency from the sichuan earthquake issue. But with all these opaqueness, PAP will fall. TOC and other bloggers need to highlight all these,

Yes the NTUC / CASE issues was a real nugget!!

]]> By: k http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7907 k Sat, 17 May 2008 11:59:41 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7907 Oh ConsistentOne. Don't be silly. Oh ConsistentOne. Don’t be silly.

]]> By: ConsistentOne http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7906 ConsistentOne Sat, 17 May 2008 11:24:32 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7906 bloggers always point out how ST Online or channel news asia change their article titles or sentence wording as time goes by for whatever reasons. I noticed you guys changed the article title as well. I'm sure you must have your reasons, but please *stop* that. bloggers always point out how ST Online or channel news asia change their article titles or sentence wording as time goes by for whatever reasons.

I noticed you guys changed the article title as well.

I’m sure you must have your reasons, but please *stop* that.

]]> By: tiredman http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/05/number-of-burmese-%e2%80%93-it%e2%80%99s-top-secret-silly/comment-page-1/#comment-7905 tiredman Sat, 17 May 2008 11:22:56 +0000 http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=781#comment-7905 Ai ya... no use one. Our G is always likes foreigners. Most of us have take up low paying job. Why is this so? Bring in foreigners to press down the wage while inflation is at sky high. Who bothers about our wage? The thing that bothers our G is how much money they can earn. The bosses will be happy as they earn much more profit. What I see is most of us, perhaps the 60% of the Singaporeans who do not need to pay tax had become a class lower than the foreigners. Foreigners need to pay tax what right, so value them. Our G don’t dare to publish this piece of information perhaps, not to upset the whole lot of Singaporeans who find hard to look for a better pay job that could lead to a better life. Now, the problem lies at there is an increase in wage, however productivity has dropped. Why? Ai ya... work so hard for what, our boss never restore our real wage.... Perhaps, the next step is to adopt hire fire. Cheap foreigners are around thank you. The morale is low what do you expect Mr. G? Ai ya… no use one. Our G is always likes foreigners. Most of us have take up low paying job. Why is this so? Bring in foreigners to press down the wage while inflation is at sky high. Who bothers about our wage? The thing that bothers our G is how much money they can earn. The bosses will be happy as they earn much more profit.
What I see is most of us, perhaps the 60% of the Singaporeans who do not need to pay tax had become a class lower than the foreigners. Foreigners need to pay tax what right, so value them.
Our G don’t dare to publish this piece of information perhaps, not to upset the whole lot of Singaporeans who find hard to look for a better pay job that could lead to a better life.
Now, the problem lies at there is an increase in wage, however productivity has dropped. Why? Ai ya… work so hard for what, our boss never restore our real wage…. Perhaps, the next step is to adopt hire fire. Cheap foreigners are around thank you. The morale is low what do you expect Mr. G?

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