If you want to negotiate, lets negotiate. There is no need to encroach, no need to test the market or our waters.
Malaysian Foreign Minister on S’pore claims to areas around Pulau Batu Puteh
- Home
- Blogs & Sites
- Moderation
- TOC Store
- Vision, Mission & Core Values
- Join Us!
- Contact Us
- Privacy
- RSS
All rights reserved. Singapore Wedding Videography and Photography | Cream Pictures
RH: It is patently ABSURD for LIE KY LHL PAP to ‘claim territorial waters and exclusive economic zones’ based on a tiny piece of rock. If this were allowed, and I am sure the ICJ will laugh it out of court for being so stupidly legalistic without any understanding of law, then any tiny piece of rock near any country will then be the basis to extend that country’s territorial waters and exclusive economic zones way, way, beyond any reason or logic. This would lead to almost every sea being claimed by their contiguous countries, leaving only a few middle-of-the-ocean left for free passage. I dont think the world, especially the Big Powers, will allow LIE KY LHL PAP to set such a stupid precedent. This is probably the most RIDICULOUS joke I ever heard, except that LIE KY LHL PAP are capable of, and have, mouthed and done, even stupider. This is what happens when you have an Elite that are all Technicians, such as legal technicians like the stupid AG and CJ, medical technicians who can wield the surgical knife but cannot ethics, engineer technicians who can build flats but not homes or communities, systems and operations technicians who can plan but cannot think or work out truly efficient transport systems, etc. LIE KY has produced a nation of TECHNICIANS, NOT THINKERS, and this kind of joke is the rule rather than the exception.
RH: Britain, another lackey of LIE KY, deliberately hid documents that would have won Malaysia’s Batu Puteh case in ICJ :
http://www.bernama.com.my/bernama/v3/news.php?id=348752
both nations are ruled by morons…its a competiton to see who’s the stupiest of them all
In fact. the whole Asean is run by morons! Singapore just happen to be the smarter moron of them all! Ha ha ha ha!
First they object to Pedra B. and insist it’s an island (Pulau Batu Putih). Now they have lost, it’s back to Pedra B. and he insist it’s now a rock. You got the rocks, idiot.
And if you have more rocks like P.B. i’ll be happy to have them. We could exchange some real rocks with this Malaysian Foreign Minister.
They got sovereignty over the rocks. The important thing to realise is that only a few months before they had nothing. Now they’ve got sovereignty over the rocks. The South Ledge. If anything, they are the ones ‘encroaching’ on Singapore’s rights in the ‘EEZ’.
I just don’t believe it. How could the Foreign Ministry in a press statement just over-ruled it’s Minister’s Parliamentary speech. Where’s the credibility then?
My hunch is that we shld not underestimate the strategic military and economic position of this little rock at the very extreme mouth of the Johor Straits to our paranoid leaders. As has happened in history, such chokepoints at the mouths of international sealanes can and have been used for staging economic blockades by a less powerful country who controls it and uses it for leverage, circa, Khyber Pass, Gibraltar Rock, the Suez Canal, the Panama Canal. It may be only a rock, but I guess the ICJ’s verdict has given S’pore that all impt legal foothold over it. Now technically, Singapore can put a forward observation post over there, firstly, maybe to pre-empt enemy occupation in the event of a war, and then as a staging or launching pad for artillery and naval bases. This issue can also be seen in relation to moves by Thailand to cut the Isthmas of Kra to shorten the sea route between the East and West, but talking to civil engineers etc., this is still a pipe dream due to the lack of deep waters and the enormous costs to deepen it, not to mention the logistic nightmares to move supplies and materials there and back. Also, the Muslim minority problems there does not provide a safe environment (yet) to manoeuvre. Malaysia may also not be prepared to share the huge costs of the project, given its own internal problems.
I’m not sure what ikanrajah is saying at all. The first sentence itself is a mystery that needs to be unravelled. Can anyone tell me what he means? The rest of the post is riddled with inaccuracies as well. ‘All important legal foothold’? Don’t make me laugh. And why is ikanrajah talking about war? Who said anything about war? Although I’ve never been to Pedra Branca before, this is the first time I’ve heard it has a ‘Muslim minority’. Sounds intriguing. Why Muslim? Why not Malaysian, or Singaporean? Why must ikanrajah refer to the minority in Pedra Branca as ‘Muslim’?
Now if Malaysia is insist on opening the case every here and there then why the arbitration for ? Why did the Malaysia agree to go for arbitation then ? For fun and enjoyment ? If Malaysia win the case, they can ask Singapore to shut up and abide by the agreement, and when Malaysia lose the case, suddenly Malaysia said that they no longer want to subsidise for oil for Singaporean and all kind of craps, and then it can insist to reopen the case anytime they want.
Why kind of government is that ? In this aspect, I have to admit that Singapore government is a league apart from Malaysia. Many will despise the Malaysia government more and this scare away investors. I don’t think Singapore government need to worry about Malaysia government too much because the latter’s credibility and integrity are even doubtful. A country is only as good as its governance and credibility.
“In fact. the whole Asean is run by morons! Singapore just happen to be the smarter moron of them all! Ha ha ha ha!”
In the same way, some kangaroos jump higher than the others. Who can jump the highest win.
RH:
1. The ICJ is just another White Man kangaroo court. It obviously favoured an English-speaking LIEgime over a dark-skinned MUSLIM Malaysia.
2. If the decision had been a truly LEGAL and JUST and FAIR one, then either Malaysia should have won everything or Singapore should have won EVERYTHING, that is, all the little rocks in contention.
3. The fact that the ICJ gave 1 rock to Singapore and another to Malaysia proves that IT WAS PLAYING POLITICS, NOT LAW, CERTAINLY NOT JUSTICE. It is a 100% POLITICAL decision to give both sides something — not JUSTICE.
4. With this political decision, the ICJ has shamed itself and rendered its future pronouncements suspect. Nobody will want it to arbitrate in future. It has reduced its stature and viability as an institution to near 0.
5. However, Malaysia should appeal. It has a case in that the British, probably under the totally unscrupulous Tony BLAIR, maybe also Gordon BROWN, WITHHELD CRITICAL EVIDENCE AND DOCUMENTS DELIBERATELY TO SCREW UP MALAYSIA’s CASE. This is nothing short of the very serious crime of PERVERSION OF JUSTICE, thus leading to the wrong verdict.
6. Since Malaysia is appealing to overturn the earlier judgement, which both parties have already submitted and agreed to, there is no need for Singapore to agree to the Appeal. The Appeal should proceed whether Singapore agrees or not. If it does not defend, then Malaysia will be awarded the case and the new judgement, which will be binding.
7. The ICJ and Britain now have a second chance to Right the Wrongs. Lets hope they do the Right Thing this time.
8. The ICJ can also make a statement to ‘direct the British govt to hand over the critical documents Malaysia needs for its case’. [RH: Just added]
In my opinion, I think Singapore is wrong. Immediately after the ICJ ruling, BOTH Singapore AND Malaysia agreed to work on the details, INCLUDING delineating the boundaries.
Now Singapore UNILATERALLY announces it wants draw those boundaries? And even has the gall to say “our position has not changed”, when it wants to claim the EEZ?
Well, one of the issues was BECAUSE of the position held by Singapore on the EEZ then, which was not accepted by Malaysia, that both parties went to ICJ, isn’t it? It was also agreed that both parties would abide to WHATEVER the court decides.
So the court decided that PB goes to Singapore and Middle Rocks goes to Malaysia. The court decided that South Ledge would be awarded to neither explicitly.
So Singapore got PB but no the EEZ award. But that’s the court order, which Singapore HAS agreed to abide by, isn’t it?
In other words ANY marking of borders would have to be negotiated with Malaysia, right?
So why now the claim of the 12 nautical mile zone and EEZ?
Isn’t Singapore going back on its word and hence, breaking the good faith?
solo bear. i think you misunderstood the whole issue.
1. singapore DID NOT unilaterally declared its EEZ or TW, all the minister said in parliament was that singapore will ANNOUCE LATER its TW and EEZ, and where there is overlap claims with neighbours… it will be settled through negotiation.
2. Singapore didnt go to the ICJ with malaysia over the EEZ, its over pedra branca. the ICJ ruling clearly stated that the matters referred to the ICJ DOES NOT include delimitation of TW or EEZ,… only over the ownership of the islands and rocks.
3. any border markings surrounding pedra branca WILL BE negotiated with malaysia. BUT if negotiation fails or until negotiation is concluded, both side are NOT permitted to claim water beyond the MEDIAN lines draw from their respective territory under the UN law of the sea.
4. singapore AUTOMATICALLY gains 12 nautical miles of territorial water from any land or island it owns under UNCLOS, prior to the judgement of pedra branca, singapore claims a 3 nautical mile BUT reserved the right to claim 12 Nautical miles and EEZ at a later date eversince UNCLOS III was sign.
5. thus we are not breaking any good faith… but sadly, you appear to have been misled.
in fact… seeing from a different POV, singapore has been gracious to grant malaysia free usage of singapore’s TW and EEZ by limiting its claim to 3 nautical miles.
now… that singapore intends to claim back what is rightfully hers… malaysia understandably finds giving back all those rich waters very painful.
@RH.
i am sure the indonesians have the same opinion as yours with respect to ligitan and sipadan which malaysia won at the ICJ.
dont be a hypocrite… give indonesia back their 2 island if you really feel that the ICJ is unjust and unfair.
and with respect to the british withholding vital evidence… have you seen the evidence? no? yes? how could you accuse others to be as low as your leaders… not every nation on earth has a govt like yours…
Below taken from INTERNATIONAL COURT OF JUSTICE
2. Geographical location and characteristics
16. Pedra Branca/Pulau Batu Puteh is a granite island, measuring 137 m long, with an average width of 60 m and covering an area of about 8,560 sq m at low tide. It is situated at the eastern entrance of the Straits of Singapore, at the point where the Straits open up into the South China Sea. Pedra Branca/Pulau Batu Puteh is located at 1° 19′ 48″ N and 104° 24′ 27″ E. It lies approximately 24 nautical miles to the east of Singapore, 7.7 nautical miles to the south of the
Malaysian state of Johor and 7.6 nautical miles to the north of the Indonesian island of Bintan.
17. The names Pedra Branca and Batu Puteh mean “white rock” in Portuguese and Malay respectively. On the island stands Horsburgh lighthouse, which was erected in the middle of the nineteenth century.
18. Middle Rocks and South Ledge are the two maritime features closest to Pedra Branca/Pulau Batu Puteh. Middle Rocks is located 0.6 nautical miles to the south and consists of two clusters of small rocks about 250 m apart that are permanently above water and stand 0.6 to 1.2 m high. South Ledge, at 2.2 nautical miles to the south-south-west of Pedra Branca/Pulau Batu Puteh, is a rock formation only visible at low-tide.
Singapore indeed have right to claim EEZ as ICJ say pedra branca is an island and middle rock is an rocks.
Pedra Branca/Pulau Batu Puteh is a granite island,singapore right to claim EEZ according to UN international law.
Jumping Jack,
>>1. singapore DID NOT unilaterally declared its EEZ or TW, all the minister said in parliament was that singapore will ANNOUCE LATER its TW and EEZ, and where there is overlap claims with neighbours… it will be settled through negotiation.
>>
That is as good as stating your intention. Isn’t this bad faith?
>>2. Singapore didnt go to the ICJ with malaysia over the EEZ, its over pedra branca. the ICJ ruling clearly stated that the matters referred to the ICJ DOES NOT include delimitation of TW or EEZ,… only over the ownership of the islands and rocks.
>>
More bad faith. With the ICJ ruling, all other claims pertaining to what belongs to whom, were be nullified. The understanding is to abide by the award. EEZ is hence, dependent on the award. Trying to say that EEZ is not part of the award is pure bad faith.
>>3. any border markings surrounding pedra branca WILL BE negotiated with malaysia. BUT if negotiation fails or until negotiation is concluded, both side are NOT permitted to claim water beyond the MEDIAN lines draw from their respective territory under the UN law of the sea.
>>
That about ditches any announcement of intention about the EEZ, isn’t it? So why announce something that is agreed it should that is not legal?
>>4. singapore AUTOMATICALLY gains 12 nautical miles of territorial water from any land or island it owns under UNCLOS, prior to the judgement of pedra branca, singapore claims a 3 nautical mile BUT reserved the right to claim 12 Nautical miles and EEZ at a later date eversince UNCLOS III was sign.
>>
Automatically? How so? What about Middle Rocks? Malaysia owns that. If Pedra Branca gives Singapore 12 nautical miles, doesn’t Middle Rocks give Malaysia that 12 nautical miles too? What now?
At least Malaysia is not arrogant enough to make that contentious claim!
>>5. thus we are not breaking any good faith… but sadly, you appear to have been misled.
in fact… seeing from a different POV, singapore has been gracious to grant malaysia free usage of singapore’s TW and EEZ by limiting its claim to 3 nautical miles.
now… that singapore intends to claim back what is rightfully hers… malaysia understandably finds giving back all those rich waters very painful.
>>
It is bad faith true and true. Singapore wanted the EEZ all along, tried the “let’s-seek-third-party” ruling, got only half what it wanted, then now tries to claim the other half that was not given, ditching the third party award in the process.
Actually, I should not say that Singapore has shown bad faith. I should say the Singapore government has shown bad faith.
As a Singaporean, I am totally embarrassed by this ungentlemanly and hostile attitude by my government.
As a Singaporean,u should support singapore government claiming territorial waters and exclusive economic zones around pedra branca island. On world map,singapore is just a tiny red dot which does not create enough space for it people. It not about bad faith problem, it about ocean space which singapore government really need.