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	<title>Comments on: Young and old in S&#8217;pore want more political openness</title>
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	<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/</link>
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		<title>By: charles</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-15259</link>
		<dc:creator>charles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-15259</guid>
		<description>Hope the younger Singaporeans could really do something for themselves now and claim back what is originally ours, there is no more feel of being a local  Singaporean these days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hope the younger Singaporeans could really do something for themselves now and claim back what is originally ours, there is no more feel of being a local  Singaporean these days.</p>
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		<title>By: The Singapore Daily &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Roundup: Week 28</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14760</link>
		<dc:creator>The Singapore Daily &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Roundup: Week 28</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jul 2008 04:04:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14760</guid>
		<description>[...] should begin at the top - The boy who knew too much: The amazing disappearing ERP cards - TOC: Young and old in S’pore want more political openness - My Singapore News: Why 2 senior ministers and 2 DPMs? - catherinelim.sg: Overcoming doubts and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] should begin at the top &#8211; The boy who knew too much: The amazing disappearing ERP cards &#8211; TOC: Young and old in S’pore want more political openness &#8211; My Singapore News: Why 2 senior ministers and 2 DPMs? &#8211; catherinelim.sg: Overcoming doubts and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Black</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14666</link>
		<dc:creator>Black</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:57:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14666</guid>
		<description>Would the fact that a lot of Singaporeans being seen wearing black on National Day make any significant impact? Or for that matter will that simple act of choosing to wear black in itself carry any message across to the leaders that their callous and arrogant ways have roused up this amount of dissatisafction and frustration? Perhaps but what is not possible unless we try...

It will be the clearest demonstration of the power of our will .....which will be wielded by the free exercise of choice - be it of the colour of our clothes or for that matter, the party who he choose to lead the next government.  This, they can never take away from us and should be fearful of. 

If this government&#039;s does not wake up to the reality of the power of this simple and final vestige of Singaporeans&#039; freedom then perhaps they have not learnt the lesson that was swiftly dealt to the BN party in neighbouring Malaysia.

May we have a more gracious, equitable and compassionate country!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would the fact that a lot of Singaporeans being seen wearing black on National Day make any significant impact? Or for that matter will that simple act of choosing to wear black in itself carry any message across to the leaders that their callous and arrogant ways have roused up this amount of dissatisafction and frustration? Perhaps but what is not possible unless we try&#8230;</p>
<p>It will be the clearest demonstration of the power of our will &#8230;..which will be wielded by the free exercise of choice &#8211; be it of the colour of our clothes or for that matter, the party who he choose to lead the next government.  This, they can never take away from us and should be fearful of. </p>
<p>If this government&#8217;s does not wake up to the reality of the power of this simple and final vestige of Singaporeans&#8217; freedom then perhaps they have not learnt the lesson that was swiftly dealt to the BN party in neighbouring Malaysia.</p>
<p>May we have a more gracious, equitable and compassionate country!</p>
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		<title>By: sharon</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14547</link>
		<dc:creator>sharon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:57:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14547</guid>
		<description>yep, wearing black on national day is the least i could do against these monsters to show my displease.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yep, wearing black on national day is the least i could do against these monsters to show my displease.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14526</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 10:07:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14526</guid>
		<description>PC, do bring along a white flower to mourn the death of a nation because Singapore is no longer a &#039;nation&#039; but a business corporation run by FamiLee.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PC, do bring along a white flower to mourn the death of a nation because Singapore is no longer a &#8216;nation&#8217; but a business corporation run by FamiLee.</p>
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		<title>By: PC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14523</link>
		<dc:creator>PC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 09:08:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14523</guid>
		<description>In the 70&#039;s and 80&#039;s, I am OK with theose comment like Singaporean alway listen to the government etc. In the 90&#039;s, I just cannot take it when such comment on kiaxx and I also notice that changes are add burden to my fellow citizen and 
I will be wearing dark on this national day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the 70&#8242;s and 80&#8242;s, I am OK with theose comment like Singaporean alway listen to the government etc. In the 90&#8242;s, I just cannot take it when such comment on kiaxx and I also notice that changes are add burden to my fellow citizen and<br />
I will be wearing dark on this national day.</p>
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		<title>By: Observer (SG-HK)</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14499</link>
		<dc:creator>Observer (SG-HK)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 06:20:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14499</guid>
		<description>Dear &quot;Older Singaporean&quot;, let&#039;s be nice to the kids. Everyone of us will pass on, no exception. It is better to have them think independently than to be spoon fed all the time. A brain is a wonderful thing to waste. There will be a time to come for them to grow up, perhaps have children and they someday will reflect when these thoughts and words are uttered by another new kid in town.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear &#8220;Older Singaporean&#8221;, let&#8217;s be nice to the kids. Everyone of us will pass on, no exception. It is better to have them think independently than to be spoon fed all the time. A brain is a wonderful thing to waste. There will be a time to come for them to grow up, perhaps have children and they someday will reflect when these thoughts and words are uttered by another new kid in town.</p>
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		<title>By: Older Singaporean</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14493</link>
		<dc:creator>Older Singaporean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 04:38:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14493</guid>
		<description>Do take good care of yourself, SING LANG, and as you have to look out for yourself , I wish you a long life perhaps elsewhere as &quot;the grass is greener on the other side!&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do take good care of yourself, SING LANG, and as you have to look out for yourself , I wish you a long life perhaps elsewhere as &#8220;the grass is greener on the other side!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Sing Lang</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14484</link>
		<dc:creator>Sing Lang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 03:46:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14484</guid>
		<description>Forget about those stupid Older Singaporeans. Anyway, you are going to die soon. They can continue to reminisce about the good (ironic?).old days. The young should look out for themselves. Anyway, nothing worth looking out for here in Singapore for the future. Probably in a few years time, the casinos will ruin the economy and every Singaporean males will end up having to live off their wives and sisters who have to go overseas to work as maids or what the China gals are doing in Geylang today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Forget about those stupid Older Singaporeans. Anyway, you are going to die soon. They can continue to reminisce about the good (ironic?).old days. The young should look out for themselves. Anyway, nothing worth looking out for here in Singapore for the future. Probably in a few years time, the casinos will ruin the economy and every Singaporean males will end up having to live off their wives and sisters who have to go overseas to work as maids or what the China gals are doing in Geylang today.</p>
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		<title>By: Lim Chih-Yang</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14472</link>
		<dc:creator>Lim Chih-Yang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:50:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14472</guid>
		<description>Dear Gerald,

I do agree that thre ruling party has been authoritarian and believe that they knows best. They have also over the past few years displayed attitudes of petulance and arrogance.

Having said the above, the opposition in Singapore is no better. I am not dismissing all of the opposition but until the opposition get serious about forming the next goverment and forming a credible alternative, we will be left with a situation where even the least credible opposition can still garner double digit percentage of the votes.

Personally, the goverment&#039;s arrogant attiude has cheesed off many singaporeans.

regards
Chih-Yang</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Gerald,</p>
<p>I do agree that thre ruling party has been authoritarian and believe that they knows best. They have also over the past few years displayed attitudes of petulance and arrogance.</p>
<p>Having said the above, the opposition in Singapore is no better. I am not dismissing all of the opposition but until the opposition get serious about forming the next goverment and forming a credible alternative, we will be left with a situation where even the least credible opposition can still garner double digit percentage of the votes.</p>
<p>Personally, the goverment&#8217;s arrogant attiude has cheesed off many singaporeans.</p>
<p>regards<br />
Chih-Yang</p>
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		<title>By: Older Singaporean</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14469</link>
		<dc:creator>Older Singaporean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 00:46:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14469</guid>
		<description>Thank you all for your comments; I am indeed happy to saviour the diversity of passionate opinions which will augur well for the future generation. I will be moving on from this earth in due course and I can only wish all of you all and Singapore well, and with a special mention to TOC efforts in giving alternative views, and providing the airing platform for all including foreigners.

One last comment - salaries of President, Ministers, GLCs staff, civil servants....
When I joined the civil service as my first job some 30 years ago, I recalled that my pay was S$900 per month; I wish I were born again to try to enter the elite service again - at present salaries who really do not want to consider but the truth is many be be called but few are chosen, and how one is chosen to be a Minister may be the key to all the disquiet......&amp; I do feel for Catherine Lim but there is nothing anyone can do about it for now or the next 15 years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you all for your comments; I am indeed happy to saviour the diversity of passionate opinions which will augur well for the future generation. I will be moving on from this earth in due course and I can only wish all of you all and Singapore well, and with a special mention to TOC efforts in giving alternative views, and providing the airing platform for all including foreigners.</p>
<p>One last comment &#8211; salaries of President, Ministers, GLCs staff, civil servants&#8230;.<br />
When I joined the civil service as my first job some 30 years ago, I recalled that my pay was S$900 per month; I wish I were born again to try to enter the elite service again &#8211; at present salaries who really do not want to consider but the truth is many be be called but few are chosen, and how one is chosen to be a Minister may be the key to all the disquiet&#8230;&#8230;&amp; I do feel for Catherine Lim but there is nothing anyone can do about it for now or the next 15 years.</p>
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		<title>By: aquarius</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14463</link>
		<dc:creator>aquarius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 23:10:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14463</guid>
		<description>Assmbly of 4 person(s) is illegal. To protest, a permit is required. &quot;What&#039;s  to do?&quot;
Yes, we can do! Do not wait for ND, just wear black attire from today onwards like daily routine going to work in public to spread the silent words. Come on, Singaporeans! This is our choice to speak up. You want &quot;change&quot; &amp; remain &quot;unhappy &amp; frustrated&quot;. Don&#039;t be &quot;Kiase&quot;. 

&quot;Let us put our hands together, old and young, to bring back the lost humanities of yesteryears. To start off, tell everyone to celebrate National Day in dark with our own programmes, avoid any organised celebrations&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Assmbly of 4 person(s) is illegal. To protest, a permit is required. &#8220;What&#8217;s  to do?&#8221;<br />
Yes, we can do! Do not wait for ND, just wear black attire from today onwards like daily routine going to work in public to spread the silent words. Come on, Singaporeans! This is our choice to speak up. You want &#8220;change&#8221; &amp; remain &#8220;unhappy &amp; frustrated&#8221;. Don&#8217;t be &#8220;Kiase&#8221;. </p>
<p>&#8220;Let us put our hands together, old and young, to bring back the lost humanities of yesteryears. To start off, tell everyone to celebrate National Day in dark with our own programmes, avoid any organised celebrations&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Fever Guy</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14454</link>
		<dc:creator>Fever Guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14454</guid>
		<description>Absolute Power corrupts the mind. In all history, there are no fairy tale endings for dictators. Why because when absolute power starts to corrupt nothing can change you and what awaits is only your own downfalls. Therefore opening up may only prolong the dictator &#039;s rule for some time to come but the decay had set in already. Unless more is done, i dont see why people cant seek for change. As change will seek us after all. Fear will lose its power over us when the tidal wave of change hit us like the tsunami that ripple through over northern neighbor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Absolute Power corrupts the mind. In all history, there are no fairy tale endings for dictators. Why because when absolute power starts to corrupt nothing can change you and what awaits is only your own downfalls. Therefore opening up may only prolong the dictator &#8216;s rule for some time to come but the decay had set in already. Unless more is done, i dont see why people cant seek for change. As change will seek us after all. Fear will lose its power over us when the tidal wave of change hit us like the tsunami that ripple through over northern neighbor.</p>
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		<title>By: Tan Ah Kow</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14442</link>
		<dc:creator>Tan Ah Kow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:00:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14442</guid>
		<description>Gerald (32):

I have worked in the so-called Civil Service for a short while about a year before I left to work overseas. I was not a degree holder so I was I didn&#039;t have as much privileges then but nevertheless, it was quite a stress-free existence. In fact compared to my current life overseas now, I would say my time in the Civil Service was really stress-free. All I had to do was to obey orders and pretend to work and you get paid! Mind you it was quite well paid too relatively speaking.

In fact my role even at the clerical level was no responsibility at all. The public come to me with a problem, I just give standard template answers or I just bump the problem up. But why did I give up such an ideal stress free lifestyle?

Well it was precisely because I know I can get the stress free lifestyle at a price -- i.e. by not questioning authority. I also know that the more I stayed on the more I enjoy the lifestyle the harder it is for more me to contemplate an alternative one. Hence, the fear factor seep in me. Just like so many of my ex-colleague -- some very high paying ones -- that stayed on. They have become so fearful of loosing their jobs that they feel they have to go with the flow.

Incidentally, I now have some Zimbabwean friends who were, let&#039;s say ex-civil servant in their own country, and when you hear their story about those that stayed on in their own country, you will find a not so comforting parallel to Singapore. Like in the Singapore context, the civil servants in their country still, despite the turmoil in the country, enjoy a very comfortable existence. I was invited to a friend&#039;s parent and mind you when I was there it was so idyllic that you didn&#039;t know problem existed. One thing for sure, is their existence is so tied up with Mugabe that it was understandable that there is a palpable fear of change. Which also explains why people around Mugabe is so willing to carry out his orders without questions.

The big question for Singapore, therefore is this: if fear is so palpable in the inner circle of the PAP, what hope is there for change? And if so much fear is invested in LKY holding the reins of power, why would anyone want an more political openness? For LKY, what incentive is there for him to want an open political system, when fear of him is such as useful tool? Would LKY commit political suicide by opening up?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gerald (32):</p>
<p>I have worked in the so-called Civil Service for a short while about a year before I left to work overseas. I was not a degree holder so I was I didn&#8217;t have as much privileges then but nevertheless, it was quite a stress-free existence. In fact compared to my current life overseas now, I would say my time in the Civil Service was really stress-free. All I had to do was to obey orders and pretend to work and you get paid! Mind you it was quite well paid too relatively speaking.</p>
<p>In fact my role even at the clerical level was no responsibility at all. The public come to me with a problem, I just give standard template answers or I just bump the problem up. But why did I give up such an ideal stress free lifestyle?</p>
<p>Well it was precisely because I know I can get the stress free lifestyle at a price &#8212; i.e. by not questioning authority. I also know that the more I stayed on the more I enjoy the lifestyle the harder it is for more me to contemplate an alternative one. Hence, the fear factor seep in me. Just like so many of my ex-colleague &#8212; some very high paying ones &#8212; that stayed on. They have become so fearful of loosing their jobs that they feel they have to go with the flow.</p>
<p>Incidentally, I now have some Zimbabwean friends who were, let&#8217;s say ex-civil servant in their own country, and when you hear their story about those that stayed on in their own country, you will find a not so comforting parallel to Singapore. Like in the Singapore context, the civil servants in their country still, despite the turmoil in the country, enjoy a very comfortable existence. I was invited to a friend&#8217;s parent and mind you when I was there it was so idyllic that you didn&#8217;t know problem existed. One thing for sure, is their existence is so tied up with Mugabe that it was understandable that there is a palpable fear of change. Which also explains why people around Mugabe is so willing to carry out his orders without questions.</p>
<p>The big question for Singapore, therefore is this: if fear is so palpable in the inner circle of the PAP, what hope is there for change? And if so much fear is invested in LKY holding the reins of power, why would anyone want an more political openness? For LKY, what incentive is there for him to want an open political system, when fear of him is such as useful tool? Would LKY commit political suicide by opening up?</p>
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		<title>By: Gerald</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14439</link>
		<dc:creator>Gerald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:59:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14439</guid>
		<description>Tan Ah Kow (17), you have to work in the civil service to know the meaning of the fear of authority. The Ministers are held in such high esteem that no one dares to question them, except the most senior mavericks (who are few and far between). Bring LKY into the picture, and civil servants are reduced to a bunch of quivering yes-men. So it&#039;s easier said than done to not go along with the wishes of their political masters.

Overseas Singaporean said:

&lt;i&gt;The PAP today gets its votes from 3 groups of Singaporeans: 1) Those who are grateful to them for bringing Singapore to what it is today, ignoring the fact that PAP ver. 1965 is a very different beast from PAP ver. 2008. 2) Apathetic younger Singaporeans who don’t know who else to vote for and vote for them since they’re the most recognizable. A twisted for of “brand recognition” (I know a few of these types) and 3) People who don’t like them but vote for them out of an irrational fear that they or someone they know working in the civil service might get a midnight invitation for kopi even though all involved are but small fries in the greater scheme of things.&lt;/i&gt;

Excellent observation and spot on! I&#039;d add that (1) and (3) are often the same people. There are older Singaporeans who curse and swear at the govt in private, but would not even dare to be seen at an opposition rally (I actually know someone like that).

A lot of it is to do with the lack of (non-partisan) political education that we&#039;ve all received, both from school as well as the media. We don&#039;t know our rights, and so are easily manipulated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tan Ah Kow (17), you have to work in the civil service to know the meaning of the fear of authority. The Ministers are held in such high esteem that no one dares to question them, except the most senior mavericks (who are few and far between). Bring LKY into the picture, and civil servants are reduced to a bunch of quivering yes-men. So it&#8217;s easier said than done to not go along with the wishes of their political masters.</p>
<p>Overseas Singaporean said:</p>
<p><i>The PAP today gets its votes from 3 groups of Singaporeans: 1) Those who are grateful to them for bringing Singapore to what it is today, ignoring the fact that PAP ver. 1965 is a very different beast from PAP ver. 2008. 2) Apathetic younger Singaporeans who don’t know who else to vote for and vote for them since they’re the most recognizable. A twisted for of “brand recognition” (I know a few of these types) and 3) People who don’t like them but vote for them out of an irrational fear that they or someone they know working in the civil service might get a midnight invitation for kopi even though all involved are but small fries in the greater scheme of things.</i></p>
<p>Excellent observation and spot on! I&#8217;d add that (1) and (3) are often the same people. There are older Singaporeans who curse and swear at the govt in private, but would not even dare to be seen at an opposition rally (I actually know someone like that).</p>
<p>A lot of it is to do with the lack of (non-partisan) political education that we&#8217;ve all received, both from school as well as the media. We don&#8217;t know our rights, and so are easily manipulated.</p>
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		<title>By: Observer(SG-HK)</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14434</link>
		<dc:creator>Observer(SG-HK)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:48:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14434</guid>
		<description>I can almost hear the arguments coming in that &quot;that the western classic &quot;a term MM always like to make when asked about democracy in press interview, it does not work for Singapore. How is it of the certainty if it was not even given a chance to take of? Isn&#039;t this the decision of the Singapore people? Singapore should be decided by Singaporeans?

I may be old but I am not deaf and brain dead or brain washed or whatever you want to call it. We old people had tolerated long enough. We fully understand the process why this and that needs to be in place in those days. I have absolutely no problem with that even though we realized it&#039;s authocratic. We have just got to bit the bullet then and move on. Where have the conscience of the uprgiht Lee gone to when he was fighting so hard for us against possible threat of communism taking over, riots, the useless brits and so on.

Do you know how much it hurts inside when you hear other citizenry labeling you kiasi, kiasu, bo dan, grew up with nanny, sheeps..and all sorts of stigma when you are overseas? It is not any easier living and working overseas, the sufferings is no less than what is happening on the ground in Singapore. For god sake, I am a human being not a robot. We are all human beings with feelings.

I could not articulate my feelings better like other well educated ones. Neither am I well educated enough to enter politics and I am not one that likes to be involved in politics. We know our abilities. I think many of my generation people are just plain stupid. But when things really goes overboard, it is every citizens duty to stand up and be counted. Do you think many would like to end up in a warring state? We are civilized enough to learn from history. All we asked for is a little dignity to allow us to make our decision for our life. Not for me, may be for my generation, the young, the Singapore who can live to see this. Just let me have a peaceful living. I do not need millions to survive. If I can survive on just a single loaf of bread with water for a week, I certainly can do it again and again, nothing matters anymore. 

Doesn&#039;t this quote gives you a reflection of Singaporeans?

“We discovered that peace at any price is no peace at all. We discovered that life at any price has no value whatever; that life is nothing without the privileges, the prides, the rights, the joys which make it worth living, and also worth giving. And we also discovered that there is something more hideous, more atrocious than war or than death; and that is to live in fear.”

Enough have been said and I will never ever going to repeat it, ever again. So please don&#039;t ask this question of what we really want to change. No intention of insult. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can almost hear the arguments coming in that &#8220;that the western classic &#8220;a term MM always like to make when asked about democracy in press interview, it does not work for Singapore. How is it of the certainty if it was not even given a chance to take of? Isn&#8217;t this the decision of the Singapore people? Singapore should be decided by Singaporeans?</p>
<p>I may be old but I am not deaf and brain dead or brain washed or whatever you want to call it. We old people had tolerated long enough. We fully understand the process why this and that needs to be in place in those days. I have absolutely no problem with that even though we realized it&#8217;s authocratic. We have just got to bit the bullet then and move on. Where have the conscience of the uprgiht Lee gone to when he was fighting so hard for us against possible threat of communism taking over, riots, the useless brits and so on.</p>
<p>Do you know how much it hurts inside when you hear other citizenry labeling you kiasi, kiasu, bo dan, grew up with nanny, sheeps..and all sorts of stigma when you are overseas? It is not any easier living and working overseas, the sufferings is no less than what is happening on the ground in Singapore. For god sake, I am a human being not a robot. We are all human beings with feelings.</p>
<p>I could not articulate my feelings better like other well educated ones. Neither am I well educated enough to enter politics and I am not one that likes to be involved in politics. We know our abilities. I think many of my generation people are just plain stupid. But when things really goes overboard, it is every citizens duty to stand up and be counted. Do you think many would like to end up in a warring state? We are civilized enough to learn from history. All we asked for is a little dignity to allow us to make our decision for our life. Not for me, may be for my generation, the young, the Singapore who can live to see this. Just let me have a peaceful living. I do not need millions to survive. If I can survive on just a single loaf of bread with water for a week, I certainly can do it again and again, nothing matters anymore. </p>
<p>Doesn&#8217;t this quote gives you a reflection of Singaporeans?</p>
<p>“We discovered that peace at any price is no peace at all. We discovered that life at any price has no value whatever; that life is nothing without the privileges, the prides, the rights, the joys which make it worth living, and also worth giving. And we also discovered that there is something more hideous, more atrocious than war or than death; and that is to live in fear.”</p>
<p>Enough have been said and I will never ever going to repeat it, ever again. So please don&#8217;t ask this question of what we really want to change. No intention of insult. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: Tan Ah Kow</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14433</link>
		<dc:creator>Tan Ah Kow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14433</guid>
		<description>Observer(SG-HK):

I am sure if you pool everyone in Singapore you will find a mood for wanting different things. Just like you and I have our wants. But the question is whether there is such a want driven by a large enough body of Singaporean that represent wanting a change from the status quo, namely wanting to throw out the PAP?

Take the UK for example. You can see pointers to wanting change without being hobbled by so-called &quot;give credit&quot; mentality. Churchill may have help won the war but he lost the election immediately after the war? Why did the British people not wanting to give Churchill credit by voting him back in? After all &quot;he&quot; won the war didn&#039;t he?

You see Churchill represented an era that was totally out-of-synch with the real world. He wanted to keep the empire whereas the British people want a change from the old order. More importantly, the British people themselves are prepared to make the change by voting for a different administration. Thus proving that the change can only happen if people want it and not when the government grants it.

Is that happening in Singapore context?

Frankly, I don&#039;t see that to being the case. Otherwise, groups like the SDP and others would have been hail as heroes or agents of change right now. And the moderate elements wouldn&#039;t be so quick to embrace the status quo to be seen as credible.

Ah the next I am going to hear is complain that the &quot;opposition&quot; party is too weak. That is why there is no choice but to go with the PAP. Or hence, you commonly hear all this plea and not demand for the PAP to be softer. But then again, if people want change they should working towards it and not expecting others to do so. 

The UK Labour party at the time was weak compared to the achievement of Churchill&#039;s conservative party but they still defeated a party that had a track record of saving the nation!  How did they do it? Well the British people was prepared to support it. Very simple.

If Singaporean wanted change it could happen now, no need to wait until LKY leave the scene. The &quot;reformist&quot; in the PAP could simply gang up and tell LKY to step down. The younger journalist in the Straits Times could leave the paper and start an alternative media. Members of the civil services could avoid being so high handed with PAP opponents.

Frankly, I don&#039;t see change happening until the Singapore really descended to the state not unlike Zimbabwe before we can hope for any change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Observer(SG-HK):</p>
<p>I am sure if you pool everyone in Singapore you will find a mood for wanting different things. Just like you and I have our wants. But the question is whether there is such a want driven by a large enough body of Singaporean that represent wanting a change from the status quo, namely wanting to throw out the PAP?</p>
<p>Take the UK for example. You can see pointers to wanting change without being hobbled by so-called &#8220;give credit&#8221; mentality. Churchill may have help won the war but he lost the election immediately after the war? Why did the British people not wanting to give Churchill credit by voting him back in? After all &#8220;he&#8221; won the war didn&#8217;t he?</p>
<p>You see Churchill represented an era that was totally out-of-synch with the real world. He wanted to keep the empire whereas the British people want a change from the old order. More importantly, the British people themselves are prepared to make the change by voting for a different administration. Thus proving that the change can only happen if people want it and not when the government grants it.</p>
<p>Is that happening in Singapore context?</p>
<p>Frankly, I don&#8217;t see that to being the case. Otherwise, groups like the SDP and others would have been hail as heroes or agents of change right now. And the moderate elements wouldn&#8217;t be so quick to embrace the status quo to be seen as credible.</p>
<p>Ah the next I am going to hear is complain that the &#8220;opposition&#8221; party is too weak. That is why there is no choice but to go with the PAP. Or hence, you commonly hear all this plea and not demand for the PAP to be softer. But then again, if people want change they should working towards it and not expecting others to do so. </p>
<p>The UK Labour party at the time was weak compared to the achievement of Churchill&#8217;s conservative party but they still defeated a party that had a track record of saving the nation!  How did they do it? Well the British people was prepared to support it. Very simple.</p>
<p>If Singaporean wanted change it could happen now, no need to wait until LKY leave the scene. The &#8220;reformist&#8221; in the PAP could simply gang up and tell LKY to step down. The younger journalist in the Straits Times could leave the paper and start an alternative media. Members of the civil services could avoid being so high handed with PAP opponents.</p>
<p>Frankly, I don&#8217;t see change happening until the Singapore really descended to the state not unlike Zimbabwe before we can hope for any change.</p>
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		<title>By: Elfred</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14429</link>
		<dc:creator>Elfred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:42:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14429</guid>
		<description>Just talk cock...
The old talk cock, never want cock up when they young...
Now they old, tell young cock up, and they go on talk cock...
The young cock up, they cock the young...
Basically, opening up political scene is as good as opening up a safari...
If Singaporeans think, of cos good.
If Singaproeans can think...
Why open a safari when you can&#039;t tell a tigeress from your wife...?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just talk cock&#8230;<br />
The old talk cock, never want cock up when they young&#8230;<br />
Now they old, tell young cock up, and they go on talk cock&#8230;<br />
The young cock up, they cock the young&#8230;<br />
Basically, opening up political scene is as good as opening up a safari&#8230;<br />
If Singaporeans think, of cos good.<br />
If Singaproeans can think&#8230;<br />
Why open a safari when you can&#8217;t tell a tigeress from your wife&#8230;?</p>
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		<title>By: jack</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14426</link>
		<dc:creator>jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14426</guid>
		<description>Elite uncaring face leader to be open for change ???? Siao Ah !!! you people !!!everything is working so fine with them, what make you so special that they will ever want to change??? Wake up lah. change to make their own life &amp; career &amp; income unstable. if u are in their position would u do that ? NOW , IT&quot;S THEIR OWN INTEREST AGAINST THE PUBLIC INTEREST !!!!! who do you think is more important to them basing on their pass track record... Forget it, Just leave this sick place if you can. Let the leaders and their croonies rule over the PR &amp; FT with all singaporean out of the picture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Elite uncaring face leader to be open for change ???? Siao Ah !!! you people !!!everything is working so fine with them, what make you so special that they will ever want to change??? Wake up lah. change to make their own life &amp; career &amp; income unstable. if u are in their position would u do that ? NOW , IT&#8221;S THEIR OWN INTEREST AGAINST THE PUBLIC INTEREST !!!!! who do you think is more important to them basing on their pass track record&#8230; Forget it, Just leave this sick place if you can. Let the leaders and their croonies rule over the PR &amp; FT with all singaporean out of the picture.</p>
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		<title>By: Observer(SG-HK)</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/07/young-and-old-in-spore-want-more-political-openness/comment-page-1/#comment-14422</link>
		<dc:creator>Observer(SG-HK)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:03:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=916#comment-14422</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s more.

1) People elected Independent auditing body - for check and balance. Equal to governing body.

2) Complete independent  Judiarcy System where CJs are elected by the people not by appointment (i.e. Court of Appeal).

3) Impeachment Rule where citizens elected stateman have the right to invoke.

That&#039;s already quite a handful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s more.</p>
<p>1) People elected Independent auditing body &#8211; for check and balance. Equal to governing body.</p>
<p>2) Complete independent  Judiarcy System where CJs are elected by the people not by appointment (i.e. Court of Appeal).</p>
<p>3) Impeachment Rule where citizens elected stateman have the right to invoke.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s already quite a handful.</p>
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