As someone who is seriously considering leaving this place (and is currently applying to a lot of overseas jobs to do so), I sympathise with your article. I fall into the married with children category.

The main reason I am leaving is because I find the regulations here oppressive. Our government makes rules without regard for how citizens feel about the rules. The court of appeal is the government, the very people who make the rules, and so generally, as an individual you cannot get your way. This versus other countries where one can appeal a regulation elsewhere. Heck, I can’t even vote in my own country!

Reservist is also a burden. Can our government please wake up to the fact that employers do not care that reservist is a requirement? Even if we go on reservist, we are still required to do our work. Things like the various IPPT related activities take up peoples’ time.

Really, in the end, its a simple equation. I do X amount of work here or in a foreign country. I get Y benefits here, I get Z benefits elsewhere. If Z>Y+cost of moving, I will leave. Guess what Singapore? Because of your oppressive rules, Y is so small here, that leaving is a no-brainer.

It was never a Singapore Dream, just the Great Singapore Illusion…

A house you can buy, yes. BUT, you pay probably 130% of the purchase price including the interest for 20 to 30 years AND which can be taken back by the government after 99 years in any case.

A national savings program for retirement (CPF) with a catch of ’shifting’ retirement age.

Low taxes, yes. BUT every non-elite Singaporean is simply a digit in the system AND once you are no longer productive, you cease to carry any value whatsoever.

It is no wonder that the more evolved generation of today treats Singapore the way it has always treated its (original) citizens – use for personal/economic gain and throw it aside after it has served its purpose.

Karma comes full circle?

Dear Dhamendra,

Good take, well written and true to the feelings of those citizenry who felt oppressed but can’t do a thing about it.

Let’s see how well the current government can make Singapore really livable in the eyes of these concerned citizenry and not in the context of the elites and the like minded who doesn’t give a hoot about the less fortunate.

there is a difference between leaving this place for good & living outside this place for good.

singapore is too expensive & stressful for us. also poor quality of living (unless you have monies). but then we have to admit that this is still a good place to bring up & educate our kids and to earn our salaries (although ours are peanuts compared to our ministers’). so far, all my friends and cohorts are discussing where they would like to retire outside singapore. in reality, even if we retire elsewhere, most of us would still have to come back once in a while (i guess after hearing their thoughts) because majority of us cannot just give up on our citizenship as yet and we also cannot have dual citizenship (government don’t allow) & cannot over-stay the visa of another country.

interestingly i like to share some thoughts from one of my breakfast khakis:

in 1980 at 30 years old, you ask me to defend singapore, i say yes immediately

in 1990 at 40 years old, you ask me again, i ask my boss as i have to keep my job to feed my family and pay my bills (including my highly price CEOed car and HDB resale flat)

in 2000 at 50 years old, you ask me again, i say later maybe because i pay more bills (for my kids’ tertiary education and my highly priced condo)

in 2008 at 58 years old, you ask me again, i say defend for what ? for who ? i am selling my condo & moving to 3 room flat, my kids are studying and working overseas. i cannot be fighting for those rich people and their big expensive houses in singapore right ?

i’ve been living outside Singapore for 8 years now, and the only thing that links me back to singapore are: family, friends and food.

i tend to see that in my everyday life, it seems to benefit someone else rather than myself.

While there are so many things that make Singapore as a country great, its the nitty gritty that riles me more, and making me not wanting to stay.

1. CPF and the way they screw around with MY hard-earned money for their benefit.

2. reservist and how they seem to think i’m more of a soldier than a civilian. exit permits, recalls, ICTs, IPPT, somehow i think the SAF has become a selfish monster…why does reservist hamper MY life as a civilian? those well-paid scholar officers scheming of the next big thing to get their promotion, while not thinking about the common soldier/reservist. and these guys get cushy jobs when they leave the SAF. SAF also being the most overtly racist govt organisation in Singapore. i no longer have an idea who’ll i’ll be defending if war ever comes – those snotty officers, this current govt?

3. which brings me to this scholarship system and elitism. it starts with SAP schools – there could not be any more racially elitist education programme than SAP.

4. How laws are passed. The latest thing that pi*sed me off – the printing of Singapore Duty Paid on every single stick of cigarette. And they aim to fine people $500 if they are caught with duty unpaid cigarettes. In other countries, the govt dont penalise the citizens. they will try to do better to arrest the smugglers and the people selling contraband. But only in Singapore, citizens get penalised. Why? becuase the govt is losing millions of dollars daily due to contraband ciggies. its about the MONEY…. and they take the easy way out. Recall that this new law comes from the Home Ministry – the same folks that let Mas Selamat get out. I did defend Wong Kan Seng on this blog when people were calling for his resignation. I changed my mind. This guy is lazy and resting on his laurels. and u know what – I DONT EVEN SMOKE.

5. the GST raise. they made us swallow the story that its to help the poor. here’s another big insult to my intelligence.

6. COE, ERP and public transport. i seem to think that all this is just to make money – and not really to provide a world-class transport system. the people who plans COE doesnt seem to work together with the people who came up with ERP. and i wonder who got a raise for coming up with the most complex taxi fare system in the world.

7. GRCs and how it changes every election. rather than focus on winning the hearts and minds of the citizenry through serving the public, they come up with these tactics to make sure they win – “to overcome any freak results”… so what if there was a freak result? if an opposition goes in, he/she has to prove they can represent the people. if they are useless, they’ll be booted out in the next election.

i could go on and on and on…but i think i take the easy way out – and not return to singapore.

[...] (After some thought, I decided not to protect this post, because I shouldn’t care that people may judge. Too bad if they don’t see my point, but I know there are many who share my thoughts. See here.) [...]

aygee hits right on the spot with his comment. Gov makes smoking overseas cigs a crime just cos they don’t get to collect $ from the tax. I didn’t know smoking cheaper cigs is harmful & bad to the society compared to smoking tax-paid cigs. Collecting insane amount of taxes from cigs & fining people who smoke cheap cigs? That sounds really fair.

Many locals slog their lives away working, till old age, either to make ends meet, or they’ve been brainwashed by the local media or gov subconsciously to keep working & working as long as they are able to breathe. Most likely than not, it is a vain attempt to keep up with ever-increasing cost of living in Singapore.

It’s like a death trap. You get a good education, you get a reasonable-paying job, & you can afford a car. You go ahead & buy one. What happens? Relentless increase in cost of driving. You finally decided that you can afford a baby. What happens next? Cost of general living skyrockets & you have to slog away at work to support your child, to such an extent that having to support a child is a really really hard chore! Have more children? Pfft. What do you do? Keep on slogging your life away to make ends meet! Does anyone want a life like that?

It’s not like I feel mighty comfortable living here. One word, “crowded”. This simple word does not seem that simple & innocent after all once you stepped outta your home. C’mon, i need my living space! I need to breathe!

This country is a self-serving place for the elites. No common man would want to call it his home here for what he has seen going on. I for one would leave at the first opportunity.

Reading from above comments, this title will be more appropiate.

From Singapore Dream to Singapore Nightmare: Fleeing The City of Possibilities

Migrate if you must or have to. There are ups and downs wherever you go. It is more of whether you can adjust to the country you go to.The grass looks greener on the other side definitely.
I lived in Sg for a good deal many years and somehow I don’t think that it is that bad nor do I think it is that fantastic over here – but I make the best out of things and enjoyed living here. I have a house, a piece of land with fruit trees, plant lot of roses, veg, etc… I got my own garage to hammer things about, I can afford as many cars as I want (btw some of the cars are from Sg), etc.
I can go fishing on weekend, see a show, eat out, etc and so on.

And I am earning about the same as when I was in Sg.
then I can only afford a 125cc GN suzuki.
Be happy – you have the right to live happy.
Migrate if you must or have to…..cheers.

“Singapore Dream?” what is that? Oh lordi lord, It’s beginning to have that numbing effect. There are those who wished to leave for the same reasons cited in the article but because of financial issues as well as academically not qualified to apply for PR status in another country where the rules are more lax and humane oriented and yes SPACE.

I think this trend will go on for as long as people felt they are not genuinely taken care for. So, for most feeling oppress now and can’t do a thing about it, I think their motto for the “NEW” Singapore Dream now should be:

Work hard, save all you can, retire somewhere where you can continue to pursuie your life long hobby when time is up.

There are some young friends who can’t wait to leave when they find an opportunity or the means to do so. It is usually the family and friends that are holding them back.

Migrating can be a costly affair if you have a family in tow. Be sure to have enough savings and research on whether your education and experience is relevant to get you a job. The market overseas isn’t too rosy. Do your research. Having realistic expectations of the differences in costs and lifestyle would help to avoid disappointment .

I agree with Gus. Feel free to migrate if you like but it’s good to be well prepared.

Home is where the heart is : it could be where you’re born as well as where you reside.

I’m 19 this year and I’m already planning to leave this country in the next 10 or 20 years.

This country I feel is too stressful to live in and very materialistic.

“The Singapore Dream is one that many wish to achieve” This is the funniest joke in history…

I am a Singaporean but have worked in many cities over the past 15 years – London, Seoul, Sydney, NY, HK, Tokyo etc. Right now, I am in singapore and I cannot be happier. In these cities, life is even more difficult – the commute is longer, costs is higher and (with the exception of Sydney), the homes are smaller etc.

G171, like others have said, no place is perfect. Yes, Singapore could arguably have a shorter commute, but to what expense? Yes, costs and taxes are higher in tokyo or NY or London, but the pay is also higher. there’s also social security. there’s also free medical in some instances.

some of the leaders need to change their “siege” mentality – that the world is not out to do us over, some folks are inclined to choose the opposition simply because you’re not doing a good job – its not about a different ideology or manifesto.

To change this, just start thinking about the people – not businesses, not about making money – but the people. Stop screwing around with our money. If the GIC and Temasek makes money from all the investments, why are we still getting savings rates for our CPF? if a fund manager can give me more than savings rate, why dont u allow me to do this myself?

just please, treat us more like citizens. treat us with more respect and intelligence – the GST, the recent WP vs PAP bicycle event – come on, we’re not stupid.

otherwise, Singapore no doubt is a great place to live. thats why expats love singapore. thats why i love it every time i go home to visit. i just dont want to stay – because of the way i’m being screwed around.

/// 2) Ganga on September 25th, 2008 10.28 am

It was never a Singapore Dream, just the Great Singapore Illusion…

A house you can buy, yes. BUT, you pay probably 130% of the purchase price including the interest for 20 to 30 years AND which can be taken back by the government after 99 years in any case. ///

Ganga – certain gripes are justifiable – but this isn’t one of them.

If you don’t like a leasehold property, then buy a freehold property and it will be yours for life.

If you buy a 99-year leasehold property, the same will apply whether it is Malaysia, Indonesia or Thailand, or any country with leasehold property. Worse, in some of the neighbouring countries, the lease is only 60 years or 30 years.

And what’s this nonsense about paying 130% of the purchase price? Tell me, which country gives you zero-interest mortgage loan for 20-30 years? Haven’t you heard of the price of money? You want to pay only 100% of the purchase price? Sure – pay in cash. FYI, you will have to pay 180% of the purchase price, assuming interest rate at 3% for 20 years.

18) aygee on September 25th, 2008 4.09 pm

Cool down my friend. Let people (who have the capability to move) make up their own mind. Don’t get so worked up la.

Oh, I might have forgotten “Old habbit Dies Hard”. So, for some people like our friend, material well being is greater over healthy humane living. They probably preferred to be managed and let someone decide for them and be told what to do..blah blah… hey hey, you have got to give credit to the system, it had thought them well.

I agree. If people want to leave, they’ll find a way.

There’s no perfect world and there’ll be places in other countries that will suit some people’s preference more than others.

But if people want to come back, I think Singapore and Singaporeans should be generous enough to welcome these people back.

It is not that the Moon in other countries is brighter or rounder, it’s not that the grass elsewhere is greener nor is living elsewhere makes one lives longer. But it should be more meaningful.

One simply should not live a mechanical life driven and manipulated by the Power that lords over us in everything. We once have our native cultures, our oriental insignias which just decades ago our predecessors fought hard to defend and protect from alien influences. It is sheer irony that the very values that our earlier generations had fought so hard to protect have almost got totally ruined in the hands of an English Educated ‘Oriental Gentleman’.

In SIN Galore, greed is good(positive), justified and promulgated through State Medias as the Driving Force for entrepreneurial ambitions. Selfishness is righteous as it will prevent crutch mentality and vices are not sinful if they contribute to economic growths. It is also justifiable and fine to tax the poor to help the poor.

It is not as if we are starving or having to beg for a living, no, we are not, BUT just that we are suffering from depravations of human feelings, sensibilities, reasonabilities, logics, conscience and other humane characters.

We humanity, just simply needs humanities and should not live like machines. Go, find a place not just to breathe, smell the flowers, be with nature and most importantly, live like a human.

patriot

“21) lim on September 25th, 2008 6.31 pm

But if people want to come back, I think Singapore and Singaporeans should be generous enough to welcome these people back.”

Ah Lim, good statement. We are on the same page on this. Keep it up.

Aygee,

I would not take issue with WP vs PAP cycle event. There are many ways for WP to raise awareness just that they love to copy PAP ’s method of raising awareness which you cant compete with ruling party. Take SDP for example, a simple walk around NTU and NUS with pamplets and conversation brings out immediate response and publicity. Therefore what WP does it so outdated, and they are still living in stone edge when it comes to internet usage to raise awareness. WP is doom as long as the current management still runs it.

As for Singapore Dream, i not so sure that it ever existed in the first place. I never felt that Singapore will be a good place to retire. Given a choice i rather quit Singapore. Unless there is political change happening, where the self censor, self praise, self righteous, overpaid, underperform government loses mandate, that dream might reappear. This dream is dead. Just look at Transport chrages raised without collecting feedbacks from public, AVA slow response to China milk scare, FEER loses court case and ban from selling in Singapore, GIC saying they still have alot of cash(taxpayer monies) to buy toxic banks, there is no mention of temasek ’s Merril Lynch bought over by BOA and what happened to our 14% stake? So much more issues our dear Godly PAP just brush aside. When economy is going down hill they just push the blame to US sub prime and declared that GDP is lower than estimates. They are overpaid and just like everyone else helpless in the face of a potentially big crisis looming nearer each day. So why PAY them MILLIONS?

FG

Chinese Teochew always said: “take a sit wherever is cool.” Migration is not a new idea and not a big issue.

Thousands years ago, Tibetan had moved from China to North & South America. How they cross over the pacific ocean?

I have been to OSU events in London and mingled with senior civil servants who organise these events. It is no doubt an attempt to woo Singaporeans back but it is nevertheless disgusting because:

1. It reminded overseas Singaporeans that ordinary Singaporeans in Singapore will never have the opportunity to mingle and exchange pointers with PAP MPs and senior civil servants in an open forum-cum-dinner organised by OSU. They only see you when they want to.

2. When questioned by overseas Singaporeans on domestic policy on manpower, NS, CPF and election, the PAP MPs and senior civil servants chose to keep quiet or respond with an irrelevant reply. The supposedly top dogs in public office and civil service have completely discounted that Singaporeans leave Singapore because they have grown sick and tired of discrepancies and lack of fairness and consistency in Singapore.

3. Unlike overseas Singaporeans, FTs generally do not have any political or social expectation that the government should fulfil because they are living outside the system (by being handsomely remunerated for working in Singapore) or they have a failsafe mechanism – they return to their home country. Overseas Singaporeans can sense that FT are more valued than overseas Singaporeans because of their lack of expectation.

The only overseas Singaporeans who would want to come back are those that are confident they can live outside the rules set up by PAP, unless they have something passionate to return to Singapore for.

I think what is important is that the average Singaporean (and more so for a below-average Singaporean like myself) is not envious of another going on a vacation or retirement. Let those who re going to take a break take a break, else you’ll never get yours when you need one.

1) Anonymous on September 25th, 2008 10.03 am
———————————————————————

Most singaporeans migrate to nice places like Australia etc.

These countries have many human and natural resources.
To qualify to be their citizen is not easy. They have strict criteria for new citizen applicants. They choose people with the skills they need more badly. Professional experience and credentials are scrutinised. I kudos to you for your attempt to live in a place of your choice. Hey, like they say, welcome foreigners to migrate to Singapore. Likewise, I assume the country of your choice would think the same and regard you as foreign talent. I do not regard you as a loser, in anyway whatsoever. Look at our new immigrants, they are welcomed and proud to have migrated to a place with such high ‘quality of life’. …. shall not comment further on this….

The Singapore Dream : yes, if only we know what kind of life we want.

I had a secondary school education, worked hard as I go along, got married and have children. From 4 room to mansionette, from 800cc car to a 2.3BMW. From a office admin to a regional sales manager travelling much. From cash payment to overdrafting credit cards.
My world collapsed in 2001 when the company left singapore as a regional base. My saving/compensation dried up in 10mths, paying mostly the credit card bills, Could not get the same level of pay again as trade was a sunset one. Bankrupted in 2003. Car was sold, mansionette was sold. I started working as a driver, did some small business with the old customers. Had survived till today.

I am enjoying my life now more than I was blindly chasing the dollars then and tried to keep up a affluent lifestyle which is not necessary. Now, I do not have to burden myself with car installment, flat installment, I stayed in 2 room rented apartment which I comfortably afford, I kept my CPF and plan to use it for my old age medical bills if ever I need. I drive part-time now, I do more business if I want to have more money for my family and children. Just to keep myself occupied in Singapore. I used a motorbike if I am on a single errand, my company let me drive around with a van. I take the bus if I want to watch fellow singaporeans go by. I do not care what other think of my status. I only care I m not not in debts to whatever institutions or unnecessary bills and purchases.

I told myself I do not want to stress myself living in Singapore by adjusting my lifestyle. I am happy because I do not live by credit now, I saved and purchase item by cash which make it more meaningful.
I will apply these principles too when my CPF withdrawal come about and can live in various cities which I had travelled to before with ease.
At least, I can choose to work and choose to retire on my own term, choose to migrate or not of my own liking and not by the dictate of the State and Stress.
Just what Singapore teach me about dream here. :-)

frankumcity,
well, that’s right. Singapore dream is about been contented while not been oppressed.
Ultimately the dream is about been able to live without overwhelming stress, without fear, without worrying about surviving each day, and most importantly, all this can be achieved by living under one’s mean. No need for big car, big house, big pocket, big debt, big installment ( and big stomach, haha).

I’m a fellow Singaporean but if I had money I will definitely go to another country for good, anywhere BUT Singapore. I find Singapore getting less logical everyday. Firstly, Mas Selamat’s mysterious escape and still on the run for about 7mths on this small red dot despite “Home team’s effort”. Secondly, govt encouraging more public transport usage but increasing bus fares at the same time, a way of getting more revenue for more future govt investing? Thirdly, the bicycle issue, if you know what I mean.

4.5million population is a lot for this small red dot, but govt is fantasizing 6.5mil which will become nightmarish for people taking public transport. One can imagine if the peak hrs extend to beyond 9 both in the morning and at night.

When it comes to birth rates issue, govt only plan 1billion+ but invests 10+billions in foreign investments.

And why must senior citizens register first in order to get the gst credits? Why can’t the govt empathise with old people who may have difficulties doing the registration? Why can’t the govt just automatically put the $$$ into their bank for them? Oh! I get it! The govt hope these old people may become forgetful about it and therefore they can save some $$$.

Singapore will, and forever, be a small red dot. And yes, I believe the grass is greener on the other side.

To T:

“If you don’t like a leasehold property, then buy a freehold property and it will be yours for life”

No, it will not be yours for life, you only keep it until the garmen wants it back.

So irregardless of 99 years, 999 years, or freehold, anytime Mr Lee, sorry, garmen wants it back you LL have to give it back. Yah, they say buy back, but on their terms. Not happy, sue them, and lets just guess what will the results be.

Why other countries like Taiwan, Thailand & Malaysiaetc. are not affected?
Their govt / authority don’t allow /approve such products to be sold?
If a product is approved, then it is “buyer aware”, seller has little resp. Is it fair?

Majority of Thailand children eat rice instead of milk.

Despite of 18 coups 19 constitution changes since 1932, 90% of peoples remains Buddhist lifestyle – that is simple and non-violence.

You don’t just read newspaper and be brrainwashed ! You read about anti-government news, that is actually an anti-corruption movement . You learned peoples protest & fight, those are cult and narcotic gang !

You thought they don’t have money to buy milk. They never copy everything from the west. That is why Thai Beer is published listed in Singapore. No casino is allowed in Phuket. Thais has very strong traditiona value. Their strength.

What is Singaporean’s traditional value? What is our strength? Compare Thailand and Singapore, which nation remain a nation after 40 years when China & India economic momentum slow down?

Context – Mr Tan. Mine was in response to Ganga’s senseless rants. He talks about leasehold which applies to any country, not just Singapore. He talks about paying 130%, which applies to any banks in any country. That’s all I am trying to disprove.

You point about compulsory acquisition is off tangent, but I will also deal with it. In the past, the compensation was very low. But some time back, (can’t remember which year) it was pegged to market rate. Of course if you have your property acquired, no amount of compensation will be enough, and the market rate may not be real market rate, or the market rate determined a few years earlier.

Again, I don’t think Singapore is the only country which has compulsory acquisition laws.

the only thing i will miss if i leave this country would be the food……nothing else……

We all got screwed while they are all laughing their way to their bank accounts, knowing that there is nothing you folks can do. You can compare sg with whatever country you want, reason out whatever things you like but do they give a shit! don’t even think they still have all our CPF monies in hand, thats why they start increasing the minimum retention sum to stop you folks from taking your monies. Things are getting from bad to worse, better pack and leave as soon as I can afford.

dodo:

“in 2008 at 58 years old, you ask me again, i say defend for what ? for who ? i am selling my condo & moving to 3 room flat, my kids are studying and working overseas. i cannot be fighting for those rich people and their big expensive houses in singapore right ?”

you think dodo is the only who will sell out or sell down?

people like dodo are a force in itself. these are the people who will decide the fate of this country and when enough number gravitate towards that direction, the crowd will start to follow or you will not be able to liquidate,

build more and higher lah. ha.

It’s interesting how some do not have the guts to back their opinions with their identities yet have the audacity to call those who do ‘ranting’. If you must debate, by all means go ahead and dispute my statements. But I would remind you not to be dismissive of others’ opinions.

Mr T, kindly read the article and comments in the appropriate context. The issue about housing refers to the government’s claims of public housing and its ‘pride’ that its population are all ‘house-owners’. If the housing market had always been de-regulated, perhaps the rental climate might be much different. For example, the industry itself might have had developers who focused on creating low-rent housing complexes.

Maybe people’s perception would not have been cultured to ‘must die-die buy house’ and instead a more sensible logic would have prevailed where those who had fluctuating incomes or wished to be cash-rich could choose to stay comfortably in rental property for the duration of their lives.

As for my estimation of 130% or so of interest, it is based on the assumption that when one pays off their housing loan, they endeavour to pay off the capital as well, which would mean the interest would be reducing over the term. Your ‘20 years at 3% = 180%’ example (20 x 3 = 60, btw) will only happen if the interest was on the initial capital for the entire duration of the loan period.

In any case, the point here is that unlike the previous generation, the current cannot hope to make a profit on their houses. Worse, at the end of the day, if you need to take back your CPF and sell your home, no matter how high the price goes (save, freak market fluctuation), it is very unlikely that you will be able to get – original price of flat + interest paid + fees involved + CPF interest that would have been earned over the same period. This means that one’s CPF savings is lesser than what it would have been had one not wanted to be a flat-owner.

The rental alternative was not explored nor facilitated by our government and hence my claim that it is an illusion – the illusion of house ownership and the illusion of ‘rental bad, HDB good’.

The comment was not about how financial markets work.

Singapore is a country for the rich n powerful, just look at the F1 event , who benefit n enjoy this crap, of course the rich n powerful n those PAP cronies who organised this event to entertain the rich n powerful gain the most. The ordinary folks suffer due to closure of roads, ppl not driving so take public tranports thus buses n MRT were crowded, businesses around the Suntec area affected.

/// Mr T, kindly read the article and comments in the appropriate context. The issue about housing refers to the government’s claims of public housing and its ‘pride’ that its population are all ‘house-owners’. ///

Ganga – buying a 99-leasehold is, to all intents and purposes, owning that property. My point is, this will be the case in all countries with 99-year properties, whereas you single out Singapore as a special case as if it is a scam.

By your logic, any country that sells 99-year leasehold properties cannot include them as house owners. I disagree.

Just look at the tone of your assertion: /// A house you can buy, yes. BUT, you pay probably 130% of the purchase price including the interest for 20 to 30 years AND which can be taken back by the government after 99 years in any case. ///

What is your point about 130%? A scam? What is your point about taken back after 99 years? A scam? You mean you can buy a property in Malaysia for 100% of the purchase price? And they don’t take it back after 99 years?

It is my dream to leave singapoor within the next 10 years (once i have saved enough).
I can’t imagine me getting old and still have to slog through my retirement years.
Worst still, if I’m old and being retrenched, i may have to pick cardboards and drink cans for a living. I may have to sell tissues at the hawker centres or wash the toilets.

All this when i have contributed my youth to the economy, when my hard-earned cpf money is stashed away in some investment corporation which i shall not mention further.

This is an oppressive and pragmatic society where wrong-doers can go scot-free as long as they have the money and power. What happen to the voices of the people? The nonchalance of MAS and PTC irks me, perhaps our voices transmit at an inaudible frequency which they can’t even hear.

The local news and media is even at a relentless effort of brainwashing the people, procreation talk-show, babies-contest, beautiful-mum contest etc etc.
How to procreate when we don’t even have the basic security of our future?

This country is run like a corporation where the people are workers that are supposed to help the company create profits. Once we are no longer productive, we get fired. As simple as that. And mind you, don’t talk about a welfare state, welfare is a dirty word to some people.

Apathetic leaders who only know how to wayang and practice taiji when things cropped up, who won hundreds of thousands in defamation suits (Fools also know why they won). Anyway, my heart has turned cold.

Many reasons and beyond, that is why i would love to migrate to a more humane place, where there is genuine compassion and effort made by the leaders for the citizens. Where i can revive my cold cold heart and be a warm and living person.

Daniel, on comment #30, you said,

“No need for big car, big house, big pocket, big debt, big installment.”

You forgot another one, no need for Big Brother, always watching you.

Jackson, comment #31,

the govt wants to have 6.5m so as to compete with HK. at 3-4million, we’re too small for big MNCs to invest. We cant compete with HK, Shanghai, Taipei, even KL or Jakarta.

What we’re seeing now is a failure of central planning when its filled with underperforming individuals. While we target 6.5million, the folks at LTA are struggling to plan the transport system to match this population. while the folks at MRT and SBS are just looking at dollars and profits. its when the people who came up with ERP are not talking to the people who came up with COEs. the people who came up with the complex taxi fares are not the people who take taxis or drive taxis. Why? coz the focus of their planning and execution is just about everything else, except about the people.

The alternative? free market. let free market sets its prices. let the free market set the number of buses for routes, number of taxis on the roads. When there is competition, there will be innovation. Costs and prices are at the optimum. the govt’s role should be guiding, legislating, focused on the best result for the consumer.

But we’re uniquely Singapore ;-)

[...] Bonuses for a Dying Breed – TOC: The stork is still not quite convinced – TOC: Changed Singapore Dream: Fleeing The City of Possibilities – My Singapore News: Changed Singapore Dream: Fleeing The City of [...]

aygee,
that is a good one.

From the observation of the comments here, will add on,
No need for expensive government, no need for expensive prataman, no need for PAP moles in blogosphere.

29) frankumcity on September 26th, 2008 12.51 am The Singapore Dream : yes, if only we know what kind of life we want.

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1st of all, who determines what is definition of the term Singapore Dream ?
What is Singapore Dream?

as everyone is unique, their dreams should be different.

success should be subjective.

I hope singaporeans do not blind follow the blind….fall in to the longkang…..

Whatever is your Dream shall be your Singapore dream.

Lets not be so shallow to say that Singapore Dream is the 5 Cs and all should adopt the same definition.

I determine my own meaning of success.

But when live in such a uniquely singapore environment, the people here are cultivated with a certain unique mentality different from other countries.

While citizens of TW, MY, USA, Australia, Thailand, SKorea etc etc voice their opinions and concerns very much, Singaporeans are a bit different in this respect.

What causes this ?

Why do singaproans behave differently?

Are singaporeans worldly enough to be 1st world ?

i no no. I am clueless, nice to meet you.

regards
Kanga de roo of the pink chee hum that is stunted like marlboro

Do allow me to loso (repeat) one more time.

Get away from this sickening place if it is possible because it(SIN) will only get from bad to worse in time to come. We should not exist to slave for bullies!

Personally, as an old folk, I strongly encourage the younger generationsto leave.

Many talked about education of their youngs as one reason for not leaving, citing education in SIN as better than elsewhere. But, if one looks around, one will find that there are lots of Singaporeans studying overseas while foreign students in SIN are mostly hosted by our government. The point is, if our youngs are educated overseas and found to be better ‘qualified, recognised’ and proved to be competent and good at their jobs, then the education systems in other countries should be as good if not better than the Local System.

Humans have emotional needs other than material needs for a fulfilling and meaningful existence. When one indulges only in material craves that can never be satisfied, much of ones’ life is wasted.

If there is anything UNIQUELY SINGAPORE, it is that Sngaporeans are bred and inculcated with our NATIONAL CULTURE OF MATERIALISM, by our leadership after Independence.

SAD…………

patriot

Bottomline, no matter where you live, live within your means.

Regardless of where you’re living, at the end of the day, its the people that matters. Where your heart is, everything is perfect. When it has drifted off, time to move on.

Increased cost of living doesn’t happen only in Singapore.

Take 2 extreme cases for example,
SG – able to cope with increased cost of 2 digits percentage
Zimbabwe – 11.2 million % inflation

You’ll lead a happier life looking a brighter perspective of things instead of comparing yourself to others and wonder why you don’t have this that this.

Come up with your own dream instead of following the crowd. Singapore’s dream is a vibrant economy.

“Get a good education, work hard, save money, get married, own homes, make babies, retire and enjoy the fruits of your labour ” This is your own dream.

I think we have to put things in perspective. For one, I think Singapore’s cost of living has no way to go other than up. Look at all the developed cities of the world. New York, London, Hong Kong, Toyko. The cost of living is astronomical and the pace of life frenetic, to say the very least. Im sure many Singaporeans will agree that the only sustainable city model for Singapore in the future is something along the lines of New York. A frenetic pace of life and a high cost of living are issues we have to contend with in a global city. What more, Singapore has no hinterland to fall back on.

As in the case of great cities, people go and come. Some like the hustle and bustle, some prefer the tranquility and slow pace of the countryside. So much for the proverbial one man’s meat being another poison.

/// As in the case of great cities, people go and come. Some like the hustle and bustle, some prefer the tranquility and slow pace of the countryside. So much for the proverbial one man’s meat being another poison. ///

Alex, I think you have just nailed the nub of the matter. Unfortunately, for Singapore, the city and country is, for all practical purpose, one and the same. In big countries like the US or Australia, if you are tired of living in the city, you can always relocate to the suburb or countryside, and vice versa. In Singapore, you will hit the sea within half an hour. The only way to slow down in Singapore is to emigrate.

It was never a dream, it is a nightmare and one that is getting closer to us as we pass each passing day

1) Jobs will be limited

2) Population will increase, space per person will decrease

3) Transport systems will be packed as cars and buses and Mrt will be loaded

4) Cost of housing will go up due to demand

5) Areas that are further from town but are classified as HDB will go up and up

6) Crime rate will increase

Please feel free to continue

“51) Singapore nightmare on September 26th, 2008 4.20 pm.”

You have mentioned some of the more important variables of our life here.

They just need to concentrate & stay focused on the some of your mentioned variables and these alone will be enough to keep their hands really busy for most of the time.

They should not harbour too many grand ideas which they are not able to chew.

I dreamt that future children suffer more than current generation who already are very stressed.

I really do not want my children to suffer in an extremely globalised competitive environment. Life if more than $ and Cents , numbers on a piece of paper.
Life is to be enjoyed.
Childhood is to be enjoyed.

Poor thing. Pathetic souls.

There is no chance of change foreseen but for more intense stress and competition and more influx coming in everyday.

“As in the case of great cities, people go and come. Some like the hustle and bustle, some prefer the tranquility and slow pace of the countryside. So much for the proverbial one man’s meat being another poison.”

In the context of our country, you may calibrate to have a population of 2million so that we have the more freer physical & social space to have an easy & tranquil lifestyle. Of course, certain high standard of education with the right faculty mix + entrepreneurship spirit must also be there for value addition work to happen.

This will lead to lesser people to compete for whatever resources within the country spreading the benefits to wider sector of the population if regulated properly.

Of you may delibrately cramp the country with 6million or 8million people or 10millions people competing fiercefully for whatever limited resources there are in a small country. Imagine the potential absolute number of those who cannot make it.

I agree with Kennedy and I think the proposition of a congested city is a scary one.

Singapore is a unique proposition facing unprecedented challenges. I dont envy policymakers. It is a concrete edifice that has to keep going because the other route means certain ignominy in the hands of our neighbours.

All we can do is to shrug and plod on. And yes, the only solution for this place to keep buzzing is to attract foreign talent. We Singaporeans can hardly be counted to stay if we had a choice. Its quite straightfoward really.

why should i migrate? the people running this government should. ASAP.

even though my family belongs to the legion of millionaires in singapore..
and we can enjoy our desired lifestyle without problem in singapore…
but I would not hesitate to pack up and leave this place for Taiwan or Australia.

The problem is my folks (in their 60s) are more attached to this country as they have grown up here all their lives and have grown accustom to living here.

But for me, there was no turning back when I went overseas for my studies and subsequently went for long trips overseas. My desire now is to have another country’s PR and buy a home and stay there……Singapore to me now is a place to transit… to enjoy short stays..

Sadly, I cannot bear to uproot as I feel I have duty and obligation to spend time with my folks here since they are getting old. The only luxury is that I try to go on 1-2wks holidays every few months… to places I liked and half of it with my parents.

I hope my next generation will enjoy a more fulfilled life than me.

57) legion of millionaires on September 27th, 2008 2.13 am

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Even though about 1 thousand singapore citizens terminate their citizenship willingly, I think these are the rare few out of those who have considered migrating who could make up this decision. Many have paper qualfications and work experience and credentials that qualify them as new citizens of say Australia or USA or Canada or TW. But of all these, I think only a handful is strong enough mentally to actually make the decision. Look at our lovely new citizens, they also made the tough decision to live in a place that appears nicer than their motherland.

Thus, please let us remind ourselves that more want to migrate than those who actually made it.

Hop Pinkie, the kangaroo

Migration involves great sacrifices – monetary, family, friends, uprooting.
Weigh the costs and benefits : is it worthwhile? To many it may be just a dream. The bar for entry to most developed countries is being raised every year. For those who are able and have made up their minds after doing the due diligence, then by all means, chase your dreams. The world is your oyster.

Is it the system?
Due to the system, I see that some/alot of us are not able to choose the right MP to represent us in the parliament. Rather, I see these MPs as being “assigned” to represent us. How on earth are they going to be our loud hailer then?

It has been awhile since I last wrote a comment in TOC. After all these discussions on the overpopulated red dot, the reaction from our G had been rather clear. How about the bus / mrt fare hike after a long week of campaign? Is thing getting worse?

For example, on the streets, these days, there are more and more buses equipped with disabled facilities. This is good but on the other hand I feel that I am standing more often. This is even true even though the bus is not full. What angered me most is when during peak hour. I couldn’t imagine half of the people in the bus are standing. Does this show a dip in the service to the people? Are the resources distributed appropriately? I really hope that the providers are not using the disable people as a shield to make money.

Is there any reaction from our G? Are they listening?

So, is single party system benefiting the people?

Seriously, if there is no solution to the current system, to immigrate or migrate is a clear good option to vote the party out. (hehe, with my family, we would not flee but to leave or walk out with pride, if opportunity arises)

I think those who migrate out of singapore are actually supporting a particular party as in their anti votes can no longer be used.

about a thousand of these votes are gone each year.

Time to lobby abroad then. If they are still citizens, it is a huge voting pool to be tapped.

Living or even just staying for a short time in a foreign country, can often result in severe cases of ‘culture shock’. As a person that has been living out of their ‘cultural comfort zone’ for a number of years, I am not immune. However, it does not matter whether I agree or disagree with a particular country’s policies, laws, sentences or customs. The onus is on me, as the foreigner, to respect and adhere to the country’s way of life, regardless of the driving forces – religion, race, tradition or any others.

geovani

social marketing

As someone who has lived overseas for more than a decade, I can say that right
now, I wish I can come back to work in Singapore.

The grass are taller in some areas of the other side, the space bigger; but so is that nagging feeling that you don’t belong there. Its not likeI encounter violence everyday because I speak from somewhere else and have a different skin color from somewhere else. But can I call it the glass ceiling? The best are saved for their own, foreign countries need migrants as Singapore needs migrants, workers that is.

Forget patriotism, I find sustenance in my kin who are mainly in Singapore, I retrace my sense of belonging in old flats and shophouses. Of course, I wouldnt mind living in a condominium but I can’t afford it yet. Just as I can’t settle on the wage I can expect working in Singapore. Maybe my attitude will change.

People migrate, but sometimes they come back.

reality bites,
which place are you staying in ?

geovani,
which place are you staying in ?

> My folks and I do not buy this idea that one has to work for life or beyond the
> retirement age. There is so much more to do in life after retirement.

This is exactly what the state is using to justify itself to be a nanny, the emphasis on economic growth, the influx of foreign workers, and the political landlock we see.

Agree with almost all, esp on inability to seek justice from the courts.

The problem is that those of no use to the ruling clique are treated like dirt & source to pay for their exorbitant salaries for failed policies – re Temasek & GIC’s massive losses; SARS etc.

It’s a plunder and suppress policy.

Leave while u can.

Guys, I believe everyone has the right to choose. Living in any country is just as difficult. I think you should be more proactive in your approaches and do more for yourself. Singapore is a hard place to live in if you are poor and without skills. But I guess it is the same anywhere in the work. no doubt you get social security in other countries, many end up paying more taxes than in Singapore.

What we should do is to le our voice be heard before the next election. Did anyone try to tell the government about our plight. If you have tried, we as citizens has the duty to tell them and propose something feasible there will substain in the long round. This will give our government the confidence that his” children” has finally grown up and able to make decisions on their own.

One way to let yourself be hear . Everyone please blog more and write more to the forum page. Althought it may not get publish, We can publish online. Make sure that each time we complains about something, we share with the government what we want and why our ideas and plans are better and more feasible than their. For those of you who are overseas, please tell the government that other countries have better systems and we need to improvise our system. Tell them what makes the other countries better.

Reality bites, I am afraid your memories of classic old flats & nolstalgic shophouses are becoming just memories over here. There’s construction work island-wide. The lovely scenary with the fountain & comforting shops at Clementi MRT station is no more. The whole place is being reconstructed. The whole scene here now is as though you started a Command & Conquer game with lotsa credits, & you build & construct buildings like there’s no tomorrow.

Public transport is now crowded even during off-peak hours. You won’t wanna see what it’s like during peak hours.

Almost everywhere in Singapore is overrun with throngs of less-than-welcome, unsanitary species of foreign workers too.

(47)Patriot

I agree with your comments. I have been residing in California for many years. My visits are on transit to see my old folks at home. You will be surprise to see so many Singaporean kids are studying all over the States, some are planning to stay for good. Why the Ministers are sending their children overseas to study instead?

During my visits, I feel like I am in a foreign country, not like Singapore anymore. Everywhere I travel I see so many foreigners around e.g MRT, buses, shopping malls, coffee shops…..etc. and the public places are mostly crowded. The cost of living is getting higher each time when I return for a visit. I enjoy travelling in Malaysia.

I can afford to travel extensively all over the States, even to Canada. This call exposure.

Dear Oversea Singaporean(CA);

it is comforting that You share my observation and posted here, in/to support, thank You !

I am self sufficient and do not require much in life from here on, as one near sixty year old, like those born in the 20s and 30s, I have had a life of plenties, plenty of space, plenty of camaraderies/loves, plenty of foods (land/marine produces- fruits/vegetables, poultries, pork, mutton, chicken/ducks, fishes, shells, squids etc etc; too many to list all). Much were fresh local harvests everyday)

The Colonial British Ruler then was efficient and most importantly humane resulted in people in China, India and elsewhere risking their live to seek fortunes here. My father, liked many others stayed and made Singapore his home, in fact he did not even return to China for any visit after that.

Singaporeans born after the 70s missed the opportunity to sample what real human relationship was liked. From the 80s onward, Public Relation replaced natural social and human relations, public relation practices became the tool of businessmen, commercial houses and the Rulers. People relationships became cordial, pleasant, diplomatic; everything nice except sincere. The niceties were all for exchanges of business(read money), power, fame and adulation. Today in Singapore, most things are artificial, including smiles.

It is very true that today, Singaporeans are not starved to death due to poverty, on the contrary, many Singaporeans suffer health problems due to too much consumption. Junk foods, health foods(health supplements), frozen foods, alcohols and sex(teenage indulgence/nationwide availability of sex operators) do not make the people healthier and happier. Instead, they caused overcrowding at hospitals, clinics and drive up their fees.

VEry soon, VERy soon, VERY SOon, VERY SOON we will be out of spaces in housing, hospitals, food centres, public transports, running short of time and frus(trated) to death over livings in SIN.

“When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.” — Harry Truman

“A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.” — Edward Abbey

These two quotes sums up exactly what is happening and what is lacking in Singapore.

The only way to change things now is for the people to rise up and take back this country. The government’s purpose is to serve the best interest of the people….not the other way around!!

We need a revolution. They can throw one man in prison but they can’t do that to 10,000.

Agreed. If only Singaporeans are willing to stand up and fight…then the PAP would be scared.

Audrey, Aye Aye!

Our opposition cannot make it.
Have to repeat my point again…
If they can’t even show leadership for micro-level issues (like Lehman minibonds saga), how on earth do you expect them to lead at the macro-level.

OPPOSITION.. PLEASE TAKE NOTE OF THIS:-
ASK NOT FOR US TO VOTE YOU IN TO SHOW RESULTS..
INSTEAD..SHOW RESULTS AND ASKED FOR US TO VOTE YOU IN

62) Loyola on September 28th, 2008 1.05 am
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74) rebel peasant on September 29th, 2008 3.43 pm
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Those who migrated chose to let the rest continue with the dream….z …z ..z…z

Tp be bluntly honest, while Opposition has the ambition to provide alternative voice, they are effectively not as effective as what I expect an opposition party to be. Compare any other democracies the way their opposition operates and you will see how unique singapore opposition really is – An Activist group that is non-politically registered is able to voice more for the people faster and more effective.

I wonder why people decide to leave. Moving house is tough. Moving to another country is 10 times tougher. Yet …

77) Pragmatism Extremist on September 29th, 2008 6.40 pm

“Compare any other democracies the way their opposition operates and you will see how unique singapore opposition really is”

What are you trying to suggest. Everyone here knows all too well that there is some fine line to take. I feel that a lot of us are just waiting patiently buying for time.

“An Activist group that is non-politically registered is able to voice more for the people faster and more effective. ”

While this is good to nudge people into certain direction. Ultimately, this must be converted into parliamentary points (being elected in for the opposition) so that it may result in real policy changes.

Of else, the incumbent will play their famous layang with you. Let go a little bit when the situation dictates and pull back more when you let go a little of your sight. To them, it has become an art because we have allowed them to pratise it so often all these donkey years.

“Today in Singapore, most things are artificial, including smiles.”

patriot, you captured the ground sentiments rather well. :)

corporate rule has white washed relationships. we have plenty , but the superficial nature of relationship will not hold the people together. the result is a new generation with feeble attachment to their mother land or to each other. well, there will always be some exceptions to the rule, but in general, i don’t see how this ‘high standard of living’ imposed on all of us will gel society.

to each his own unless, i am paid like my leaders than i will serve with a smile :)

75) isa on September 29th, 2008 4.56 pm Audrey, Aye Aye!
OPPOSITION.. PLEASE TAKE NOTE OF THIS:-
ASK NOT FOR US TO VOTE YOU IN TO SHOW RESULTS..
INSTEAD..SHOW RESULTS AND ASKED FOR US TO VOTE YOU IN

When we decide to vote for oppositions is not whether they are better than the ruling party, just to have additional voices to make sure that the governing system is in proper order. Whether the oppositions can proof their worth, only time will tell. At the present situation, do you think a chef can produce a list of good receipes when all their cooking utencils are taken away from their kitchen? Think!

Pragmatist Extremist (76)

“I wonder why people decide to leave. Moving house is tough. Moving to another country is 10 times tougher. Yet …”

Why do people leave? Because they can. Because they can pursue their dreams elsewhere.

Because they are Singaporean, and ironically have the cosmopolitan skillset to live abroad. It’s not that hard to fit in abroad if you are still young, and not a victim of a fixed mindset.

Hi sotongball;

thanks for the complement.

Indeed the implications You mentioned are very real and cutely, Public Relations is an ‘educational/professional’ study at tertiary level ?

patriot

Patriot,

Yes, under Communication Studies.

Hi Loyola;

How are You?

Thank You very much for enlightening me, much appreciated.

The Subject(Public Relation), must and should be taught with great emphases on conscience and propriety, otherwise graduates in this Discipline will practise it with false fronts without sincerities in their relationships with others.

Professionalism is only honourable and respectable when practise with sincerity and integrity.

patriot

Good day! conjugated linoleic acid cla

Recently one of my friends started an obsession with the actor Nicholas Cage (mostly because their names are both Nicholas – sounds strange but he is strange and that isn’t the point). After asking around the rest of my friends he seems to be a very controversial figure.
What does the forum think? do you love the all action superhero? Or do you hate the droning voice of the man who does nothing but action shooters?

How many times you eat during a normal … every day life?
are you the type of person who eats a bit and often?
or rarely and too much?

i usually have 3 and i’m the 2nd type of person (though it’s not that healthy)

8 am breakfast

3pm lunch

9pm a snack.

i don’t really like the idea of leaving the place of my birth. Hey, it should be the system that need to be changed to suit us. There is too much rust in the old system, need to get a new one.

Low Tax. There’s been lot of talk about our Low Tax. But which tax? May be most of them refer to Income Tax. But one has to look beyond just Income Tax. For example,

Car Tax: the cost of vehicles will be subject to tax of more than 100% upon reaching our shore. Add in the COE which may hit 50% of the cost. Pay a Road Tax annually, and pay ERP which is more or less a road usage tax if you drive daily.

Retirement Tax: you get a 34% cut to your monthly pay to be deposited into your CPF accounts. But you cant touch the entirety of that accumulated amount even when you retire. Plus, you pay administrative charges when you need to use part of it, like Medisave.

Consumption Tax: When you eat, drink, entertain, shop and move about, you pay 7% GST. Even your tertiary education fees has to be taxed 7% be it paid by CPF or bank loan, and the government will not give you a loan if you cant afford it.

And on a yearly basis, there is Property Tax, even if your property is fully paid up or depreciating. Oh, and that TV Tax so that you are licensed to watch re-run of age old HK movies. Dont even think of evading this if you subscribe to Cable TV.

Hey, dont forget that Taxi Tax. I mean the various surcharges.

I shared many of the sentiments and statements made above by fellow bloggers. I voted with my feet after graduation and had no regret at all. My children had graduated from Oxford and the youngest just started uni. Life outside Sinkapore is far more superior and even better still my son do NOT have to do NS. I offen wander when I was in NS who I was supposed to defence? Even as a reservist, I had to obtain an exit permit to leave the country and each year I had to renew it. This goes on for many years and finally I decided to take up UK citizenship as it was getting troublesome when I was travelling with my childrenduring holiday. They were UK born. Sadly I made the mistake of travelling to Sinkapore using my UK passport and that was when I received a letter from the SinKapore immigration Authority to give up my UK citizenship but you guessed right which one I give up. SinKapore had lost many of its citizen because we have a ruling regime that behave as if they own us and the country. They do and take what they like with no regards for any of us. Legalised coruption and nepotism is openly prastised. If any of us dare to speak publicly, without fail we will end up in court and put away. It is a society living in fear and for our fellow blogger information especially those who may wish to travel to SinKapore to see parent & relative, there is a secret file being kept on those who had stayed outside Sinkapore for any lenght of time. There is little we could do about it but just beware. Do not make it easy for them to control us with threat of prosecution etc. PAP sees us as potential enemies to be controlled.