
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Political openness &#8211; for PAP only</title>
	<atom:link href="http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/</link>
	<description>a community of Singaporeans</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:29:33 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Donaldson Tan</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-21092</link>
		<dc:creator>Donaldson Tan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 10:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-21092</guid>
		<description>Kel (#84 &amp; #89):

I. Sense of Security
You claim that Singaporeans feel safe. Perceiving safe and actually being safe aren&#039;t the same thing. Comparing Singapore&#039;s and Malaysia&#039;s crime statistics for 2006, Singapore has a higher crime rate for small crime while Malaysia has a higher crime rate for serious crates. I am not sure if this should add up to Singapore being a safer country or simply no better. Just because mass media says Singapore is safe, it doesn&#039;t translate to Singapore actually believing safe. It is a matter of faith, isn&#039;t it?

II. Irrelevance of Gun Ownership
It is completely irrelevant to Singapore. You should be comparing Singapore to United Kingdom if you are seeking to make comparison of Singapore to a first world country exalting the freedom of speech.

III. America&#039;s 401k Plan vs Singapore&#039;s CPF
America doesn&#039;t have a state-funded 401K plan. However, employers and unions run their own 401K plan. Employer contribution remains a common element in all these 401k plans. Fund managers compete among themselves to win investment from these pension funds for their products, whether it is mutual fund, hedge fund or private equity. In Singapore, all our CPF monies are invested in GIC&#039;s and Temesak&#039;s investment products and we are denied market rate for our CPF monies.

IV. Indirect Taxes
While it is true that Singapore&#039;s GST (7%) is far less than the UK&#039;s VAT (17.5%), the poor in the UK is shielded by universal healthcare and social security pay-outs for the unemployed and the elderly. The UK also pays for training courses and is responsible for matching jobs to the unemployed. Unlike Singapore, there is a safety net mechanism in the UK. Singapore has none.

V. Healthcare is both a right and a welfare
However, universal healthcare does not mean free for all. Managing cost is important to ensure that universal healthcare remains sustainable. Hence, do not be surprised that in a UK&#039;s universal healthcare system, drugs prescribed for primary care are not subsidised whereas specialist drugs prescribed for secondary and tertiary care are subsidised. Primary, secondary and tertiary healthcare services (e.g. consultation, surgeries, physiotherapies) are 100% subsidised by the state. The fact that consumers have to pay for their medicine keeps consumers in check that they would not &quot;line up first thing in the morning to get our teeth cleaned by the polyclinic dentist, or just to go for any minor treatments of headache, cough, flu… etc&quot;

VI. Demeaning laws
It is disheartening that we have demeaning laws, to name a few: criminalising homosexual acts and refusal to recognise marital rape as crime and a woman&#039;s charter that automatically entitle a woman to half her husband&#039;s assets.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kel (#84 &amp; #89):</p>
<p>I. Sense of Security<br />
You claim that Singaporeans feel safe. Perceiving safe and actually being safe aren&#8217;t the same thing. Comparing Singapore&#8217;s and Malaysia&#8217;s crime statistics for 2006, Singapore has a higher crime rate for small crime while Malaysia has a higher crime rate for serious crates. I am not sure if this should add up to Singapore being a safer country or simply no better. Just because mass media says Singapore is safe, it doesn&#8217;t translate to Singapore actually believing safe. It is a matter of faith, isn&#8217;t it?</p>
<p>II. Irrelevance of Gun Ownership<br />
It is completely irrelevant to Singapore. You should be comparing Singapore to United Kingdom if you are seeking to make comparison of Singapore to a first world country exalting the freedom of speech.</p>
<p>III. America&#8217;s 401k Plan vs Singapore&#8217;s CPF<br />
America doesn&#8217;t have a state-funded 401K plan. However, employers and unions run their own 401K plan. Employer contribution remains a common element in all these 401k plans. Fund managers compete among themselves to win investment from these pension funds for their products, whether it is mutual fund, hedge fund or private equity. In Singapore, all our CPF monies are invested in GIC&#8217;s and Temesak&#8217;s investment products and we are denied market rate for our CPF monies.</p>
<p>IV. Indirect Taxes<br />
While it is true that Singapore&#8217;s GST (7%) is far less than the UK&#8217;s VAT (17.5%), the poor in the UK is shielded by universal healthcare and social security pay-outs for the unemployed and the elderly. The UK also pays for training courses and is responsible for matching jobs to the unemployed. Unlike Singapore, there is a safety net mechanism in the UK. Singapore has none.</p>
<p>V. Healthcare is both a right and a welfare<br />
However, universal healthcare does not mean free for all. Managing cost is important to ensure that universal healthcare remains sustainable. Hence, do not be surprised that in a UK&#8217;s universal healthcare system, drugs prescribed for primary care are not subsidised whereas specialist drugs prescribed for secondary and tertiary care are subsidised. Primary, secondary and tertiary healthcare services (e.g. consultation, surgeries, physiotherapies) are 100% subsidised by the state. The fact that consumers have to pay for their medicine keeps consumers in check that they would not &#8220;line up first thing in the morning to get our teeth cleaned by the polyclinic dentist, or just to go for any minor treatments of headache, cough, flu… etc&#8221;</p>
<p>VI. Demeaning laws<br />
It is disheartening that we have demeaning laws, to name a few: criminalising homosexual acts and refusal to recognise marital rape as crime and a woman&#8217;s charter that automatically entitle a woman to half her husband&#8217;s assets.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: berak bagus</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20995</link>
		<dc:creator>berak bagus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Sep 2008 17:50:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20995</guid>
		<description>@ Kel,

It is about giving you another angle on how some of us view the situation in Singapore. From what you have posted and suggestion of some critical thinking is in no way insulting a person&#039;s character. Go check it with your lecturer. 
Read your own post again for heaven&#039;s sake and tell me you are not making a case for the ruling party and advising netizens to count their blessings before criticizing the incumbents ? Does that mean we should not criticize this govt  ?
Why don&#039;t you tell us all the goodstuff this govt has done for the people and at the same time tell us what are the things you disagree. So far you mentioned only the laws affecting gays. There has to be more , right ?
I would appreciate your enlightenment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Kel,</p>
<p>It is about giving you another angle on how some of us view the situation in Singapore. From what you have posted and suggestion of some critical thinking is in no way insulting a person&#8217;s character. Go check it with your lecturer.<br />
Read your own post again for heaven&#8217;s sake and tell me you are not making a case for the ruling party and advising netizens to count their blessings before criticizing the incumbents ? Does that mean we should not criticize this govt  ?<br />
Why don&#8217;t you tell us all the goodstuff this govt has done for the people and at the same time tell us what are the things you disagree. So far you mentioned only the laws affecting gays. There has to be more , right ?<br />
I would appreciate your enlightenment.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: kel</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20976</link>
		<dc:creator>kel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Sep 2008 13:49:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20976</guid>
		<description>I would like to ask the purpose of this debate is about the issue or about my critical thinking. If its the issue we are debating, keep to it and not insult the character of the person who writes his opinions. 

For the HDB flat prices, 3 room flats are still available at 300k. So please do your research before posting prices of HDB. If you are talking about how much I would need to get a flat next time. I can easily say that prices would almost double current ones in 8-10 years. I would not say 3k is enough in current situation now. But I&#039;d never say I would just rest on earning 3k per month. 

The purpose of my opinion is that we should actually look at what good the PAP has done for us first before we start criticising every mistake they make. 

There are certain cases that I do disagree with PAP as well. I am not that all agreeing. This is especially the laws for gays. About choosing to go through the corporate path. Lets just say, the future of governments in the world will no longer be limited to just political systems. Corporations getting bigger and bigger would have a huge slice of power in every country. Enjoy your spiting of people who had just said a few good things about PAP. Is insulting my character the best you can do to refute my opinions? Think again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would like to ask the purpose of this debate is about the issue or about my critical thinking. If its the issue we are debating, keep to it and not insult the character of the person who writes his opinions. </p>
<p>For the HDB flat prices, 3 room flats are still available at 300k. So please do your research before posting prices of HDB. If you are talking about how much I would need to get a flat next time. I can easily say that prices would almost double current ones in 8-10 years. I would not say 3k is enough in current situation now. But I&#8217;d never say I would just rest on earning 3k per month. </p>
<p>The purpose of my opinion is that we should actually look at what good the PAP has done for us first before we start criticising every mistake they make. </p>
<p>There are certain cases that I do disagree with PAP as well. I am not that all agreeing. This is especially the laws for gays. About choosing to go through the corporate path. Lets just say, the future of governments in the world will no longer be limited to just political systems. Corporations getting bigger and bigger would have a huge slice of power in every country. Enjoy your spiting of people who had just said a few good things about PAP. Is insulting my character the best you can do to refute my opinions? Think again.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Victor</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20830</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 13:18:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20830</guid>
		<description>berak bagus,good man...
hi kel..,
u can&quot;T compare last time.
LASt TIME is easy affort a HDB flat,at most 90k,but now,700k,,if u only have 3k,u still want a family,,,please lah,don think in this way...u R so pure.hahas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>berak bagus,good man&#8230;<br />
hi kel..,<br />
u can&#8221;T compare last time.<br />
LASt TIME is easy affort a HDB flat,at most 90k,but now,700k,,if u only have 3k,u still want a family,,,please lah,don think in this way&#8230;u R so pure.hahas.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: berak bagus</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20765</link>
		<dc:creator>berak bagus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:57:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20765</guid>
		<description>@ 84)  kel

The political openness for PAP only and the law skewed to favour PAP suggests a dictatorship. You mentioned US and  gun ownership. Tell me when did any citizen ever suggest we do the same? Lower crime is a collective effort of the citizens and not just this govt. You should compare Singapore with Taipei, Hong Kong or Tokyo. These cities are politically more open and have a dynamic economy. And I do not recall a high crime rate in these cities.
It is people like you kel, who is the reason for this govt&#039;s boldness. You mentioned having lofty ambition to achieve a comfortable income level. Nothing wrong with that. But what makes you think only the PAP can provide this opportunity ?  You are suppose to be a uni student. They don&#039;t encourage you to apply critical thinking or to think out of the box ? Are you so sure there are no talents better than the PAP?  Just look at how the PAP solve problems. Did it occur to you , almost everything is about money ? Whilst chasing your dream to earn more, I assume you are happy to live and work in a corporation and not a country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ 84)  kel</p>
<p>The political openness for PAP only and the law skewed to favour PAP suggests a dictatorship. You mentioned US and  gun ownership. Tell me when did any citizen ever suggest we do the same? Lower crime is a collective effort of the citizens and not just this govt. You should compare Singapore with Taipei, Hong Kong or Tokyo. These cities are politically more open and have a dynamic economy. And I do not recall a high crime rate in these cities.<br />
It is people like you kel, who is the reason for this govt&#8217;s boldness. You mentioned having lofty ambition to achieve a comfortable income level. Nothing wrong with that. But what makes you think only the PAP can provide this opportunity ?  You are suppose to be a uni student. They don&#8217;t encourage you to apply critical thinking or to think out of the box ? Are you so sure there are no talents better than the PAP?  Just look at how the PAP solve problems. Did it occur to you , almost everything is about money ? Whilst chasing your dream to earn more, I assume you are happy to live and work in a corporation and not a country.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Listen to the People</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20750</link>
		<dc:creator>Listen to the People</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:44:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20750</guid>
		<description>Well, we have the official reply and as predicted we have the standard reply. Somehow or rather we are getting so uncanily accurate when its comes to government replies, court verdicts and select committee decisions . That goes to show how well we understand our leaders and systems here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, we have the official reply and as predicted we have the standard reply. Somehow or rather we are getting so uncanily accurate when its comes to government replies, court verdicts and select committee decisions . That goes to show how well we understand our leaders and systems here.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Victor</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20726</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Sep 2008 16:17:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20726</guid>
		<description>we did not say PAP is just doing all the wrong...please..

BUT do u all think tat all the daily EXPENSES INCREASING.
we R think of all singaporeans,,Do u all know the salary gap between normal singapore and the PAP member is so big.....

Do they reallY UNDERSTANDING PP needs.&gt;&gt;??&lt;&lt;

i don think so...
i just believe tat if we put a rich person to the poor citizen environment,let them stay for 6 month...then only i could believe tat theY REALLY UNDERSTAND the citizen needs...

Do they reduce their salary?? NO.BUT increase...!!
Don always say tat they made singapore V safe,,,,is WE,citizen did not have CAUSE PROBLEM to THEY,so is WE made singapore safe,,,please.
IS WE,SINGAPOREANS V MUTURE...

bUT THEY think like u guy,thought tat is their effort,so they keep increase their pay..

i have lot of uncles just with 1k or lesser,can they survive.they taking {for MP,21k} others,i don know...Do they can understand singaporeans needs...

DON DREAN LAH, U ALL JUST MAKE YOUNG GANERATION MORE DISAPPOINTED. DON CAll yrself a singaporeans,u all just can&quot;T be bother.T.T
If i take 21k,i also WOULD SUPPORT the GOV TAT KEEP INCREASE ALL THING TAT JUST SOLVE PROBLEM..&quot;FOR OUR OWN GOOD&quot; 
PLEASE lah,&quot;i now REALLY know which party in for my own good future&quot;
thank for the current GOV. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>we did not say PAP is just doing all the wrong&#8230;please..</p>
<p>BUT do u all think tat all the daily EXPENSES INCREASING.<br />
we R think of all singaporeans,,Do u all know the salary gap between normal singapore and the PAP member is so big&#8230;..</p>
<p>Do they reallY UNDERSTANDING PP needs.&gt;&gt;??&lt;&lt;</p>
<p>i don think so&#8230;<br />
i just believe tat if we put a rich person to the poor citizen environment,let them stay for 6 month&#8230;then only i could believe tat theY REALLY UNDERSTAND the citizen needs&#8230;</p>
<p>Do they reduce their salary?? NO.BUT increase&#8230;!!<br />
Don always say tat they made singapore V safe,,,,is WE,citizen did not have CAUSE PROBLEM to THEY,so is WE made singapore safe,,,please.<br />
IS WE,SINGAPOREANS V MUTURE&#8230;</p>
<p>bUT THEY think like u guy,thought tat is their effort,so they keep increase their pay..</p>
<p>i have lot of uncles just with 1k or lesser,can they survive.they taking {for MP,21k} others,i don know&#8230;Do they can understand singaporeans needs&#8230;</p>
<p>DON DREAN LAH, U ALL JUST MAKE YOUNG GANERATION MORE DISAPPOINTED. DON CAll yrself a singaporeans,u all just can&#8221;T be bother.T.T<br />
If i take 21k,i also WOULD SUPPORT the GOV TAT KEEP INCREASE ALL THING TAT JUST SOLVE PROBLEM..&#8221;FOR OUR OWN GOOD&#8221;<br />
PLEASE lah,&#8221;i now REALLY know which party in for my own good future&#8221;<br />
thank for the current GOV. :)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Kel</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20538</link>
		<dc:creator>Kel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 10:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20538</guid>
		<description>Hi,

I read through the comments that have been posted as well as the article. I understand how you guys feel and all that. We are all scared that one day PAP would govern under absolute power and it would turn from &#039;socialist&#039; to dictatorship. That was one of my fears too. However, I would prefer to count my blessings of staying in Singapore. The laws are strict albeit with certain amount of biasness to our current government. But in Singapore we feel safe. The uniformity of life and the and the security we enjoy is so easily taken forgranted. Have you travelled to any of the countries in South East Asia and have to make sure that your wallet is tightly zipped in your pocket and you have to clutch your bag so tightly to prevent being picked. In Singapore we can see people leaving their bags on tables in fast food restaurants to buy food. We take this small privilege for granted easily. I was talking to an American friend on his visit to Singapore. He was very impressed with the system that was in place in Singapore. The buses and the MRT system is so convenient that we almost do not need a car unless we do not want to squeeze in crowded buses or we would like our own transport. Our roads apparently are much more well maintained then America! The world&#039;s most powerful country! America is an example of the world for freedom of speech as well as political movement. But where has that taken it? People are allowed to own guns, rifles or even semi-automatic sniper rifles. What kind of rubbish is that? You want to live in a place that you worry that a bullet will be put through your head just because you stared at a stranger? Students have to be fetched right back to their homes just because of this threat. We Singaporeans need not worry too much if our children come home at unearthly hours at 12 am. Where else in the world can we find that kind of safety. Try doing that in Indonesia? Malaysia? Russia? UK? America? Singaporeans pay one of the most cheapest indirect taxes. What I am trying to say is GST. Our GST is very low compared to UK VAT taxes. I study economics. Indirect taxes hurt the poor more then the rich. Because it taxes equally across the income stream. We might lament about our CPF. Did you know that in America, it was a choice not to fund their 401k plan? that is the equivalent of CPF in Singapore. What happened then. People who did not save a single cent while they were healthy and working were left to fend for themselves when a sudden misfortune caused them to lose their ability to work. there are much more homeless people lying in the streets in America then in Singapore. Lets not even compare to any of the other countries in Southeast Asia. The only other country in South East Asia that is wealthy enough is Brunei, which is rich in Petrol Dollars. What about the UK? They were famous for their welfare system. Providing free medical care to all people using taxpayers money. We all know that if our polyclinics are totally FOC for any treatments, we will line up first thing in the morning to get our teeth cleaned by the polyclinic dentist? Or just to go for any minor treatments of headache, cough, flu... etc. What if you are really sick? you would have to queue up with the rest of the minor cases and suffer. We also have to take into account that our polyclinics are heavily subsidised. The point I am trying to put across to everyone here is that PAP might not be all perfect. Like all other political systems in the world. But it has brought Singapore from a third world country to a first world country. We might argue that our income disparity is growing. However this is just the beginning of globalization. I do not know how PAP is going to continue to tackle that. But I do have that confidence that more measures would be put into place to ensure that all those who are left behind have a certain amount of chance to move up the income level. Just to provide a little information about me. I am a university student who had to teach tuition and do part time accounting to earn my pocket money while I am studying. My family had always been surviving on just enough for 20 years as my dad is just a bank clerk earning 3k per month to support a family of 5. I wouldn&#039;t say I am at the bottom of the income level. But I am definitely not in the upper rungs of the society. the part of society where I am working had to strive towards given the opportunity and the help provided by the government. I have l;ofty ambitions to bring my family to a more comfortable income level. And that can only be possible because of PAP. Lets all take a step back and count our blessings before we start to criticise on the wrongdoings of PAP. Take care.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>I read through the comments that have been posted as well as the article. I understand how you guys feel and all that. We are all scared that one day PAP would govern under absolute power and it would turn from &#8217;socialist&#8217; to dictatorship. That was one of my fears too. However, I would prefer to count my blessings of staying in Singapore. The laws are strict albeit with certain amount of biasness to our current government. But in Singapore we feel safe. The uniformity of life and the and the security we enjoy is so easily taken forgranted. Have you travelled to any of the countries in South East Asia and have to make sure that your wallet is tightly zipped in your pocket and you have to clutch your bag so tightly to prevent being picked. In Singapore we can see people leaving their bags on tables in fast food restaurants to buy food. We take this small privilege for granted easily. I was talking to an American friend on his visit to Singapore. He was very impressed with the system that was in place in Singapore. The buses and the MRT system is so convenient that we almost do not need a car unless we do not want to squeeze in crowded buses or we would like our own transport. Our roads apparently are much more well maintained then America! The world&#8217;s most powerful country! America is an example of the world for freedom of speech as well as political movement. But where has that taken it? People are allowed to own guns, rifles or even semi-automatic sniper rifles. What kind of rubbish is that? You want to live in a place that you worry that a bullet will be put through your head just because you stared at a stranger? Students have to be fetched right back to their homes just because of this threat. We Singaporeans need not worry too much if our children come home at unearthly hours at 12 am. Where else in the world can we find that kind of safety. Try doing that in Indonesia? Malaysia? Russia? UK? America? Singaporeans pay one of the most cheapest indirect taxes. What I am trying to say is GST. Our GST is very low compared to UK VAT taxes. I study economics. Indirect taxes hurt the poor more then the rich. Because it taxes equally across the income stream. We might lament about our CPF. Did you know that in America, it was a choice not to fund their 401k plan? that is the equivalent of CPF in Singapore. What happened then. People who did not save a single cent while they were healthy and working were left to fend for themselves when a sudden misfortune caused them to lose their ability to work. there are much more homeless people lying in the streets in America then in Singapore. Lets not even compare to any of the other countries in Southeast Asia. The only other country in South East Asia that is wealthy enough is Brunei, which is rich in Petrol Dollars. What about the UK? They were famous for their welfare system. Providing free medical care to all people using taxpayers money. We all know that if our polyclinics are totally FOC for any treatments, we will line up first thing in the morning to get our teeth cleaned by the polyclinic dentist? Or just to go for any minor treatments of headache, cough, flu&#8230; etc. What if you are really sick? you would have to queue up with the rest of the minor cases and suffer. We also have to take into account that our polyclinics are heavily subsidised. The point I am trying to put across to everyone here is that PAP might not be all perfect. Like all other political systems in the world. But it has brought Singapore from a third world country to a first world country. We might argue that our income disparity is growing. However this is just the beginning of globalization. I do not know how PAP is going to continue to tackle that. But I do have that confidence that more measures would be put into place to ensure that all those who are left behind have a certain amount of chance to move up the income level. Just to provide a little information about me. I am a university student who had to teach tuition and do part time accounting to earn my pocket money while I am studying. My family had always been surviving on just enough for 20 years as my dad is just a bank clerk earning 3k per month to support a family of 5. I wouldn&#8217;t say I am at the bottom of the income level. But I am definitely not in the upper rungs of the society. the part of society where I am working had to strive towards given the opportunity and the help provided by the government. I have l;ofty ambitions to bring my family to a more comfortable income level. And that can only be possible because of PAP. Lets all take a step back and count our blessings before we start to criticise on the wrongdoings of PAP. Take care.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: kpkb</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20513</link>
		<dc:creator>kpkb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 08:27:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20513</guid>
		<description>24) PAP Is SHIT! on September 3rd, 2008 12.35 am 

I think sporeans should not grumble anymore. Just always accept the status quo.
The people have spoken, remember?

We should welcome FTs, help them integrate here nicely, happily, welcome them to compete with our rice bowl, and never forget to thank them from the bottom of our hearts that without them, many companies would leave here leaving you no jobs ah.

We should welcome them to ask , encourage , urge, welcome their relatives , loved ones and friends from all over to come here and apply. They should have a degree to make things easy. Not a problem. In china and india, so many have degrees from their countries. Just apply. One by one, they come here, make themselves comfortable, then ask their friend to come also and share rentals, show them the place and integrate to society. 

At the moment, they can bring as many like themselves to apply for citizenship. If all goes well, it takes very short time only. I am not sure which country is faster. Any clues?

So, singaporeans should see thousands more soon and prolly 1 hundred thousand more at least the a short future. The target was said like 6 million or so. Still plenty of room to hit the quota.

Singaporeans should not:
1. feel uneasy about their wage driven downwards due to more supply of workers to this tiny market. They should embrace and welcome if not love new citizens who come from FT and PR.

2. feel uncomfortable with new people. They should learn to eat their food, learn their culture and respect them.

singaporeans doing the services should also protect all that is living in spore. Feel proud that you are potentially sacrificing yourselves to protect everyone. Once a year only, you get called back to serve again. Feel proud. Your FT can cover your duties while you enjoy your NS.

Employers here must already be happy. They should continue to feel even more happy as now there is the S-Pass, which makes importing workers so much easier. They should enjoy the good supply of choices to pick from. Hopefully, more labor in the market lowers business costs and that means more profit for themselves. They should love FTs. Some companies give up when they cannot compete and thankfully, the good supply of labor helps them find cheaper resources. These bosses must also be thanking the FTs.

Last but not least, the sports sector should invite more new citizens if locals cannot win at internations events.  Local sports people who are not as good should welcome them and ask them to be their &#039;see-fu&#039; teacher to teach them how to run, walk, cycle, swim, climb, jump, pingpong, squash, badminton, tennis better. 

Last but still not least, the Opposition should embrace FT strategists to help them in areas they are weak in. To serve the people better. FTs can work behind the scenes until they become new citizens. Who says Opposition should have talent shortage problem? They need to ask themselves, are they doing enough? Have they worked hard enough? Are they doing what is possible? Frankly, I do not see them having reached their full potential. 

So, I hope singapore becomes super more competitive, let it be more costly to live if that is the way to go. Lets enjoy the intense competition and remember to pay our bills and whatever taxes. The country needs funds to do national developement work like building libraries for ALL to use. You are no longer competiting with local singaporeans for rice bowl. You are competiting with anyone in the world.

Enjoy more good years. You will not regret it. The majority have not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>24) PAP Is SHIT! on September 3rd, 2008 12.35 am </p>
<p>I think sporeans should not grumble anymore. Just always accept the status quo.<br />
The people have spoken, remember?</p>
<p>We should welcome FTs, help them integrate here nicely, happily, welcome them to compete with our rice bowl, and never forget to thank them from the bottom of our hearts that without them, many companies would leave here leaving you no jobs ah.</p>
<p>We should welcome them to ask , encourage , urge, welcome their relatives , loved ones and friends from all over to come here and apply. They should have a degree to make things easy. Not a problem. In china and india, so many have degrees from their countries. Just apply. One by one, they come here, make themselves comfortable, then ask their friend to come also and share rentals, show them the place and integrate to society. </p>
<p>At the moment, they can bring as many like themselves to apply for citizenship. If all goes well, it takes very short time only. I am not sure which country is faster. Any clues?</p>
<p>So, singaporeans should see thousands more soon and prolly 1 hundred thousand more at least the a short future. The target was said like 6 million or so. Still plenty of room to hit the quota.</p>
<p>Singaporeans should not:<br />
1. feel uneasy about their wage driven downwards due to more supply of workers to this tiny market. They should embrace and welcome if not love new citizens who come from FT and PR.</p>
<p>2. feel uncomfortable with new people. They should learn to eat their food, learn their culture and respect them.</p>
<p>singaporeans doing the services should also protect all that is living in spore. Feel proud that you are potentially sacrificing yourselves to protect everyone. Once a year only, you get called back to serve again. Feel proud. Your FT can cover your duties while you enjoy your NS.</p>
<p>Employers here must already be happy. They should continue to feel even more happy as now there is the S-Pass, which makes importing workers so much easier. They should enjoy the good supply of choices to pick from. Hopefully, more labor in the market lowers business costs and that means more profit for themselves. They should love FTs. Some companies give up when they cannot compete and thankfully, the good supply of labor helps them find cheaper resources. These bosses must also be thanking the FTs.</p>
<p>Last but not least, the sports sector should invite more new citizens if locals cannot win at internations events.  Local sports people who are not as good should welcome them and ask them to be their &#8217;see-fu&#8217; teacher to teach them how to run, walk, cycle, swim, climb, jump, pingpong, squash, badminton, tennis better. </p>
<p>Last but still not least, the Opposition should embrace FT strategists to help them in areas they are weak in. To serve the people better. FTs can work behind the scenes until they become new citizens. Who says Opposition should have talent shortage problem? They need to ask themselves, are they doing enough? Have they worked hard enough? Are they doing what is possible? Frankly, I do not see them having reached their full potential. </p>
<p>So, I hope singapore becomes super more competitive, let it be more costly to live if that is the way to go. Lets enjoy the intense competition and remember to pay our bills and whatever taxes. The country needs funds to do national developement work like building libraries for ALL to use. You are no longer competiting with local singaporeans for rice bowl. You are competiting with anyone in the world.</p>
<p>Enjoy more good years. You will not regret it. The majority have not.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Just another Singaporean</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20446</link>
		<dc:creator>Just another Singaporean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 11:53:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20446</guid>
		<description>80) slimfold on September 6th, 2008 12.26 pm

You are dealing with something which I feel is very natural and to a certain extent very primal. 

This discriminating process started the day one is born where one&#039;s young life is revolved among people of the same kind (close family members of the same skin colour) with daily reinforcement till one reaches a stage where he / she has a chance to mix with other races where these rare encounters are still skewed in favour of the majority. This is equally true for religion practice and people of different races, not necessarily between majority and minority. 

That is why it is very very important that we must NOT engage in unnecessary loose talks and comments based on race and religion. It is easy for these sensitive issues to get out of hand and escalate into something very uncontrollable.

Minority will always be minority and the mixing by both must be proactive, regular and prolonged enough (not just casual) for deeper understanding &amp; mutual respect to be cemented. Myths, if any, by the majority on the minority has to be debunked and unlearned. I hope the majority will take more effort in helping the minority to assimilate better as the latter by virtue of being minority will definitely want to their part to fit in as best as they can.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>80) slimfold on September 6th, 2008 12.26 pm</p>
<p>You are dealing with something which I feel is very natural and to a certain extent very primal. </p>
<p>This discriminating process started the day one is born where one&#8217;s young life is revolved among people of the same kind (close family members of the same skin colour) with daily reinforcement till one reaches a stage where he / she has a chance to mix with other races where these rare encounters are still skewed in favour of the majority. This is equally true for religion practice and people of different races, not necessarily between majority and minority. </p>
<p>That is why it is very very important that we must NOT engage in unnecessary loose talks and comments based on race and religion. It is easy for these sensitive issues to get out of hand and escalate into something very uncontrollable.</p>
<p>Minority will always be minority and the mixing by both must be proactive, regular and prolonged enough (not just casual) for deeper understanding &amp; mutual respect to be cemented. Myths, if any, by the majority on the minority has to be debunked and unlearned. I hope the majority will take more effort in helping the minority to assimilate better as the latter by virtue of being minority will definitely want to their part to fit in as best as they can.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Victor</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20445</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 11:48:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20445</guid>
		<description>hai....
so sad...
only the next general electron don make me sad again...
PLEASE SINGAPOREANS....

most hate but still votes them.. awake lo.

but i want to say one thing,police is control by GOV,,GOV is control by PAP MEMber. so police will support PAP,not others..

USELESS something need to change clearly in singapore...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hai&#8230;.<br />
so sad&#8230;<br />
only the next general electron don make me sad again&#8230;<br />
PLEASE SINGAPOREANS&#8230;.</p>
<p>most hate but still votes them.. awake lo.</p>
<p>but i want to say one thing,police is control by GOV,,GOV is control by PAP MEMber. so police will support PAP,not others..</p>
<p>USELESS something need to change clearly in singapore&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: slimfold</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20404</link>
		<dc:creator>slimfold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 04:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20404</guid>
		<description>Do not be amused too much on September 3rd, 2008 10.55 am 

Obviously, you have assumed that I do not mind such double standards exist in Singapore, where meritocracy and racial harmony are touted as our plus points.

Perhaps I need to be more forthright to put it blatantly.

Why in the first place I chose to point out the kind of double standards faced by our minority members? They are more significant than the PM cycling in ECP while previously the WP was denied.............. because I am talking about the small people like my friends who each day have to face discriminations NOT from the top leaders, but from ordinary people of the majority. 

How would you feel if someone moved to another seat in the bus because you happen to sit beside the person, and your skin is dark? 

While you expect a high standard of fairplay from the leaders, I expect us to look deeply into ourselves to see that we are not guilty of double standards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do not be amused too much on September 3rd, 2008 10.55 am </p>
<p>Obviously, you have assumed that I do not mind such double standards exist in Singapore, where meritocracy and racial harmony are touted as our plus points.</p>
<p>Perhaps I need to be more forthright to put it blatantly.</p>
<p>Why in the first place I chose to point out the kind of double standards faced by our minority members? They are more significant than the PM cycling in ECP while previously the WP was denied&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.. because I am talking about the small people like my friends who each day have to face discriminations NOT from the top leaders, but from ordinary people of the majority. </p>
<p>How would you feel if someone moved to another seat in the bus because you happen to sit beside the person, and your skin is dark? </p>
<p>While you expect a high standard of fairplay from the leaders, I expect us to look deeply into ourselves to see that we are not guilty of double standards.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Singapore Daily &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Roundup: Week 36</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20386</link>
		<dc:creator>The Singapore Daily &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Roundup: Week 36</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 02:59:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20386</guid>
		<description>[...] Party - When I&#8217;m Bored: Isn&#8217;t this a sign of unfairness and double standard? - TOC: Political openness - for PAP only [Recommended] - mrbrown: Workers’ Party mass cycling at East Coast Park cannot, PAP carnival at [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Party &#8211; When I&#8217;m Bored: Isn&#8217;t this a sign of unfairness and double standard? &#8211; TOC: Political openness &#8211; for PAP only [Recommended] &#8211; mrbrown: Workers’ Party mass cycling at East Coast Park cannot, PAP carnival at [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: white raven</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20377</link>
		<dc:creator>white raven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 01:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20377</guid>
		<description>Four legs good. Two legs bad.

Four legs good. Two legs better.

- George Orwell, Animal Farm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Four legs good. Two legs bad.</p>
<p>Four legs good. Two legs better.</p>
<p>- George Orwell, Animal Farm.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mr.Learn</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20371</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr.Learn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 00:10:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20371</guid>
		<description>For many who have grown up with the PAP, I think we should thank them for the live examples of poor leadership. The examples cited will allow Singaporeans to decided during the next elections. Growing up, I have noticed the following examples.

1) Stylo milo slogans that have no substance
2) Telling people to keep upgrading, work longer, start a family, Don&#039;t be choosy,and be gracious, last but not least .. PAP is good for you.
3)Ministers making very general statments with no roadmap on how to get there
4)Ministers making conflicting statements --- recent one is the Affordable cars and ERP relationship 

Its funny how the Main stream media is keeping quiet about this when theres so much buzz on the internet about this issue. 

Very general question to our elite MPs, do you know who in your neighbourhood need help ? if the answer is no, what are you doing about it ? 

Are you going to them or you are waiting for them to come to you ?  Gracious society ...........Please don&#039;t tell me theres so few of you and so MANY of THEM.........MIght be good if you did a background study to see what caused the erosion for the people under YOUR CARE to begin with and propose options for a start with periodic reviews.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For many who have grown up with the PAP, I think we should thank them for the live examples of poor leadership. The examples cited will allow Singaporeans to decided during the next elections. Growing up, I have noticed the following examples.</p>
<p>1) Stylo milo slogans that have no substance<br />
2) Telling people to keep upgrading, work longer, start a family, Don&#8217;t be choosy,and be gracious, last but not least .. PAP is good for you.<br />
3)Ministers making very general statments with no roadmap on how to get there<br />
4)Ministers making conflicting statements &#8212; recent one is the Affordable cars and ERP relationship </p>
<p>Its funny how the Main stream media is keeping quiet about this when theres so much buzz on the internet about this issue. </p>
<p>Very general question to our elite MPs, do you know who in your neighbourhood need help ? if the answer is no, what are you doing about it ? </p>
<p>Are you going to them or you are waiting for them to come to you ?  Gracious society &#8230;&#8230;&#8230;..Please don&#8217;t tell me theres so few of you and so MANY of THEM&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;MIght be good if you did a background study to see what caused the erosion for the people under YOUR CARE to begin with and propose options for a start with periodic reviews.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: manny</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20338</link>
		<dc:creator>manny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 10:49:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20338</guid>
		<description>I HAVE LOST MY RESPECT FOR THEM!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I HAVE LOST MY RESPECT FOR THEM!!!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tantalizine &#187; Blog Archive &#187; WEST COAST CYCLING: PAP DID NO WRONG!</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20331</link>
		<dc:creator>Tantalizine &#187; Blog Archive &#187; WEST COAST CYCLING: PAP DID NO WRONG!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 09:20:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20331</guid>
		<description>[...] 5th September 2008. The PAP would like to rebut the hullabaloo as posted on the alternative views forum The Online Citizen. Following PM Lee’s National Day [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 5th September 2008. The PAP would like to rebut the hullabaloo as posted on the alternative views forum The Online Citizen. Following PM Lee’s National Day [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: &#187; Did the PAP break the law? For Want of a Better Title</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20323</link>
		<dc:creator>&#187; Did the PAP break the law? For Want of a Better Title</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 08:10:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20323</guid>
		<description>[...] Loh, Deputy Editor at The Online Citizen, seems to be implying that the PAP did break a law or that the police were lax in the application of .... I think that Mr Loh should fact check before making such statements as &#8220;On what moral [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Loh, Deputy Editor at The Online Citizen, seems to be implying that the PAP did break a law or that the police were lax in the application of &#8230;. I think that Mr Loh should fact check before making such statements as &#8220;On what moral [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: percevale</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20320</link>
		<dc:creator>percevale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 07:09:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20320</guid>
		<description>As a trained Public Relations Consultant, I&#039;m here to debunk the idea that the law adopts different standards for political parties.

Following PM Lee&#039;s National Day rally speech regarding the relaxation of rules on public demonstrations (albeit within Hong Lim) and increasing liberties for freedom of speech and political videos. 

PAP&#039;s demonstration at West Coast was leadership by example at it&#039;s finest. Theirs was the first step towards proving that political parties can and should begin to engage in public engaging activities. PM Lee has spoken, let&#039;s move on and move forward.

Perceptually, it seems as if the PAP has gone against the law. However, this first tentative steps towards political liberalisation and greater freedoms should be applauded and not derided. It is PM Lee&#039;s way of proving that if he can get away with it, it means that the Executive Branch has already set things in motion and that the Legislative Branch would be following suit and amending all statuettes that rendered freedom of speech/expression illegal.

It is not a u-turn, merely a revision to the original intent of the rights as promised within the constitution.

I thank you for your kind attention.

*Where can I apply to be the Press Secretary for the PM&#039;s Office?*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a trained Public Relations Consultant, I&#8217;m here to debunk the idea that the law adopts different standards for political parties.</p>
<p>Following PM Lee&#8217;s National Day rally speech regarding the relaxation of rules on public demonstrations (albeit within Hong Lim) and increasing liberties for freedom of speech and political videos. </p>
<p>PAP&#8217;s demonstration at West Coast was leadership by example at it&#8217;s finest. Theirs was the first step towards proving that political parties can and should begin to engage in public engaging activities. PM Lee has spoken, let&#8217;s move on and move forward.</p>
<p>Perceptually, it seems as if the PAP has gone against the law. However, this first tentative steps towards political liberalisation and greater freedoms should be applauded and not derided. It is PM Lee&#8217;s way of proving that if he can get away with it, it means that the Executive Branch has already set things in motion and that the Legislative Branch would be following suit and amending all statuettes that rendered freedom of speech/expression illegal.</p>
<p>It is not a u-turn, merely a revision to the original intent of the rights as promised within the constitution.</p>
<p>I thank you for your kind attention.</p>
<p>*Where can I apply to be the Press Secretary for the PM&#8217;s Office?*</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: dodo</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/09/political-openness-for-pap-only/comment-page-2/#comment-20303</link>
		<dc:creator>dodo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 02:13:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=1322#comment-20303</guid>
		<description>if they disapprove, we do things other ways without the need for their approval. like our political talk-cocks at every corner coffee shops in singapore. who says no freedom of speech ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>if they disapprove, we do things other ways without the need for their approval. like our political talk-cocks at every corner coffee shops in singapore. who says no freedom of speech ?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
