Can someone tell me is there such a thingie as karma?

Hi Mr Ho,

Among other things, you said, “We may not agree with his politics “. Many people would like to qualify with the same phrase like you when they talked about JBJ.

May I know WHAT ARE HIS POLITICS YOU MAY NOT AGREE WITH?

jy,good question…exactly this is what i always ask..

like-wise, what is so wrong n not proper about CSJ ? Ask oneself ,think carefully ,remain neutral, maybe that will help you digest …. btw, i’m not friend or associate to him.

I cannot speak for him, but there is a possibility Mr. Ho refers to JBJ’s *style* of politics (rather than politics), which I myself found uncomfortable most of my early days of being politically aware. It is the same style CSJ currently follows. I now possess a much greater sense of sympathy and understanding of why they would choose such an approach, but it still makes me uncomfortable.

Confrontational politics tends to bring emotion, usually non-constructive, into the political scene. It makes people (the politicians) angry and, imho, makes them choose poor decisions (eg. refusing to do something just because the “other side” suggested it). I felt it also made JBJ blunder into saying things that got him in trouble. Perhaps people would argue that the PAP would have twisted any of his words to the same effect, but being careful would have helped make the attempts to demonize him seem all the more baldfaced to the people.

More specifically, I used to be upset that JBJ had always seemed to challenge *every* single legislation put up by the PAP. Even things that seemed reasonable to me. I don’t know, perhaps I had not been wise enough then to have paid close enough attention to all of the reasons Mr Jeyaratnam puts forth in challenging the legislation. Back then, it just felt to me he was challenging authority for the sake of challenging authority. The PAP, to me at least, was arrogant and high-handed but they were not as a whole incompetent and was capable of good governance for the most part.

Anyway, this is from my perspective. It is becoming clearer to me Dr Chee is fighting at a different level … against the unfairness the government has built into the political system. It is confrontational (involving civil disobedience and all) and controversial, but is possibly the only way. His actions are based on the premise that the system is so badly off-kilter and stacked against opponents, you can never possibly win within the system even with the right intentions and ideas that help the people of Singapore. Perhaps one day I’ll agree with his approach, but I’m still trying to shake off the impression of him as a political maverick that began with his protest fast which in my opinion had too much of political drama to be serious to begin with.

Non-confrontational approach works only when the system is fair. When you have your opponents playing referee and judge at the same time, honestly what chances do you stand ?

Mr/Ms Ordinary,

Yes. Even among my closed friends… When we touched on JBJ or CSJ… they would say “they are too much”. I asked them, “Why did u say they are too much?”
They replied, “They defamed PM….”.
I asked, “How did he defamed?”
They replied, “I don’t know lah, the news paper reported that they defamed.”
I asked, “Apart from local newspapers, what have you read?”
They replied (getting a bit impatient already), “What got other newspaper? Where got time?” They then continued, “Don’t talk about this anymore lah…..”

jy (#7):

Your speech reminds me of discussing political development with PSC overseas scholars. A common reply I get is “I have no opinion”.

I don’t want people with this kind of mentality to lead the administrative service. They definitely do not deserve the civil service’s super pay scale (S$300K – S$1.2M p.a) especially when they are seating in the driver’s seat and not evaluating what direction to take.

I understand that participating in political parties or NGOs while as an overseas scholar would be breeching the scholarship contract, but Singapore, especially the Civil Service, does not have an evnironment to stimulate personal interest in the developent of the local civil society. In the end, no matter how intelligent the PSC overseas scholars are, they will turned into yes-man over time.

PAP is not just a political party, but also a doctrine. To save Singapore from its impending doom, we need not only to rid PAP but also its doctrine.

“One final note to the Prime Minister: it is embarrassing to point out that 15 years after Senior Minister Goh had to intervene to stop JBJ’s sons from being treated as personae non gratae, a significant proportion of the voting public continues to believe that criticizing the ruling party will lead them becoming marked men or women. So much for the PAP being thought of as a terrific defender of Parliamentary tradition in a form we could call “democratic”.”

Hear, hear. So thinketh my parents, too.

There is one sickening impression that I have of all the Opposition Politicians, Mr JB Jeyaretnam included though he dedicated his whole life to the people. And that is, the Opposition Politicians are not just opposing the Ruling Party, they oppose one another amongst themselves. There were also infightings.

When the Oppositions did get together, they were not capable of forging any common ground and collective objective.

patriot

It is a crying shame that many of us Singaporeans are only closet admirers
of Mr JBJ. What’s more lamentable is when we feel the need to qualify our
statements even in penning tributes to him. Isn’t it obvious that some of us
have not an ounce of the courage and sense of self respect the honourable
man possessed?

May many more of the likes of him walk in our midst!

Karma is intentional action, that is, a deed done deliberately through body, speech or mind. It is natural law that every action produces a certain effect. If someone performs wholesome actions, he or she will experience happiness. On the other hand, if one performs unwholesome actions or evel deeds, he or she will experience suffering later in life or even next life. Mr JBJ has performed very good deeds, he spend a large part of his life to speaking up for his fellow countrymen, he will definitely have good karma.

#7,

I’m sick of having this kind of conversation. I just don’t understand why people can take a stand condemning another person’s right to expression without exactly knowing why they are condemning them.

Unfortunately, having these kind of conversation is almost like a norm.

Sinkaporeans are brought up to believe that PAP folks are angels and can do no wrong, with the ST as the national gospel. No bad news must be good!

Mr Wang is right in saying that problems should be nipped in the bud when they are still small. Now thanks to a generation of blind faith, Sinkaporeans have to cope with that hell hound of a GRC.

DC, Donald Tan, Ordinary Man,

Thank u for your responses. All of us have come across such situation.

If someone has ruled this red dot for half a century and control all media, this is the inevitable outcome. Fortunately, we still have a small number, albeit small number, of people who could rise above such control..

It is an uphill task .. So what… Lets walk up the hill….. Lets swim against the tide…

jy,

the road is long, but together we will get there. Let us take the time to remember our forefathers who fought hard to attain their freedom from our British. Let us remember their struggles and some day, we’ll attain our freedoms once again.

When we do, like what Dr Chee said in his eulogy of Mr JBJ. We will get there because we stand on his [JBJ] shoulders.

The truth will set us free.

#11

Isn’t it obvious that some of us
have not an ounce of the courage and sense of self respect the honourable
man possessed?

My dear friend, not everyone are born with such courage ok ??????? each have their own role in life.

I thought JBJ had left a legacy for many to ponder over. His dedication to wanting to do good and serve the people is undoubting albeit I do agree with most who felt uncomfortable with his fearless confrontational style. I think most of us do possessed the capabilities to differentiate reasonably what this nation needed to loosen up to make it a more viable place for all to live in (in particular the politcal environment). Oddly as it seemed, our nemesis may not necessary be directly linked to the complete workings of the current governing party. It may well be our inner fear that is sub-conciously suppressing our conscience in doing the right thing during election time to further improve our better humane living.

I certainly hope it is appopriate for rme to share the following in hope that we can sustain our passion to support and want to see change long enough and make the right decision come next election. It is indeed a very tall task but nevertheless impossible.

“The Fear Factor – Mastery of this psychological weaponry”
Much have been said and debated about the mindset of the Singapore citizenry not in the top 20 percentile that were feeling depressed, anguished, sympathetic and of course the sufferings particularly the lower-income group and yet time and again had not been able to cast that important vote for change in past elections. Much have been alluded to either being stigmatized as pro PAP or those who were neutral being apathetic, ignorant, overly concerned on material well being and heaps of other insinuation.

For the older generation (like me), one needs to flash back and reflect on history and how Singapore evolved. During the Japanese occupation, there is no lack of examples and testaments that most captives or common citizenry of Singapore shivers at the sight of a Uniformed Japanese albeit he is just one of those pitiful lower ranking soldier. Indeed the fear factor that the Japanese warring military had imbibe it to the lower ranking officers and soldiers and this warfare teachings had been deeply rooted in them and down flow to the captives.

Evidently, this psychological weaponry had been carefully crafted (twisted) and cleverly deployed time and again in the Singapore context to ensure the continuing abundance of voters to keep the current government in power. One need not ask who has master minded behind this formidable strategy and had indoctrinate like a bible, enshrined to be worshiped, and refined over time by those selected elite disciples who are the ultimate beneficiaries or had benefited from upholding and deciphering the doctrines

Yes, FEAR indeed is a terrifying singular syllabus word that consciously or sub-consciously had enveloped us in many aspects of our life; in our growing up process and in some varying degree may indeed haunt some of us for the rest of a human’s life time. On an individual level, we may fear of darkness, fear of failing, fear of loosing, fear of poverty, fear of being persecuted, fear of infringing the strict rules and laws governing us, fear of being attack, fear of expressing due to the lack of confidence in the expressed language use, fear of public speaking and loads more. The lists are endless.

“Confronting your inner self to renew your confidence of choice”
How does one confront and counter such powerful psychological weaponry that has silently penetrated our sub-conscious mindsets?

First, we have to understand the teachings of Confucius. The essence of Confucianism is family values. This is a unique culture that has been upheld and cherished by most Chinese or people of Asian ethnics. It is not presumptuous to say that our Chinese forefathers migrated or flee to escape the hardship and strangle hold of the cruelty of China rulers in search of a safer haven for us. We, a majority of us are generally descendants of the peasant class of China. The rest is history in the making. As time passes by us, we have almost being rid of the independent thinking process and in most cases were brought up to not questioning our parents, teachers, seniors, the right from wrong. It is a virtue that many of us are still very in tuned with.

Apparently, this virtue could possibly become an eventual burden that had affected our ability to shrug off the dependency behavior ingeniously concerted and deliberately reinforced in our educational system that most of our citizenry is acquainted with and that if this had been continually exploited as a political tool.

So on this basis, are the suffering Singaporeans (young and old); apathetic, ignorant, timid, material minded that we are so weak as to say no to policies where it now hurt most? Are they too selfish? A closer examination may help unlock the myth behind the fear factor alibi that resulted for some to insinuate that the current sufferings deserved the state they are in today as they had help in retaining by voting the government time and again to rule over them.

Let’s examine this closer by citing two distinct groups as examples. One of the groups who have immediate family members to consider (has grand parents, parents, spouse, siblings, relatives, closed friends). and if they the immediate family members are fearful or do not share the same view or do not accord you with the support to engage, and you being a considerate member of the family, it is likely you will suppress yourself consciously or sub-consciously to remain silence. The fear of expressing openly or privately on current issues that had hurt them then or now could be attributed to the concern of their immediate family. Think about it, if from a young age you are being thought with refined Confucianism, fed with doctrines that these quality values are to be upheld as it is a traditional culture of every Chinese. When you grow up, a lot of your decisions are by and large influenced by this train of thoughts. It is not an evil doctrine by itself, but when it is being twisted with a political flare, the resulting effect can be of wide impact. That may have explained why a majority of us are unable to (break) this bond.

On the contrary (the second group), if you are living without any KINS (grand parents, parents, spouse, kids, siblings, relatives, closed friends and so on), or you have already the full support of your family members, the fear factor indicator is much reduced when so much pain and sufferings had been inflicted or caused to a point where you can no longer accept. Then you will probably be more inclined to be vociferous. As you would have nothing to concern with but for the principle you believe is the right thing to do.

“Fear Factor – Myth that can be busted?”
Do remember, before the advent of internet, you hear lesser or no discontent from citizenry in the past (thanks to the much controlled MSM); that does not mean we are all feeling happy but because we have no other alternative medium to express our displeasure if we are so fearful to voice our opinion publicly under the current ruling government. Is this due to miss-conception or Ignorance or apathetic or the lack of understanding of our basic rights or because of the fear for our immediate family members?

The need to engage and participate online if you have access to the internet and transform this online participation to casting that sacred vote come election time is quite imminent. The need to share your inner feelings with your immediate family members to root for support for a worthy cause is indeed a decision that has far reaching impact but only you can drive. Whatever and whichever decision you may want to take, that I think is an individual’s choice that we should all respect.

JBJ died defeated in his belief but most Singaporeans still worshipped him a Great Politician of Singapore. To make Spreakers’ Corner stand out and serve a purpose , why not erect a Bust or Statue there to remember JBJ…paksi bochau hero.The money for it can come from public donation which will not be too difficult to collect. Will one of the significant JBJ supporters start the ball rolling ?
Obama and Osamasama lah

Irregardless hero or commoner, it’s still immoral to disrespect the dead.

Besides, the dead cant file a defamation suit.

I think that it is absolutely shameful that our Prime Minister did not have the courtesy to be nice in his condolence message. Really, if one did not like the deceased, one should just keep quiet and give a little respect. Something like being polite, if that was difficult to understand. There was no need to bring up the negative as this was not a personnel report. Singaporeans have seen enough to know how they feel about JBJ and there is no need for further opinion from either side. I do not believe that there is so much insecurity about public sentiment regarding this issue that such statements were called for.

[...] of JBJ – Singapore Complain Hub: Discovering JBJ – A Stranger, A Legend, A Politician – TOC: JBJ – a tribute and a response to PM’s letter – Singapore Dino: PAP even afraid of Mr Jeyaretnam’s ghost – UncleYap: Part 3 of Mr [...]

Many would fail to realise that the many bills and amendments which JBJ opposed, which non the less were approved without much ado in paliament are the very ones which are affecting or should I sayrve the peoplehurting the ordinary folks now. It is sad to hear some sorry ass of an MP declaring that JBJ was not constructive in paliament. Well JBJ saw the bigger picture and the implication on the future. Someone should look at make public the things JBJ argued against in paliament so that people will realise how relevant he was. Those who have read his books will have an better insight on the man and his ideals. The rest should know too. People can claim to have made sacrifices to serve the people and not enriches themselves but you can’t hide the truth for ever.

In his own way, JBJ has left his mark “for” Singapore (not just “on” Singapore).

May JBJ’s demise give us cause to pause and ponder … when is the day that we Singaporeans will THINK and STAND UP for ourselves?

That will be the day when our votes will really COUNT! That too will be the day that the Government will start to serve the people – and not us “kow-towing” (Chinese dialect for “subserviently bowing”) to them!

The Pariah, http://www.singaporeenbloc.blogspot.com

Who do you think is more constructive, a yes-sir MP whose yeses earned him lots of money, or a JBJ who fought with conviction and lost all his earthly assets?

I have got a friend who said that he was afraid to vote for the candidate he actually prefered because “THEY” know who he voted for and also in future his kids will have problem getting into local U. What kind of rubbish is that? First of all, I truely believe that our voting process is transperent, our ballet papers will be kept in the high court’s store for 6 months and after that it will be incinarated. Secondly, I also believe that as long as our kids are capable academically, they will never have problem getting into the local U. So, if there are good people like the late JBJ, Potong Pasir Mr CHiam, Hougang Mr Low and Syvia Lim, we should give them a chance.

#23

DP – that is a great idea. If I find time, I might start such a project on my blog. Should make a nice archive too, collating and documenting the parliamentary issues discussed by Mr Jeyaratnam.

Anyone knows if this has already been done?

Right now, the only sources of information I can think of are 1) Newspapers 2) Parliament archives 3) Workers’ Party archives and maybe 4) Reform Party archives. That way, we can have a reasoned discussion of the man’s life’s work. I feel bad having to describe how I feel towards his political approach from hunches and personal impressions rather than from direct fact.

Chee Wai

Great that you willing to take up the idea. One of my interest has been to trace issues, arguments and ideas put forth by our opposition as well as NMPS over the years. To be fair to our opposition they have raised many relevant points which were criticised, condemned and at times mocked without any discussion just becuase it did not originate from the ruling elite. This was not limited to JBJ alone. Over the years some of these ideas and issues have been repackaged, rehatched and implemented as the brilliant ideas of our division one leaders. Many do not know that plagiarism is not confined to acdemia alone. For example, I was very surprised when someone mentioned that the Marina Barrage idea was tossed around by someone else even before it was attributed as the great idea of LKY. Don’t know if that is true but its something worth exploring.

JBJ is “confontative” and people are not comfortable with this kind of style?

Gee…
There are also confrontative people in other parties you know…
(Insert comments about duster knuckles and cul-de-sac here)

Gah, that’s supposed to be “knuckle dusters”.

The condolence messages felt short of sympathy, for the matter, condolences. It was like delivering crude oil which is of no real use if not refined. This ‘crude oil’ delivered wlll not ‘lubricate’ wounded hearts and souls!
Much is left to conscious of our learned PM and SM!!!