It has become a sore to the eyes of the policymakers that the residents enjoy their own little delight in their vicinity. Have you forgotten to apply for licence and pay for the use of land? Maybe, you did not find out from your Town Council that they have a set of rules and regulations on the use of Government land.

Hi All,

I just received a phonecall from the manager of the zone my block is in. I am very very upset and angry to hear that the only excuse he gave was “I get people complain that there are rodents in the area so we clear everything!”

This is a very very poor excuse as it showns that the manager have not done his research about rodents and their habitat. I have insisted that the email be forwarded to his boss.

Rafiz

Instead of ridding the rodents, the authority removed the garden and dispersed the company of the gardening folks. Talks of efficiency and talents leading the communities and country, look at the ways they solved little problems!

Singaporeans are likely to face more cold and heartless treatments and can expect more shoddy performances due to the ongoing financial crisis which will get worse by the days. Be prepared for more difficulties.

patriot

Hi Rafiz,
why don’t you forward the emails to the MPs directly? At least then, they have to do some PR.
Get the PAP HQ to forward your mail?
paphq@pap.org.sg

This town council personal inherited the arrogant attitudes from our current PAP garman. So sad to see certain TC services deteriorated.

some things NEVER change – do they?

Rafiz, your story has so much similiarities with one of the Read Singapore books that were put up by NLB for nationwide discussion as part of its effort to promote reading. I cannot remember the name of the Malay author but the title is: ‘The Aging Tree’. I think the original version was written in malay.

It talks about a younger generation of family members deciding to chop down a tree that they found no longer useful in their modernised thinking. However, they failed to realise that it represented the life and soul of the old man. The tree, according to the old man, had provided a whole lifetime of uncountable positives to the family but was now deemed useless.

You might want to take a look if you haven’t done so already.

Regards to your update on the rodent excuse. Why is it not surprising to me? If the top people treats its citizens like pests what would you not expect from the keuy lapis layers further down?

this confirms to me that it is time for this govt to go and all its followers along with them as well.

we need to make a statement – and a really LOUD one – when the opportunity comes.

sad indeed,
every month pay so much for the service and conservancy charges don’t know for what.
i thought they hire cheap labour for block sweeping and washing.. organise some bonding activities once in a while which only the old aunties will join.. that’s all.
i still can’t see where my money goes, can someone enlighten me?
sad, very sad indeed.

I also like to use this opportunity to highlight my observations of AMK Hub carpark where many pools of stagnant water exist that could potentially be mosquito breeding sites. Right now is great time for mossies to breed as there are more rainy days this quarter.

See all about the situation at the following photo site that all can view :
http://s478.photobucket.com/albums/rr143/stoompingg/

Internet ‘researchers’, Please relay this message to the responsible authorities.

these ppl are heartless…..brainless….they only know how to make sg a “fine” country…..fine as in Follow Instructions N Execute……nothing else……

Well… technically, a rat can live amongst the garden and thus it does provide a habitat for these pests. But I believe these are many way more attractive places for the rodents to stay than the garden, e.g. the rubbish dump, where there’s shelter and food.

If that’s a reason, it’s a very poor one indeed…

Or maybe the council was worried that the rats might feed on the herbs and mutate into opposition party members?

kill the rats or level the mountain? who’s the mp?

please write to the ST forum about this.

I think the rodents the person speaking about may be the people gathering at the herb garden everyday. The arrogance of some people.

I believe there that are herbs that actually REPEL pests.
I feel sad for the old folks too, there are already so little things for them to enjoy outside of the usual mahjong etc. The whole world they have grown up with is already gone!
Nevertheless, please press on and even if the justification sucks, tell them you are going to get the herb patch growing again.

I really wonder if the council for AMK actually did ask around or even use their eyes to see if anyone is using that plot.
Alas, million-dollar salaries does cause blindness to all.

Yea, so sad even though I don’t live in amk. Isn’t this the pm constituency? Why no consultation before demolition? Sack the manager for his arrogance. Folks should protest at the town council office.

teo soh lung on October 24th, 2008 3.38 pm
….. Folks should protest at the town council office….

It is an offence to protest anywhere other than Hong Lim Park without police permit.

You should move to Hong Kah GRC – there are many private gardens in the estate:

http://hongkahtown.blogspot.com/search/label/garden

Ang Mo Kio GRC is PM Lee Hsian Long´s constituency too.

Here are the MPs for Ang Mo Kio GRC:

MP for Teck Ghee- Mr Lee Hsien Loong
MP for Cheng San – Balaji Sadasivan
MP for Jalan Kayu – Mr Wee Siew Kim
MP for Kebun Baru – Mr Inderjit Singh
MP for Sengkang West – Dr Lam Pin Min
MP for Yio Chu Kang – Mr Seng Han Thong

Must CC´ed so many MPs. The Town Council Manager sounds insensitive.

(sigh) uncompassionate souls. What are they thinking? Its only rodents, have they heard how to use pesticides? So if someone complain that there are rodents in the bukit timah reserves park, they burn down the whole area? Are they real idiots? This is just appauling and shame on those who complain (if what they said is true even that is a dumb excuse).

It’s a conspiracy with the pharmaceutical industry. If all the old people can have herb garden, then they have herbs to medicate themselves and keep healthy. But then the big pharmarcies comprain, waaah if old people can grow their own medicine, we no business!!!! so, they removed the garden. So now the old people no choice have to rely on expensive medicine. So it justifies Medisave. Like dat oso dun understand?

Yishun Blk 819 is under Ang Mo Kio GRC and the MP for Yishun South is the famous Engineer Lee Bee Wah, or the Table Tennis Association Chairwoman,
She too busy firing people till no time to coach her TC Manager lah….

Shocking and deplorable.

A classic example of idiocy and lack of common sense.

Same story goes for those cat-culling fellas.

The display of hearlessness and callousness are getting more and more prominent and pronounced nowadays, starting with the 2% GST raise, the ministerial salary hike of 33%, the ceaseless greedy ERP charges and more and more new gantries being put up, the sudden surge in the electricity charges of 22% despite oil prices being down to $98 today from the high of $143 per barrel, the implementation of mean means-testing, the scheming to delay paying out the CPF money till the age of 85, the coming introduction of euthanasia or “mercy killing” being talked about by the Minister of Hell who professed to be a Buddhist but does not seem to know what compassion means …..

And expect more to come …. be alert and watch …. hard times really reveal the real character of the ruthless and heartless hard-people.

Big Picture – Community Initiative, Creativity, Social Bonding, Inter-Generational Togetherness, Team Spirit, Honor, Hard Work, Pride and Joy etc . . . . CULTIVATE AND ENCOURAGE IT. PRICELESS GRASSROOTS SYNERGY.

Small Picture – Destroy and Demolish. [it's the rats]-[might be the lowly, beneficial field mouse] or an ecological eyesore on state land or etc. . .

What Do We Get – Kill Enthusiasm, Hurt Feelings, Bitterness, Anger and Hate

NOW that the ground is flattened – Ang Mo Kio GRC think about Community Collaboration in Decision Making and Healing of Hurts!

Get the Herb Garden up and growing – and the Hearts of the people healed.

I’ve forwaded the email to Ms Lee Bee Wah, MP for the area immediately after receiving the phonecall. She has since activated two of her officers to contact me and the officers have requested for a meeting with me so as to better understand the issue. Apparently, the earlier email was written in a language that was too emotional and was not easily comprehendable.

So I crafted this reply which I hope would make more sense. Please point out to me if I am not accurate in my paraphrasing.

Thanks,
Rafiz

Email to JK Chin of NSS Zone D.

Dear Mr Chin,

Unfortunately I am engaged with a prior appointment throughout the day inclusive of the indicated timeslot. I will be available at 10 am Sunday Morning. Please notify me tomorrow to confirm.

In any case, here is a simpler rendition of the issue I raised:

1) There was a herbal garden surrounding Blk 819 Yishun street 81 that was destroyed on AM, 23rd October.

2) As a concerned resident and citizen I am expressing my utmost concern and unhappiness that the garden was destroyed as:

The garden was home and treasury to many herbal plants known and recognisable only by the senior citizens.

The herbal garden was 21 years old when it was unceremoniously destroyed

It was was the heart and soul of the senior citizens,

Was created and groomed by senior citizens of Blk 819.

The garden gave hope and keep the senior citizens active.

To the senior citizens who have put their sweat and soul in the garden, witnessing destruction it was very painful.

To add, the excuse for the destruction was unscientific and absurd thus confirming the lack of thought in deriving to the policy.

3) Although I have no direct interest to the garden, I do have direct interest to the happiness and joy of the multiracial senior citizens at my area. When the senior citizens are happy, they bring joy to my children.

4) For a garden of over 20 years old to be flattened implies a conscious decision to terminate a social norm associated with the garden. Intervention on social norms cannot be arbitrary as it implies an authoritarian decision. Therefore, it must be preceeded by an definitive study of the situation and appropriate action are taken only when substantive evidence indicate that the normative practices are destructive.

5) I am writing to relay the silenced voices of despair that I personally heard from the mouths of the senior citizens.

6) Thus I am keen to know if a rigorous study was indeed carried out before the destruction policy was endorsed. How reliable and valid were the information and analysis leading to the conclusion.

7) Without which, the destruction of the garden was unjustifiable.

8) Regardless, the whole process was in my opinion lacking consideration to the interests of voting residents. It was carried out mechanically and inhumanely. It has close resemblence to the thoughtless act of issuing a $200 fine to a senior citizen napping at the public park when it was raining as reported in the papers recently, only this is multiple times worse.

9) I request that the garden be returned unconditionally to the senior citizens here so as to bring back the joy in their faces and the true potrayal of active lifestyle (as opposed to the flawed image of senior citizens crowding the senior citizens’ corner with newspaper in their hands).

I hope the above points would suffice to help you understand the situation.

Thank You,
Rafiz Mohyi Hapipi
BSc. Psychology, MEd. T&D (Distinction)

Rafiz,

Maybe you can add in (but confirm first) that the residents were not aware of the removal of the garden until it was done.

27) Rafiz on October 25th, 2008 3.26 am

Very laudable effort. Although I do not live in Singapore now and neither am I the constiuent of the said area, I am a senior citizen and on behalf of my fellow mates, I would like to sincerely express my thank you for your kind deed.

This reminds me of the good old kampong days. By and large, we were poor but were rich in Neigbourhood Camaraderie. If only the current Singapore can return to half of this state of mind amongst citizenry, I think we all will live happier and feel more wealthy inside.

Thank you and appreciate for your sharing and caring.

Thanks Jackson,

What I can vouch for was, as a resident, I was not in the know.

In anycase, I am now entertaining a reply from the Chairman of RC for my zone. Unfortunately, unlike TOC contributors here, he was unable to understand the email. To quote,
___________________

Dear Mr Rafiz,

Good morning.

Thank you for the summary and for bringing this up on behalf of our senior citizen.

From the your summary, is sounds like there are a lot of unhappiness cause by the destruction of the herbs garden.

I am interested to understand more from the unhappy senior citizen as to why they see the action to an authoritarian decision.

Also keen to know what and how was the communication between the Town Council and the senior citizen.

Apologies that we have ask for the discussion to be at the time of your inconvenience.

Appreciate if you could let us get back to you if we could meet at your proposed timing.

(Name Removed)
Zone RC Chairman

Thank you & Regards

Together We Can Make A Difference

(Name Removed)
Designation
______________

and my reply:-

Dear Mr Name Removed,

I will be available at 10 am Sunday.

I am amazed if you are unable to see how the actions are seen as authoritarian. 21 years of effort were destroyed without slightest consideration of the feelings of these seniors. This is especially when the actions contradict the message of Active Ageing, ‘http://www.activeageingfestival.com.sg/index.php’ which for your information the Roadshow for Northeast CDC is now on going (25th & 26th October at field beside Hougang MRT). The destruction of the Herbs garden is analogous to the saying “like taking candy from a kid.”

As for the communication, you will have to find out for yourself. Regardless the communication, the decision and actions for the reasons supporting them were apalling.

If you are still keen to discuss, do notify me.

Regards,
Rafiz Mohyi Hapipi

Hi All,

Thanks for the views and support on this matter. I’ve taken some of your suggestions. The TC and RC has since contacted me to hopefully resolve the matter. I am standing firm that the matter is not one that needs resolution but one that requires systemic correction on the part of the policy makers. To quote a nature activist that had sent me a personal email, these “minds that are so used to things that are so well planned and sterile, cannot handle spontaneous, unplanned events, situations or settings, no matter how good and beneficial they can be.”

An associate has also since forwarded the email to NSS Plant Appreciation and Nature Singapore. My wife who is a social worker and presently handling the Active Ageing fair at Hougang has also brought the matter up to her colleagues.

Anrew has also contacted me to further move the concern which i will reply to him directly. I’ll continue to update you with the progress.

Thanks,
Rafiz

Maybe the herbs did not have a permit to gather, eh, I mean, to grow, and that is against the law. The herbs pose a danger to the welfare and peace of S’poreans. When will the herbs be charged in court for illegal assembly?

Forget about the town council. You think they care about you people and your herbs? If your herbs don’t bring in money, it’s useless in the eyes of the state. Time to wake up, my friends, time to see this country from a different perspective. And you can’t even protest about it, if you do, you are criminals. The skin is beginning to peel.

Now that the TC and RC have come into the picture, let us give them, Rafiz and the Senior Citizens there, time to have things sort out.

I believe Rafiz will have us posted and informed on further developments and if the Issue is amicably settled, we should then be happy for all.

Let’s rest the Case for the time being.

patriot

In Singapore, everything is about black and white and by the book. On one hand the TC builds senior citizen corner and various “corners” while on the other hand they enforce such iron fist measures when come to some of the “corners” set up bu residents. There is a very clear line drawn on “whose land this belongs to” policy.

I strongly suggest TC should look into the residents needs to come up with exception on residents built corner and review these corners to allow these corners to stay put or remove due to safety or health reasons rather than simply bulldoze the corner since it does not belong to the TC.

On one hand we want to allow the senior citizens to live life meaningfully while the other hand they try to take the freedom away. Singapore’s gahmen problem is that they are always so ironic in such judgement.

agree with #34) patriot. let’s wait for Rafiz’s update.
you are one damn proud Singaporean we have – well done!

I’m not surprised at all considering that the AMK GRC is enjoying the services of Wee Siew Kim, the elite father. Those herbs must have stood in the way of elitism

32), the problem is not the herbs. The problem is there are more than five herbs gathered in one area.

Well done Rafiz.
Hope the herb garden is returned to the people soon, and hope for you to see them and your chidlren smile again.

:)

P.S. The zone chairman’s English was err… a little bit appalling.

Rafiz…members of RC are simply PAP stooges…they are people with no souls other than living to defend the PAP MPs that they serve…they are not supposed to be smart, intelligent or possessed high IQ, hence, don’t expect them to understand what your main concerns are…in simple words, these people who serve in RC are running dogs, specially selected and put there by PAP!!!!

You can forget about your herbs, they are being sold to TCM clinics. You want them? Then you have to consult those doctors and pay.

When I came to the part about how some residents had spent about 20 years maintaining the garden and then having it all taken from them, I felt a stab in my heart. Nonetheless I don’t want to be pretentious and say that it shouldn’t have been taken from them. Did the residents seek the permission of the town council and were they given permission to maintain a herb garden there? If they hadn’t been, then they’d taken the risk to, and it actually was very tolerant on the part of the council to allow that to go on for that length of time. Aside that, I do think that things could have been handled in a more sensitive manner. Couldn’t they have found a suitable place to relocate the garden, instead of just uprooting and removing it without taking into consideration the sensitivities of the residents who have been keeping it? We’re probably looking at some kind of strategy here. Miraculously, when the noise grows big enough, there’ll be announcements of a new herb garden in progress, and at its opening (preferably nearer the elections) there’ll be the usual pomp and circumstance and a very subtle message to keep voting who they’ve been voting for.

Hmm… The GRC system was introduced in 1988 and the garden was started a year earlier. I am not sure how town management was done prior to 1988 so it is likely that the apllication system for community gardens has not been introduced yet. Had the garden interfered with town management after the GRC, the garden should have been prohibited since then. Twenty-one Years is not a short time and non-prohibition may have given an implied meaning that it was permissable.

Absolutely disgusting! If you are OK with it…I’ll forward this to Reach; the govt feedback channel and the media….needs to publicise this…..so that it WILL NOT be repeated elsewhere!

44#, Charlotte

This would acheive more prominence in the “odd pages” of the international media. Haha

42) pandc

it will be a slap in the face if your logic that tc had been “very tolerant” for the garden to exist for so long is taken as an arguement point – remember pedra blanca?

>>I just received a phonecall from the manager of the zone my block is in. I am very very upset and angry to hear that the only excuse he gave was “I get people complain that there are rodents in the area so we clear everything!

Hhmm…i’m not surprised

http://www.mrbrown.com/blog/2007/09/stone-seats.html

Got old folks playing cards….remove stone table & chairs lah – - gambling problem “solved”

38) the problem is not the herbs. The problem is there are more than five herbs gathered in one area.

“Tak Buleh Tahan” herbs are dangerous….they need to be destroyed.

maybe there is mosquito breeding?

in STTA: sack first talk later
in NSS: Demolish first talk later
what next?

Rafiz, just saw you on tv – handsome man – way to go!

gemami(Post#36)

Thank You for the support!

patriot

thumbs up to you for finding the justice in our unfair society

too many things have been done with regards to the citizen’s voice
it is obvious that little thoughts have been put into it to solve the source of the problems- rodents. Herb gardens are not the cause of rodents, town councils or even HDB should consult pest control expert on how to solve it instead of blindly removing the garden.

i hope more of this can be done to make our society a better place to live in

in STTA: sack first talk later
in NSS: Demolish first talk later
what next? – theworld (#50)

In Army: dunk first, talk later
In Navy: collide first, talk later
In Banks: mis-sell first, talk later
In CPF Annuity Scheme: Die first, talk later
In Healthcare: mean-testing first, treat later

its really sad. that people are now not required to think. the interpersonal eq between people have also stooped into a new low. seriously, just because of a phone call, the the next day the herbs are removed?

1)did the relevant town councils staff even go down and investigate?
2)after 22 yrs of no issues then suddenly the TC went bonkers?
3)where was the level of human interaction or communication?
4)i may agree, rules might have not been followed regarding the growing of plants/herd, but shouldnt they have look at the positives it has created?so much for active aging….this just reeks of not practising what u preach.
5) lets look it at another angle, if this have happened at say a upper class bukit timah estate , would the same have happened?

my guess is as good as yours….

the TC is unfortunatley going 2 just sweep this under the carpet, or just some big words to justify the means of action.in myammar, they oppress ppl freedom, in singapore they oppress even your words and also your ability to think..

This is a 1st class solution to solve a problem.

“Garden with rodent problem – REMOVE THE GARDEN.”

“Garden with rodent problem – REMOVE THE GARDEN.” – Putra (#56)

And I thought the MPs are the rats.

55) cruxgod

did anyone ask who made the phone call?
i have a hunch the call must have came from LBH.

#47 and #56

Seem like a trend:

Old Folks playing cards – REMOVE STONE TABLES AND CHAIRS.

Garden with rodents – REMOVE GARDEN.

Well done TOC, your profile has just gone up a few more notches.

Let’s keep going! ……….. vroom!…….vroom!……….

We now wait for Rafiz to comment …………

if anyone noticed the reply from TOC…
big junk of words…..

did anyone noticed, there is no usage of the words…

“regret /apologise/sorry.”

yet they still turn the arrows n taiji back to u…

so much for self motiativation…basically they are saying now

‘i didnt ask the old ah peks n ah ma to grow plants/herbs,its they kpo,if they wan to grow plants, they must photocopy their ic n submit within 3 working days to us for approval.so if plants remove, its NOT MY BUSINESS…”

i think the monkeys are just missing the point about this whole issue….

hi genami..

mayb its some cronies from the rc or something..now en bloc fever so hot, they might wanna build a 20th storey shopping centre there on the old garden

Rafiz

I hope this this will have a happy ending. And thanks for hellping the elderly articulate their sadness and anger.

That zone chairman’s email was apalling. You shld pass on his email to the MPs. They shld be concerned. It is people like him that give the PAP a bad name: not that they smell sweet in the first place.

And you shouldn’t be so gentlemanly by omitting his name in yr posting. People in area ought to know that guy is mini-emperor.

62) CRUXGOD

now……how come i didn’t think of that :)

TOC,
what happened to the explanation letter from AMK TC?.
My post #60, was in reply to the letter.

I believed the sadness is not so much of the destruction of the herbs garden, more so are the amount of effort (21 years of it), the rarely seen Community Camaraderie (in these days where people are mostly gears towards materialism and with very selfish mindset). Even the compassion is lacking. How sad can this be? Very, indeed.

Even if now they (TCs) are willing to allow the replanitng (assuming a sort of happy ending), the fact that 21 years of warmth and care not only to the plants but within the community who lives in is not going to be the same. The fact that there will always be people who do not appreciate nature (well, by and large most uncompassionate people falls into this category).

Hopefully those people working in the TC as well as edgy residents do spare a thought on what was been through before making an otherwise unnecessary complain because of some rodents (they too have a right to live in this sick planet earth). Try not to be so dogmatic and exercise more conscience. Considerate, Passion and Kindness certainly will help build a better nation of people with compassion.

On behalf of all fellow senior citizens, hhanks again to Rafiz.

gemami,

We’re trying to get confirmation from the town council that the comment was indeed posted by its manager, Mr Goh.

Once we have confirmation, we’ll put it up as a separate post.

Regards,
Andrew Loh

OMG! 21 years and they just noticed the rats and demolished the garden because of that? Really world class eh.

- Did the alleged “rats” caused any problem at all?
- Did the alleged “rats” caused any problem at all In the past 21 years?
- Did the alleged “rats” have a permit to gather at the herb garden?
- Had the police interrogated those alleged “rats”?
- Was any video footage taken as evidence of those alleged “rats” for gathering without a permit?
- When will the alleged problem causing “rats” be charged for illegal assembly?
- Had those “rats” causing problem been arrested?
- Was those rats wearing kangaroo T-shirts?
- Why not just get rid of the rats instead? Send in some cats.
- Is this just an excuse to get rid of the seniors, instead of the rats?

= =

It is most uncaring and heavy handed , a reflection of society at large or it is just an over zealous town hall official? Keeping the old folk occupied and happy is just what is needed to keep them healthy. It cause the state practically nothing to allow them to plant a few herbs on a piece of land that had no other uses. Maybe the town hall want to spend their budget to plant a few flowers and keep the FT occupied? Very sad. The Sinkapore I loved and grow up in is no longer the same. Government longer consult and care about its citizen.They just do what they think is best regardless about the benefits of their action.