Perhaps many PAP MPs had met with no opposition in a GE and just walked over. No one voted for me; hence I do not need to speak for anyone or represent anyone. There is something fundamentally wrong with walking over in a GE.

During the elections (less than 2 weeks), MPs visit voters. Between elections (4 to 5 years), voters visit MPs at MPS. Such is the system. Almost half of our MPs aren’t elected. They’re nominated and walked over. If voters with problems don’t go to them and make them work, why work?

I can hear the resounding echoes already. Why don’t opposition contest all seats to prevent walkovers? I believe the the opposition would love to. But how?

I can hear the resounding echoes again. Why don’t opposition go out recruiting more candidates? Again, I believe the opposition would love to. But how?

“What on earth are our MPs doing? What are our MPs for?”

$$$ … , and more $$$

I think you should not be using 10,000 as the figure to incite emotions nor basis that the MPs should come.

If we looked at the factual one, only 1,000 people signed up for the petition. It could be implied that only 1,000 (or 10%) of those who invest in the products want to seek recourse. The other 90% are willing to accept the loss. It’s strange, isn’t it? Why is the other 90% not signing the petition or turning up at HongLim? Food for thought.

All said. I believe REFUNDS SHOULD BE GIVEN TO THE ONE WHO HAVE NO EARNING CAPABILITY AND HAVE TO LIVE ON THOSE SUM.

Ya I am also saddened like Andrew here that our MPs should have done better. I admired what Mr Lee Bee Wah has done at Serangoon Garden. That is what all MP should do – gathering feedback from the residents that have elected them by majority votes and feeding it back to the relevant authorities. Charles Chong also did a good job at the White Elephant MRT station. Both are to be commented for their effort at their respective constituencies. Both exhibited leardership initiative that is very shortcoming from all our other PAP MPs.

It is perhaps they are gagged from acting out for this group of sherpherdless citizens. As by acting out they are seen as siding with the dissidents. The govt has all along said that individuals should address their concerns with their FIs. They are washing their hands off the case for reasons best known to them.

I see a positive outcome of this abject episode though. We saw the true colour of our govt and very cearly too. It can only highlight the gloss misgivings of our govt. It has also given TOC and TKL prominent “coverage” as if the authorities have taken over and do a good job, TKL/TOC will continue to be very much in the background.

This is also a good opportunity for ground protest to shine on from now on. I see that this is only the beginning of a great uprising for people power. This will have to carry on till we are a force to be reckoned with. The light is shining brightly now.

Perhaps the nature of citizen action is seen as low politics (in pol sci parlance), and they feel that it is not needed for them to be there on the ground to act effectively?

Who knows?

the PAP is stagnating Singapore, hindering its potential to truly develop (and i don’t mean economically).

on a side note, can mr loh please brush up on his writing/journalistic skills?

Our older MPs are too busy making money in their regular jobs while the younger post 65 ones are busy working on their dance routines for their next Hip Hop dance performance.

PAP

TKL, Meng Seng tell investors to come to us to complain. So why shld we duplicate effort? Not efficient use of time.

WP

No-one in Hougang is affected. So why bother?

Sylvia has no constituency, so gd excuse for her not to turn up.

Besides, people will vote for us. No other alternative. We more complacent than PAP.

SDP

What is few hundred K for us ACS kids?. Besides might upset America. Lehman, Morgan Stanley and Merrill are US of A. Then no mention of our antics in Washington Post or NYT.

Nair might lose US passport. Then kanna return to S’pore.

So better to stick to calling ministers, judicary etc names.

Chiam

What is CDO, CDS. So complicated. Might as well take a nap.

Hong Lim is too far from MPs’ residences. Also, Saturday is a day of rest. By the way, Hong Lim belongs to Tanjong Pagar right? Who is or are the MPs?

Teo Soh Lung:

I think Tg Pagar belongs to the MM right?

to 6) Gilbert above, the MP handling Serangoon Gardens issue is Mrs. Lim Hwee Hua and not the President of STA. Yes, Mrs. Lim has done what she can but in the end, the dormitory for foreign workers will still be there, but not spread out across Sgp – rich or not-so-rich areas.

The PAP MPs and ministers are in their cosy home, laughing at those poor investors and counting the money from their fat pay checks. That’s where and what they are doing

14) Vince:

Hi thanks for the clarification. My mistake.

In Taiwan, there is a student movement (The Wild Berries Student Movement) against police violence and push for Parade and Assembly Law reform. When some politician when there for an interview, the students drove him away for exploiting the opportunity for political gain.

So, how should political parties participate? The only way will be send in individual members to help. But even then, what is to stop someone from saying they try to hijack the movement.

THey are all huddled up in their ivory towers, thinking up Smart Phrases to use and absolve themselves from ANY liabilities.

This episode highlighted the sadness of a country dominated by a single political party. Party leaders already say something, how can an ordinary party member say otherwise. For whatever reason, such as party discipline, the monopoly of opinion will set in. As a result, the social contract between the ones who elect and the one being elected (an MP speaks up for his electorates) becomes strained and breaks down. It is a very sad scene that the citizens of a “democratic” country are at the mercy of the their “elected” gov.

Lesson learnt: Better open your eyes when you go into the election booth in the next GE.

If the peasants keep voting for PAP MPs again and again, it’s understandable that – NO NEED

I supported the PAP w/o second thought since eligible to vote.
When I was facing unreasonable retrenchment, I did not even seek help from my MP because I don’t want to trouble them with personal problems.

For this lehman debacle, there are 10,000 victims. With the victims’ spouses, children, parents & siblings , easily more than 100,000 people are affected.
Coupled with Singapaore s reputation as a financial hub at stake, this is a national issue. I as a victim and more as a Singaporean expect some ministers & MPs to come up with a workable solution.
Unfortunately, the quietness is frightening.

give the PAP MPs more time lah !
cannot simply talk and contradict their leader.
so have to wait for the leader to show the way.
can’t you guys sense their leader has wet his pants ?
give some time for it to dry first then hopefully can regain composure.
isn’t it sickening that we still have PAP stooges coming on line
to defend their political masters, sucking on bananas if you like.

“If that is the case, one wonders why we elect MPs in the first place.
Indeed, some at Hong Lim have also wondered the same.”

I thought many MPs just entered parliament via a walkover?

Then again, perhaps u meant, “… why we HAVE MPs…”

Well, to appeal for parking saman, to ask for handouts. What else? Hmm…

It’s not too difficult to understand the careless attitude of PAP MPs…they are after all a bunch of useless BACK-DOOR MPs (or should we simply call them puppets), coming into the parliament not by their own credibility but through the dirty GRC (Group Representative Constituencies) tactics of PAP!!!!

Singaporeans no complain why people here complain?
This is Singapore.
And yes, it is unique.

#21 isd
When did TOC declared itself as a purely anti PAP platform?
All netizens have the right to voice their thought with it.
It is not your personal site.
By the way mature political affiliation is never permanent. Just look at America.
Political parties need charisma to gain support.
If you can convert one supporter from your rival to your side you actually gain 2 votes.
Please don’t tell people which party you belong to. You will make it loses votes
The way you conduct yourself in your post is a disgrace.
You are more suitable for the triads.

(Being disheartened,, I will probalbly change ship this coming election, but definitely not to yours)

I have thanked Andrew before for his contribution to the singaporean community both online and offline.

Nevertheless, I feel the need to say something not so nice.

Yes, it saddens me too, and very much more than you can know.

Still, I have to ask, if our MPs (LTK , S Lim, Chiam inclusive), aka People’s representatives, do not comment on this issue or show up at Hong Lim, what could we the citizens do?

The DBS retrenchment – so what can we do?

The non-signing of petition by those pocket affected – what can we do?

The fact that singaporeans and singapore is different from HK – what can we do?

We need to remind ourselves, we are singaporeans. we have been uniquely like this for 43 years.

I think this kind of people will not change.

I now understand why people quit. I have been trying to participate in hope to contribute to a momentum. After 5 weeks of being on the ground so-to-speak, I am convinced, its almost hopeless now. Only an Act of Gawd, so-to-speak, may give 1% chance of …. But meanwhile, I give up entirely. No more HL parking for me. Its wasting my time. Blunt but honest feeling from me.

To those still holding on to the dream, I urge that you target the root cause 1st.
I think its more than Apathy. Thats all folks!

MP to speak at HLP ? wait kenna party whip? why care, good pay, good benefit …. just follow instruction….easy job……why get complicated.

Don’t be naive. If MPs (PAP and oppositions) appeared at the session, it would be seen as trying to score political points and leverage on Mr. Tan’s effort. I think nobody wants to steal credit from Mr. Tan.

The MPs have their designated areas for complaints. People should contact their respective MPs within their GRC or constituency to file a complaint instead of milling around some unknown non-politician who has no power in a park.

The biggest problem today is recession and keeping jobs. Not 400 to 500 people who lost money in some investments. Get real, not all investments make money. There are those who grow up thinking that all types of investments (property, shares, etc) sure make money, sure get principle back. Well, it’s unfortunate when things don’t turn out well; but learn from mistakes and move on.

If, everytime some people lost money somewhere, and they felt they have be ill-informed or “mis-sold”, they appear in Hong Lim park and protest, would you expect your own MPs to go their to hear their problem or should they instead stay in your GRCs/ward to focus on attending to your problems?

“A fool and his money are soon parted.”

Clarification on my earlier post – “Not 400 to 500 people who lost money in some investment” should be “Not 400 to 500 people who lost money in some investment and appeared in Hong Lim Park”.

There are tens and thousands of people who lost money in some form of investments, one way or another. Not just the 10,000 affected by Lehman bros.

Well, if any MP from the PAP appears in HL park, the next moment he will be forced to resign from the party or hide in one corner for the rest of their political career. Simply as that

“Well, if any MP from the PAP appears in HL park, the next moment he will be forced to resign from the party or hide in one corner for the rest of their political career. Simply as that”
How about those clowns dressing in kangaroo suit so that no one can recognise them, so to protect them from revealing their identify and get blacklisted by their master ? The weather is hot and wearing the suit is uncomfortable but surely that ought to be the sacrifice of salary of more than $13,000 per month ? They must be prudent though , not to hold a ping pong bat.

#28-#29, “PAP Anonymous”, I’m afraid I find your arguments incredibly myopic. Perhaps you do not see the naiviette in your own opinions, but I’ll be glad to help you. You said:

“Don’t be naive. If MPs (PAP and oppositions) appeared at the session, it would be seen as trying to score political points and leverage on Mr. Tan’s effort. I think nobody wants to steal credit from Mr. Tan.

The MPs have their designated areas for complaints. People should contact their respective MPs within their GRC or constituency to file a complaint instead of milling around some unknown non-politician who has no power in a park.”

The point, I believe, is that politicians are afraid of attending the sessions because they’d definitely be asked by the attendees what they are going to do about the situation; or at the very least, what their opinions Are, beyond sympathy. No one wants to step beyond party lines because that’s political suicide. As for the Opposition, there’s no glory to be gained either, because

1) they cannot insist MAS do something without appearing to be partial to Chee politics (that, is another issue altogether)

2) they would Appear to be scoring political leverage, especially since there’s nothing They can do. the PAP will roundly trounce them for that in the govt-owned media, probably for being opportunists and so on.

Until the politicians can get their stories straight and have an answer for the people, they’re just hiding away and hoping matters will go away.. thank God for TKL and his persistence.

As you are aware, MPs have no power since the Govt itself refuses to conduct investigations into the banks; or to examine the issue of misselling. The most (and BEST) they can do is to attend the Hong Lim sessions, at least, to show that their voices are with the people.

But we remember of course that our PM underscores the fact that we are a party-based system, and not a MP one. The party decides which MPs run, effectively, and where–and with the walkover GRC system, no one really wants to lose a guaranteed million-dollar job.

I get this dizzing feeling that perhaps you are being a satirist–that you understand perfectly how ludicrous your statements are, and of course, that is the point of satire. I am sorry however if you really are sincere about it, because there’s nothing more pathetic than misguided good intentions–which got us into this mess in the first place.

Andrew, brilliant article. Am not in SG at the present, and it’s nice to know how things are on the ground, from a balanced perspective.

#28 PAP Anonymous
Either you have just join the show or you prefer to look at it from a different angle.
This is not a case of ordinary business investment
The propectus of these lehman products have 80 to 100 pages.
The content is so conplicated that it took a professor in business studies 2 hours to understand it.
Ordinary investors (actually depositors) had to relied on the oral explaination of the RM. Others scan through the terms very quickly, trusting that FI would not sell them something so toxic.
In the end, there are affected investors from all walks of life.
They include an university lecturer, a HR manageress, doctors, teachers, IT specialists and even some financial advisors & a PAP town council. You think they are fools?
Most people agreed that the investors should shoulder a portion of the tragedy for their carelessness and the FI should be responsible for aggressively promoting something so risky without discrimination.

When the lehman saga exploded, thousands of confused local investors didn’t know what to do. With Mr. Tan KL guidance, they are now better organised & try to solve this problem civicly. Looking back, who knows w/o his guidance how many desperate victims may commit suicide or run amok.

Chua Mui Mui of the Warren @26
“We need to remind ourselves, we are singaporeans. we have been uniquely like this for 43 years.

I think this kind of people will not change.”

Yes, we are unique. No other people or animal in this planet or any other planet in the universe is as well-trained as us. We have been trained to take blows, to endure them and not fight back or run away, and to choose to keep on having blows rained on us. We have come to accept blows as a normal condition of life. We are a people whose spirit has been beaten out of us.

#32 PANOPTICON: Thanks for your comment; but I don’t see any help in them. Unlike you, I would not generalise that MPs are “afraid” to answer questions. They are answering questions at their meet-the-people session already Rather than putting down all the MPs, I suggest your opinion be more specific. But nonetheless, you added your opinion to why MPs were not seen at HL park, although you are far away.

#33: minibombed: Any investment carries a risk of losing capital – it depends whether you are one of the “lucky” ones. So what if you are a professor in business studies or town council – are you saying that if there is only 0.01% chance of losing total capital and it turned out to be true, you will not make noise? Like what LHL/MM said, after the 1st or 2nd page of the prospectus where it says total capital loss is possible, one can decide to walk away. Nobody forced them to sign. There is a 14-day cooling period, anybody can return policy to get full refund – did they do it? Obviously, some are blinded by greed and laziness to do their own research, they did not. If want to play safe, go for fixed deposits. Want to play with fire, got burnt, then complain people who sold the match-sticks/lighters never tell you fire can burn and hurt you and burn down house..

As for TKL’s activity in HL park, I would say that is a channel for those who went to vent their frustration. Did these sessions produce results? I only see people being led in circles and staying at the same spot. I see TKL’s activities as counter-effective and giving people false hope. It is not going through the proper channels. I guess that’s why out of 10,000 affected, only 1000 signed the petition and less than 500 turned up.

You don’t have to agree what I write and I may not write what you what to see but it is my perspective.

post 35, you are ignorant and your perspective sulk. tell those investors that have lost everything of your perspective because of mis selling. are u going to feed his family from now on? or feed them with your perspective and down with tap water?

Don’t be naive. If MPs (PAP and oppositions) appeared at the session, it would be seen as trying to score political points and leverage on Mr. Tan’s effort. I think nobody wants to steal credit from Mr. Tan. – PAP Anonymous (#28)

Mr Tan Kin Lian is an activist, not a parliamentarian. To say a parliamentarian would attempt to steal credit from Mr Tan Kin Lian is to put him on the same light as a parliamentarian, which Mr Tan Kin Lian isn’t one. If any PAP MPs were to be there, it would serve to reaffirm the action taken by Mr Tan Kin Lian and contradict what MM Lee, SM Goh and PM Lee had already said in public. On the contrary, it is PAP MPs who have chosen to censor themselves.

The MPs have their designated areas for complaints. People should contact their respective MPs within their GRC or constituency to file a complaint instead of milling around some unknown non-politician who has no power in a park. – PAP Anonymous (#28)

Now you are making this into a turf war, which implies Mr Tan Kin Lian is a parliamentarian. I stress again: Mr Tan Kin Lian is not a parliamentarian.

The biggest problem today is recession and keeping jobs. Not 400 to 500 people who lost money in some investments. Get real, not all investments make money. There are those who grow up thinking that all types of investments (property, shares, etc) sure make money, sure get principle back. – PAP Anonymous (#28)

With all public resources at the command of the PAP, and that there are 82 PAP MPs in total, are you suggesting that the biggest problem of recession and keeping jobs is too big for PAP to handle such that they cannot spare any resources for victims of mis-representation? If so, what is the million dollar ministerial pays for? The higher the ministerial pays, public expectation of the PAP government also increases.

I think some of the most important questions are:

If YOU are an MP, PAP or otherwise, would you attend the speeches and get mobbed?

Will you be safe?

What would or can you say to the angry investors?

———————-
If we put ourselves in the shoes of MPs, then perhaps we would understand why it is prudent for them to stay away. No one can predict how a mob will behave, especially one that is very unhappy.

A safer way to know what’s going on is to view it on the net.

AND…..for the unhappy investors, perhaps they should heed Mr Tan KL’s adivce: Go see your MPs during the MTP, in a large group is possible.

If I am an MP, I would not go to HLP, alone, that is.
I will be accompanied by a small group of my grassroots assistants. No need to kiasi.

I will address the cowd and state my stand very clearly, that I am there to listen and to try and help as best as I can. I would assure the crowd that it is in their best interest to do things in a civilised manner so that issues can be brought to the attention of the govt in the shortest possible time.

Do you think the crowd will become an uncontrolled mob?

Let us not also belittle the efforts of Mr Tan Kin Lian. I am sure his presence and his words will be able to control the crowd because these people have grown to respect him and rightfully, he deserved to be respected.

These alone are safeguards that ought to encourage the MPs to go visit and listen to the crowd. It is still not too late.

It is not the time to kiasi. What kind of a leader will you be seen to be?

Got money to make, die also don’t care. No money to make, hide away like a useless cockroach.

as far as i can see, the PAP mps have already spoken – vis a viz mm lee and pm lee.

“the investors had walked in with their eyes open, case closed.”

yes, it is frightening that the mps themselves don’t care anything beyond just that. this is singapore. this is my country. this is my future.

kudos to those of us who try hard to change this apathy. i only hope that there are many pple like me, who though find it hard to turn up in support for these events, will at least vote wisely in the next election.

God bless Singapore

to those who try to discredit TKL :
would it be better if TKL had kept complete silence and not done anything for the investors?

The answer is clear and i welcome all the character assassinators to come reply to my question. Better, if you would say it in Hong Lim park.

Folks, have you all forgotten that Singapore is unique? MPs here are unlike MPs elsewhere. Apart from JBJ, when has any MP, PAP or opposition alike, been a representative of the people or our voice? They are paid hundreds of thousands of $$$$ a year to make our govt and parliament look good. Some sort of eye candy.

20) minibombed on November 16th, 2008 8.43 pm
I supported the PAP w/o second thought since eligible to vote….For this lehman debacle, there are 10,000 victims. With the victims’ spouses, children, parents & siblings , easily more than 100,000 people are affected.
Coupled with Singapaore s reputation as a financial hub at stake, this is a national issue. I as a victim and more as a Singaporean expect some ministers & MPs to come up with a workable solution. Unfortunately, the quietness is frightening. .
Lesson learnt that can be shared by all fence-sitters?
Don’t wait to learn life’s lessons the hard way. Take some time to listen to people’s grouses even if they might mean nothing to you. When a voice comes in a collective form, there must be something amiss. Find out what it is, for it may come to haunt you the same way it is haunting these people who are crying out now.

23) PAPObserver on November 16th, 2008 10.38 pm
It’s not too difficult to understand the careless attitude of PAP MPs…they are after all a bunch of useless BACK-DOOR MPs….puppets…..
Not that they will become Pinnochios. We know the Pinnochio story is not true. The PAP back-alley MPs will remain to be puppets throughout their whole term in office. And they must keep very silent on any issues less they are seen with long pointed noses.

28) PAP Anonymous
The biggest problem today is recession and keeping jobs. Not 400 to 500 people who lost money in some investments. .

Agree, the bigger problem has to be addressed.

Get real, not all investments make money. .

Do not agree. Even if it is a known fact that not all investments make money, this is a different kettle of fish altogether.

Without stating what have already been stated both here and in the MSM, it is clear that something is amiss when even MAS and our PM have to assure investors that investigations will be carried out. If the MAS and PM were so sure that nothing is amiss, then the people would have been told so, instead of giving them ‘false hope’ as someone mentioned about TKL and the HLP gatherings.

As for the rest of your comments on this post, it has been answered excellently by PANAPTICON in post 332.

35) PAP Anonymous
I would not generalise that MPs are “afraid” to answer questions. They are answering questions at their meet-the-people session already

Yah sure, what kind of an MP prefers to listen to half of the problem when he can listen to the full problem?

Obviously, some are blinded by greed ………..

And who is responsible for this typical Singaporean trait?

As for TKL’s activity in HL park, I would say that is a channel for those who went to vent their frustration

It is also the most excellent situation for MPs to show they care. Better than any meet-the-people-session can offer.

Did these sessions produce results?.

The judgement is too soon. There are results and there will be results. The most telling result is the loss of confidence towards banks and FIs, the loss of confidence in the PAP govt and there will be loss of confidence in Singapore.

This is made bigger by the collective voice at HLP. We can argue over this for now but who is eventually right or wrong, do you know at this point in time? So, your judgement that it produced no result is wrong.

PAP Anonymous,

I will not refute your points since many here have done so eloquently. But what i do find disturbing is your cynical belief that because it doesn’t produce tangible results, therefore it’s not worth doing. Because the MPs have their meet-the-people-sessions, so no need to turn up. I find it sad that this is the way many people think now, and we have been cultivated to believe that it’s always better to be pragmatic at the expense of everything else. Because we have a ‘pragmatic’ government for 40-over years. Whether or not the protests will produce the intended results of getting the investors their money back is secondary to the fact that TKL dares to do something that many of us will balk at. He dares to believe that his actions will help people. That’s way way way better than cynicism. I’d rather vote opposition in the foolish belief that they will help change things, rather than vote PAP cynically because it’s nice to have a covered walkway.

There is and will be nothing we can do but post comments.
Absolutely nothing. now till eternal . wanna bet?

45) “There is and will be nothing we can do but post comments.”

And your point is?

I could agree with you that the matter will die down… and the investors will lose hope, and balek kampung, and one day TKL will only be speaking to a handful of people.

But you think nothing has changed? That more peoples’ eyes haven’t been opened? What will you do, and what have you done so far anyway? Quite possibly nothing. To be honest, so did I. I did nothing but post comments (muahahah). But seriously. Oceans come from raindrops. Minds are changed one at a time. If anything, reading these posts confirmed a few of the nagging views I have about the way things are run. I used to ‘keep my options’ open because maybe the gahmen really smarter than us, and an ill-informed person like me dunno the bigger picture.

But it ran contrary to what I felt intuitively what good governance meant, and what a good political system meant. So that’s one mind changed.

So really, dun need to feel so helpless. :)

45) People will say ‘no choice lah’

Your usage of the word eternal is as myopic as the words you have written.

Just like the PAP govt declaring that one-party system is the way forward. Yah sure, forward only till the day they die, after that, it is the next generation of PAP leader’s problem.

Likewise in relation to how we are governed. This is gooooood ! ! ! …… that is baaaad ! ! ! When good becomes bad they go: “How come I don’t know?, You ask me I ask who? It is your fault for not reading the fine prints!”.

You still believe in people like that? What happened to once bitten, twice shy?

To those who want opposition MPs to help, have you lost your mind?

If opposition MPs have helped, and PAP backed down as a result, the opposition will be the heroes to the poor investors and PAP the villain. Do you think PAP will allow this to happen?

If opposition MPs helped, the money will be as good as gone.

48) Johnny on November 17th, 2008 1.37 pm

If opposition MPs have helped, and PAP backed down as a result, the opposition will be the heroes to the poor investors and PAP the villain.

I see. So we also cannot vote opposition because if ‘freak results’ happen, the Army will move in and instead of a one-party dictatorship, we will get a Military Junta!

I have observed among many of the comments that there is a similar line of questiong that goes like this:

1. Do you think the PAP govt will allow …………..?
2. No choice lah, PAP govt will ……………
3. …….. because PAP says so.
4. People’s mindsets must change………………..

My question to such lines is this:

When will you start saying: “I want the PAP govt to do this or that, PAP govt must start looking after me, because I say so, PAP govt has to change etc“.

The power belongs to you, why do you think the power is with the PAP?

Gemami,
Your question is apt. Amongst all the irony of a democratic nation where power is to the people, in Singapore, “we” sadly live in fear of the PAP government. Its as if “we” will not survive without them. People seem to feel that they have no power over their own destiny because everything has been planned by the PAP for them. All they need to do is follow the leader. There is no alternative. People actually believe that power is with the PAP!!?

Wow!
Even the First Lady is lending her support?
I am so honoured.
Thanks, Mrs Nathan.

Funny isn’t it? PAP blame Sgreans for their crutch mentality but the truth is, they created this kind of society.
We fear the PAP, dare not speak up against them, dare not oppose their policies etc etc, we just let them make the so-called best decision for us.
People say we are cowards, lack creativity, lack entrepreneurship, and even worse ignorant and ungracious.
Ever wonder why this kind of society exists in little red dot?
Maybe PAP can give a better answer.

I plan to be in Hong Lim Park every two weeks until the end of this year. Each time, there will be misled investors who are turning up for the first time to get guidance. It also allows the other investors to discuss their strategy. I shall also give an update.

Some investors may get settlement or decide to drop out. Some may find alternative places to meet. Some may have taken up collective legal action and will meet with the lawyer.

The crowd is likely to dwindle in the weeks ahead. If the crowd becomes small, I shall call off the meeting and take a good rest.

Mr Tan Kin Lian,

You have done a fantastic job to the best of your ability and if it bears no fruit you will still take heart that you have endeared yourself to thousands of Singaporeans.

The fruits of your labour will come in other forms, particularly at the next general election. You have, by your most admirable deed of selfless sacrifice, shown up what this govt is all about and at the same time allow Singaporeasn to come to realise that this govt does not care for them.

These are important lessons we have taken with us.

A stranger you came, a thousand friends you made.
All by the simple act of kindness.

From the bottom of my heart, I thank you, my friend and fellow countryman.

Tan Kian Lian:

YA I agreed with Gemami that you are probably one in a million!

We wont dare to do what you did because:

1. We are too scared that the authorities will clamp down on us even though HLP is already a legal protest ground. The old fear is still inherent among us.

2. We think that we are incapable of gathering so many people and will they listen to us?

3. We also lack the confidence that we can tackle such a big group of investors who may ask us intelligent questions that we can”t answer.

4. We don’t have this DNA yet here to speak up in such bravery against the authorities after seeing what happened to CSJ and JBJ so your’s is a good testiomony that doing good out of a kind heart is all that matters.

5. We are fearful that one wrong step and we will be sued by the govt so best not to do anything.

So you deserve all the appreciation true son of SIngapore! For the sake of SIngapore, do consider standing up for GE. I will carry your files for you.

Latest news:

Two town councils have invested around $12 million in the minibond trust.

SINGAPORE: Two out of 14 PAP-run town councils in Singapore have invested in Lehman-linked structured products.

Holland-Bukit Panjang and Pasir Ris-Punggol town councils have invested a total of S$12 million in DBS High Notes, Lehman Brothers’ Minibond Notes and Merrill Lynch’s Jubilee Series 3.

That’s about 0.6 per cent of the total funds available for investments.

Senior Minister of State for National Development and Education Grace Fu gave this update in Parliament on Monday.

Town councils can invest up to 35 per cent of their sinking funds in corporate bonds and equities.

Based on the financial statements submitted to the National Development Ministry for 2007, Holland-Bukit Panjang Town Council invested about S$8 million or 6.7 per cent of its available funds while Pasir Ris-Punggol Town Council invested some 2.6 per cent totalling S$4 million.

Other town councils such as Aljunied, Ang Mo Kio-Yio Chu Kang, Hong Kah, Marine Parade, Tampines and Tanjong Pagar also have exposure to Lehman Brothers.

The fund managers appointed by these town councils invested S$4 million in Lehman Brothers through their investment portfolio.

These account for less than one per cent of each town council’s funds available for investments. – CNA/vm

I think most talented and capable and credible singaporean calibres do not step forward as they are still stuck in the maslow’s hierarchy level of self-esteem, working hard and trying not to make mistakes. Fortunately, TKL who has gone up the maslow hierarchy and attained the level of Self Actualization and having retired decided to give back to the community during his retirement years. I am sure many would feel some urge to voice up for the community most of us being opinionated singaporeans who generally are capable complainers. But for safety, many would not. So, TKL is indeed 1 in 2 million. The other unsung heroes include the rest of TOC team. I believe most people in this country have not gone through hardship hard enough to have the mentality to step forward. People in France, USA have gone through revolutionary periods and they have this history to learn from. As for me, I just do not have the calibre to represent the people. Else I would have stepped forward.

Thus, I conclude that singaporean mindset will only change and be more like other developed worlds and developing country democrats after a long long time. By then I would be dead already , for sure.

Thus, it saddens me about the Reality I am witnessing every day for the last many many decades. As the great JBJ is no longer with us, we can only be grateful that a man like TKL decide to do the ideal thing, for us.

I am in the process of choosing a country to migrate to and should make up my decision in a few months. Call me a quitter , but then I have seen Reality in the face. And have concluded.

we can give up the present opposition MP in the next election for sure. concentrate effort in electing for GOH MENG SENG and TAN KIN LIAN if he wants to stand up.
God bless Singapore to have a helping hand from some REAL oppositionists in our history!

@ 25) minibombed,
my post is not directly referring to you even though it is sequenced after yours.
it goes to show you are daft and quick to jump into conclusion.
you said it all when you said you supported the PAP without thinking.
read all the contents in my post again and perhaps this time you can understand my intention. essentially our political leaders and PAP MPs
have let the people down by not speaking up for them.
those who suck on PAP bananas are not being helpful to the affected.

60) give up the present opposition MP

Very good suggestion indeed and I would add that we hope to see more independent candidates at the next GE. I feel that independents stand a better chance of getting voted into parliament than any of the existing alternatives.

Gemami:
I don’t think LSL encouraged independent candidates but there is no harm trying. The issues affecting our country just get darker each day as though a dark cloud is descending on us. What will we see the sun?

He has always advocated candidates to stand behind a registered party more for accountability and also discourage those fly-by-night politicians.

Hernendas:

I am also abroad but that does not mean I am idle and doing nothing to help my country. By all means, migrate but let your heart be close to Singapore and don’t let your heart goes cold. You can also do something for our country when working or studying abroad.

In fact, when you are abroad, you have a foretaste of how bad our country is run and that make you want to do something for SIngapore.

Hi Gilbert,

I made the suggestion of standing as independents because the general mood I am getting is that the Opposition has lost their focus and the reasons for their existence, very much like the PAP.

I was hoping that credible groups of independents come together to stand in GRCs. Who knows, it might just work if these independents can convince the electorate that they are worth a try.

The best part of it all is that they need not have to toe their feets to any party lines, which might be a good thing after all. They can take up any issues as long as they believe in them and this might just benefit the citizens more than any political party can.

As for PM’s call for would-be politicians to join a party, well, it might be good to go against what the PAP tells us. We must test their fears.

I believe it is good that the cureent opposition is keeping quiet.

PAP is screwing up big time and it is there for all citizens to see.

Oppostion should continue their hardwork, keep quiet and not distract from the suicide PAP is committing.

Why make noise and allow PAP the right to scold them, and distract from their errors at hand. PAP is doing a good job demolising itself.

Tharmans statement in parliament was plain confusing. He is in politics but does not feel appropriate to do the political right thing.

He is beholden to the employers and FIs.

MAS – who is to check that they are truly independant? God? CPIB ?

haha !

sooner or later it will happen.

ST forum pages – the editors have allowed the demonising of Tan Kin Lian. A matter of time :)

Mr Tan, if your heart is in the right place, God will protect you.

is anyone writing in to ST to counter what that Chua guy said?

I think Gilbert mentioned he did.

Calling all MPs who were not voted in by the people. but instead co-opted in by the government. Its time for you to have a conscience and step down and get in by election and not by the back door.

How can you accept all the pay you are getting. The people did not vote you in. You did not stand for election. Dont be so thick skin. Have some morals in your life for a change. I get sick to my stomach when i see all these so call ministers trying to cash in on thier freebies taking part in events. It sthe only time we see them.

Step down or stand for legal election. Let the people vote.

#61 isd
It does not matter whether you are refering to me directly or indirectly ; I maintained that the way you wrote on #21 was inappropriate.

Supporters or ex-supporters of whatever parties are still felow citizens
If there is any issue, highlight all the facts. No need to throw insults at each other.

@ 70) minibombed

you are truly daft, i am not even referring to you indirectly.
PAP leaders are not even fit to give me advice , so you
can keep your comments and re examine your own statements
before trying to tell me mine is inappropriate. LOL
i have no time for smallminds and just remember to each his own.
only those who truly suck on PAP bananas will be offended.
trust me i am holding back and they deserve worse.

@isd

truly, what are you proposing here? that the world should be divided into those who eat bananas and those who don’t?

Honestly, the recent global financial crisis started in US and the extent of the damage is now difficult to fix; hence the leaders and central banks trying all forms of measures to fix them. With liberalisation of banking sector, it is inevitable that we import all sorts of products sold to unsophisticated retail investors. And the results are the man in the street losing their hard-earned savings, and the many bank staff losing their jobs. Let us hope that goodies handed out by govt will go to the citizens and businesses who need them most.

laserpointer,

he/she is talking about PAP bananas. what a laugh.
you don’t get the implication. never mind.
i agree with to each his/her own.
the real concern is the PAP members who are suppose to represent the
people have not spoken up. Why only Tan K L is doing so ?
Absolutely dissapointing. Not much of a future if the country is run by
the present lot.

They forget to send invitations to the MPs.
also, need to group into different grcs first so the MPs can find their own people and “assist”. all in 1 bundle, how to help. haha…