It is case law that defamation even formed in the frame of a question is liable to damages.

If Mr Tan does intend to pursue a case against Mr Chua, he can do so.

However my opinion of Mr Tan is that he is much more in character than as suggested by some people in Singapore. By not doing anything other than stating his own case again, Mr Tan has again demonstrated how a man of character should act.

Where a man of character steps up to help his fellow countryman, I would have assumed his countrymen would be in total support of such actions. It is indeed rather strange to find cases of people questioning such motives.

Even if it was in the promotion of the TOC, why discount or worse ignore completely as Mr Chua has done, the benefit to those who attended his rally or signed the petitions?

Indeed, imho, the motives of the author of the forum letter is far more in question than that of Mr Tan’s.

Who does Chua represent? himself only?

I feel that this issue should not be let off so lightly as it can have other deeper implications and could invite other assassinations of character the same way. This can get out of hand if such articles will be continued to be published.

To prevent such vicious attacks on character, I feel that :
1. ST should clarify why they published unsubstantiated allegations.

2. Will ST continue to publish such articles attacking people’s character in future?

3. Chua should be sued if he cannot substantiate his claims. This is to educate the public about Ethics and Social responsibility.

4. Is other readers write in to criticise others based on unsubstantiated claims, will ST also approve it and publishe it? YES / NO ?

I do not expect these tough questions to be replied for some unspoken reasons.

In Uniquely Singapore state newspaper, it’s ok to attack people who has anti-PAP stance but be reduced to rubble if you say anti PAP messages.

What a free country…

well done mr tan lin lian.

but will the straits times publish it?

hope it will.

if not people will write to forum to complain that the straits times is not fair.

I find that all this will only grow the civil unrest currently on the ground.

It is for a good cause and I hope that TKL will not be affected by such unwarranted accusation.

Keep up the good work TKL. I have all along support your work and will not waver.

Personally I believe The Straits Times must be receiving quite a handful of letters in support of Tan Kin Lian. Many of whom would be like you and I who are moved by his actions and are willing to pen a letter to the papers, but more would be from those investors who received his help.

But of course, there’s limited space in the forum. As always. So destructive letters which do not contribute to nation-building ought not be published.

I am proud that you deem fit not to respond to personal attacks.

You are magnanimous. (unlike other thin skinned ministers)

Agree with Jackson Tan.

On our part, it will be good to say our own piece and ‘move on’.

There is no point dwelling on ONE comment that does not agree with what TKL is doing. We must focus on our own good and continue to lend support to TKL for the good of others.

Let the barking dog continue to bark. We just need to put earplugs into our ears. Do not squat down to the dog’s level and bark back at him.

Bravo Mr Tan…spoken like a true gentleman and person of character. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

“Some people need to get sue then they know how to keep quiet.”

A famous quote from our dear leeder……

It is very obvious that ST and Mr Chua have a common shameless master behind them.

we should developand encourage a culture of grace, decency and respectability.

people who wantonly conduct character assasinations should be seen as people with character flaws. if such characters were allowed to rise within our establishment, it will reflect badly on what we are as a nation, and as a people.

our young must be led along a path of righteousness, that goodness and integrity are virtues to be rewarded. unsavoury acts should be frowned upon and rejected. if our young think that the path to a successful career is to do the dastardly things, then what can we look for into the future?

redbean:

I agreed with what you have to say. People have eyes to see, hearts to feel and spirit to concur. Singaporeans now are not as blinded as beofre due to so many events that have happened lately.

Many slumber people woke up lately and now ponder on other options? Is this what will be the best for Singapore moving on forward? Do I still feel that life will be better for myself, my children and their children’s children.

What you have done Mr Tan is admirable and the whole nation will stand behind you – at least 70% of them for what you have done.

Have no fear for the righteous have nothing to hide and be fearful about.

We will fight together with you for the betterment of our country. Count on me!

What happened to the very confident Chua SY huh ?
Hellooo! ? hellloooooo? Mr Chua are you home ????

Care to come for tea at HLP ?

also can buy you mee siam of whatever flavor you like.

Helllooooo, callling mr Chua SY, chua sy , you there?

hellloooooo? Chua , how are you?

Good Afternoon,

You see the whole issue is simply this. And only this: why should the editors in ST even have given this opinion piece written by Mr Chua the frontage they did?

This remains the nagging question. Was it just an administrative oversight? Or was it calculated to inflict personal damage of the most vicious kind – that we all abhor and consider repugnant?

Let me put it this way: let us say that I have a rabid pit bull and when you walk by my house; and I unleash this mad dog with the gate open.

Tell me, if someone ends up in the hospital or the morgue; who is really to blame? The owner, dog or you the passerby?

Do you all understand now?

The moral of the story is stupid people should never be given discretionary power under ANY circumstances; that’s why we don’t have people who regularly hear voices piloting commercial jet liners or managing nuclear power plants. And here what you all need to ask yourself is whether; it may not be such a bad idea, if the person or persons who started all this and I am certainly not referring to Mr Chua, is reposted to the Sino Russian border of the Singapore meteorological institute to study the migratory patterns of yellow tailed finches?

In my experience, there is only one way to deal with stupid people. They are the REAL threat to our national security. Any other way, will simply be too expensive.

SD (Internet Liaison officer of the brotherhood)

13) Gilbert Goh Keow Wah on November 19th, 2008 11.51 am
I believe should there be a total change of leaderships, many singaporeans abroad will definately thinking of returning back and claim their rightful nation once called singapore.

if this chua toad makes his appearance at the speakers’ corner…and repeat what he had written…i strongly suggest all of us standby with our shoes, sandals, slippers, chakia…etc

my friendly words to our young. do the right thing, do the honourable thing. do not stoop down and compromise your own integrity and ethical standards for a little piece of gold.

earn your keeps honourably and sleep with a clear conscience.

these are simple guidelines to live by and you will not regret it in the later part of your lives when you are a bit wiser. it is not worth it to stray in the dark side.

hi gilbert,

the least we can do is to show the young the right path.

cheers.

Good work Mr Tan Kin Lian,
I supported you all the way.
Let’s give the thumb-up for Mr TKL doing the job ‘help the investor’.

The sympathy that you show to the people of Singapore make we proud off.
Unlike the MPs, they have no concern at all.
Hard earn money of the investors of their retirement age.
Now their money are gone…….

I certainly admire Mr Tan’s decision to not even address the personal attacks. But the crux of the matter is, as Mr Tan highlighted: why did the press not edit out Chua’s ad hominems? Surely they bear some responsibility for it, and ought to explain themselves. I think Mr Tan deserves no less than an official apology in the ST, as well as the publication of his response. If defamation has occurred, it seems to me that the ST is inadvertently participating in it if they choose to do Neither of these actions, since they’ll be implicitly endorsing Chua’s view (libelous remarks and all) simply by not allowing Mr Tan a chance of rebuttal.

I think readers can do their part by penning letters to the ST, or at least leaving comments on the official ST website.

Mr Tan, great job. Please continue to focus on what you set out to do for the people. Don’t be bothered by what will be thrown at your way from time to time. People can judge by the fruits of your labour. Even if you do not defend allegations with words, your actions and focus will be more than enough to show people what you are truly fighting for.

Be wise and choose our battle. One doesn’t have to take the PM’s approach of fixing the opposition or throwing legal suits at people. Pettiness doesn’t get us anywhere. Fix the problem and let the results silence the naysayers.

Has Mr Tan replied to the ST Forum? If not, can someone post in the ST Forum to direct ST on-line readers to his blog to read his reply?

#23)
It’s already there

I think the whole nation is waiting with bated breath for Mr Tan’s reply. Maybe it will be out tomorrow…or maybe they may switch it to the online forum section whereby less people will view it unless they are online viewers.

Some, like Mr Chua may question the motive of Mr TKL in organising a talk at HLP to educate the investors and update them on current practices.

I would say that whatever motive Mr TKL may have, is not the point. The important part of it is that those poor investors have received good information from Mr TKL where they can make use of to fight for some compensation. These are pratical solution given by TKL unlike some ministers give unrealistic recommendation. An example is the encouragement of everyone not to stop spending during this economic down turn. Instead try and spend more if possible. What crab suggestions. This can only do the country good but not for the citizens.

I think the whole nation is waiting with bated breath for Mr Tan’s reply. Maybe it will be out tomorrow…or maybe they may switch it to the online forum section whereby less people will view it unless they are online viewers. – Gilbert Goh

Let’s see how underhand ST will be. If it does not play underhand to Mr Tan Kin Lian, then we should applaud it for doing its job.

20)Mohd Hamim
Yup! Mr Tan has done a wonderful job and I salute him for his perseverance.

I will bet you that ST will edit Mr Tan’s letter until theres nothing left.

All contrbutors to the Straits Times forum has to provide full details before the letters will be considered for publishing by the ST meaning the Chua “toad” as one of the earlier commentors have mentioned is a real person. Furthermore the ST is well known for censoring, editing as they call this, contents of letters not favorable to the ruling party. It is not surprising that the ST printing the unsubstantiated remarks, character assassination of you, since you are apparently touching on the raw nerves of people in control by continuing with the rallies.

There is also no need to answer questions from toads such as Chua, who as you mentioned is not reading widely enough to understand the situation. However since the ST has published the letter, responding to these is important otherwise the toad will assume that he is accurate since the ST is endorsing his letter without editing these out.

If your main objective is focussed on educating the investors, I salute you. I am however curious and wonder what you did during your tenure in NTUC in this area. I am not a fan of NTUC persee

someday wrote – “if not people will write to forum to complain that the straits times is not fair.” – what good will this do? Do you think the ST is going to publish any of this. It is perhaps already screening out the positive letters regarding this issue on you that is being sent in to the fourum.

There is a saying from ne of the philosophers – If you are stupid, it is better to keep your mouth shut, then to open it and confirm that you are stupid

There seems to be a group of citizens who will write to parrot what the govt says and attack any opposing viewpoints. Checking their names and their background, you will not be surprised to find many of them belongs to which party.

Anyway, ST is such a lousy paper (despite its makeover). Its news is always two days late and worse, I found many of their new correspondent plagiarize from online blogs and newspapers!

So no surprise that it will go to such a low standard as long as the letter is pro-govt. No surprise also becasue many of its editors and administrative stuffs are in cahoot with the govt.

some say TKL is a pap spy, others say he is from the opposition, still others say he wants to run for EP post, nobody knows his motive.

I see TKL is right in not stooping low like our “national leaders” in sueing
Chua although he has a case. Now we can see how gentlemen behave. Not
cowards who seek to destroy peoples lives and families even after they won
the elections

some say TKL is a pap spy, others say he is from the opposition, still others say he wants to run for EP post, nobody knows his motive. – Tew NS (#32)

Nevertheless, it is uncalled speculation. It seems to eschew the opinion that unless a politician emerges under the PAP banner, he/she does not have questionable integrity or motives. This is blind faith in the PAP brand.

My gut feeling is that the majority of Singaporeans will support TKL in his quest to help our fellow citizens when they need a helping hand.

In fact, all this will only put TKL in the limelight without him doing much. It can only do him alot of good if he really wants to consider politics.

How the opposition parties or individuals must have crave for such attention which they need to spear head their parties into the future.

There may be more to come and I hope TKL is emotionally prepared. REading up autobiographies on past leaders like Mendela and MArtin Luther King will surely help. It is surely uncharted path from now on for Singapore.

Even if TKL do have an intention to go into politic, so what is wrong with that? at least the people knows that he is helping them in troubled time, where are the rest of the capable people out there? where are the MPs? all just disappeared! and should he be elected into parliaments, this is his ability to show and care for the people in the street, the citizens of singapore, so whats the problem? all I can see is only problem to the ruling party because they cannot compete so they are afraid of losing, thats all.

I believe Mr Chua has willingly opened himself to be vulternable to lawsuits for defamation.
But I believe Mr Tan would not take such actions, not because he can’t, but he won’t, unlike someone who wish to exert such powers to silence particular individuals, because his time and effort is probably better spent pursuing matters which are in the interest of the general public.

Observe the stark difference between this incident, and the recent hoo-ha about some civilians wearing rather unique T-shirts.

@36
You can’t blame the MPs as we now know that they would be busy trying to sweep things under the carpet. ;)
Don’t blame the alternative political parties too, for some are busy defending themselves.
We should all take this as a lesson learnt, as to why sanity checks and balances are always necessary in the system, and not to take things purely by the surface value without understanding.

Just my 2 cents.

Hi Tew NS (#32)

some say TKL is a pap spy, others say he is from the opposition, still others say he wants to run for EP post, nobody knows his motive.

My purpose is to help the misled investors to get fair compensation for their losses. I do not have any of the other “speculated motives”.

At the end of the day, people will know whether Mr Tan Kin Lian is a man of character or has a hidden agenda. Singaporeans are not stupid or blind. I have yet to hear one bad piece of bad gossip of him during his time at NTUC.

TAN KIN LIAN FOR PRESIDENT!!!!

Dear Mr Tan,

Mr Chua (the author of the letter) and the editor at St that allowed the publication of the letter is one of many that have attempted to discredit your actions.

Just look at what some of Singapore’s future? leaders have to say (if the One party government remain to be the only party government in future)…
http://www.youngpap.org.sg/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=22284 from
So Tan Kin Lian thinks he can form a political base in SG???

it is time to expose the Bigots and the Rubber Stamper Leaders wannabe…

Legal action might be an option or even necessary. Any lawyers out there can advise?

good job Kin Lian !
not for just being helpful to those affected investors,
but staying cool to those who try to undermine you.
i agree with your calm response to devious attacks and also
not following the PAP way of sueing. Your pursuit in finding solutions
to help the people is the best example for all fellow Singaporeans.

PAP leaders and MPs, are you watching and learning ?

I’m always more suspicious with news editors general intend. The letter by Chua Shen Yang is still there in the ST online forum, but the articles sent by citizens regarding town council’s sinking funds have been taken out. One word comes to mind. Damage control. But editors still see fit to leave Mr Chua’s letter there. If I were an MP reading The Online Citizen, I would be shocked and dissappointed to see new media expressing true emotions instead of the silly rumblings in ST forums. The ground is still shaking but the ivory tower newspaper has already chosen it’s side.

About the ST online forum. I don’t think many people are reading it. I think ST has a group of people working behind the scene reading postings from elsewhere and extracting these posts to post onto their own forum.

I know, because my post is still there under a pseudonym that is not mine.

44) ErniesUrn on November 20th, 2008 9.51 am

……………. but the articles sent by citizens regarding town council’s sinking funds have been taken out.

I can still find the letters:

- Town Council losses: Who’s accountable?

- Town Council losses: Let it not happen again

- Questions over losses by town councils

Which letter is missing? Maybe you want to check ST again.

About the ST online forum. I don’t think many people are reading it. I think ST has a group of people working behind the scene reading postings from elsewhere and extracting these posts to post onto their own forum.

Yeah have you notice, they dont attribute either the source of the post or even copy it with respect to who wrote it. Instead, they edit it in such a way whereby these post just appear out of nowhere.

So much for accountability.

I admired Mr Tan Kin Lian effort for the people in HL!

Keep it up! Mr Tan

and take care yr health

That Mr Chua Sheng Yang could it be another Chua sister’s brother in-law ??

Unfortunately but predictably, the ST left out the critical parts, namely the last paragraph and the quote before that. Mr Tan’s actions speak louder than the words that were omitted, but let’s hope the people are listening in first place.

‘Truth’ is like water. The more you try to conceal it, the worse the spillage…..

Now I understand why people call it the Shitty Times.

Good enough to hold shit but not good enough to hold truth.

Chua Lee Hoong, Chua Mui Hoong, Chua Shen Yang.

The first two are political correspondents at the ST. They were formerly ISD agents.

Not sure if the last Chua is former/current ISD, their brother (the first two Chuas are sisters), a ghost writer (aka gahmen-commissioned under a pseudonym)…

Maybe he is just a concern *offline* citizen, maybe.

Of course, maybe pigs will someday manage to fly. (damn, they already do. AIRPORK! hahahahahah)

46) sarek_home on November 20th, 2008 10.11 am

Thanks. They are back but i think for some part of wednesday, i couldn,t find the articles. Maybe it’s just me… Thanks anyway!

Hmm…it appears that this Mr Chua is a troll or attention seeker…

Back in March this year, he also created a maelstorm with his forum letter (”Demos at Speakers’ Corner? No, they could hurt S’pore”)

Does make one wonder whose payroll is he really on…

54) xtrocious

Anywhere we can have a read on this letter?

xtrocious,

Maybe Mr Chua is from PAP youth wing. Or trying to curry favour to land a gahmen scholarship.

Or maybe he’s really deluded, and sincerely believes what he writes. In any case, the Sh!t times would only be too happy to publish such views.

Even though he has grounds to do so, by not taking defamation action against the Straits Times and Chua Sheng Yang, Tan Kin Lian has shown class and character. It is so refreshing to see someone like this after all the “small minded” antics of the likes of LKY, LHL and their PAP elites.

I applaud you, Mr Tan and dare say that you have earned the respect and admiration of many Singaporeans.

http://www.zaobao.com/yl/yl081122_509.shtml

From above url, I realised that TKL was a PAP member according to ZAO BAO article. Just thought some may like to know. I know, this may not surprise many due to his previously-held position.

#15

As much as I like writing with a lot of imagery, I must say that that was a very vicious attack on The Straits Times. Like they say, victims of vicious attack become vicious themselves. You’ve unfortunately also let out some secrets, through your graphic story, that might elsewhere have been enforceable under a well-known security act. Do not ever point out again the fact that those who write for mainstream media, and those who write outside of it, hear things that they are not supposed to hear. I’m only telling you this for your own good, and mean no offence or harm in any way.

Many forex traders find themselves asking the age old question what’s the best forex strategy? To know the answer to that question, one must look at the history of trading. Not just forex trading, but trading, in general.

The moment that the first bell rang on the stock market floor, traders were coming up with strategies to beat the market. Obviously they didn’t have the technology that most of us have at our disposal. They didn’t have the thousand dollar charting platforms that so many traders are overpaying for, just for the privilege of using them, nowadays. So how do you think the successful traders of the past made their money?

Well, one way was through fundamental analysis. They were able to comprehend a company’s financial statements such as balance sheets, income statements, statement of cash flows, etc…. to know a bargain when they saw one. But these kind of people would be categorized as investors, not traders. Traders generally believed in technical analysis over fundamental analysis.

So how did traders of that generation made their money? Simple. They understood the concept of price action. Plenty of floor traders became rich just by paying attention to how the other floor traders were trading the respective stock.

How come a concept as simple as price action has been pushed back in favor of all the technological bells and whistles that most people use in their day to day trading?

People, today somehow feel that the best forex strategy has to be in these maze of indicators,colors, noises,and whatever else is en vogue nowadays. Its really quite sad that it has gotten to this point.

Traders used to pride themselves on how they were able to truly understand the market, but in the present time we live in, they are more worried about understanding what their indicators are telling them.

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