Andrew Loh / Deputy Editor
So, the talk is that there might be an early General Elections (GE) in Singapore. The bets are being placed and the speculations have begun.
While the rumour mills churn, I would like to urge Singaporeans to ponder on one thing which is just as important as those who will be standing as candidates.
What will we, as Singaporeans, do when the elections are eventually called?
More often than not, we would be sitting on the fence – watching the elections as if it were the biggest show in town. It is, of course. But perhaps this time round, we will hopefully be more involved than in the past, if we were not.
When the Malaysian elections tsunami swept across the peninsular, many of us here in Singapore were awed by the power of the tidal wave. We never thought it was possible.
When Barack Obama won the American presidential elections, we too were awed – by the historical victory which brought the first African-American into the White House. We never thought it was possible.
Will Singapore see similar waves sweeping across our tiny island come the next GE? Some have said it is not possible while others yearn for similar tremors to hit our shores.
But to just hope and dream will not make it happen. The one reason why Malaysia and Obama happened was because of ordinary folks who got out to vote, or got involved. Obama, for example, mobilized an army of ground troops made up of ordinary – young and old – Americans who volunteered their time and money and helped out in the campaign. Even on the Internet.
So, the question for us here in Singapore is this: Will we do the same?
My hope is that when the elections are called, ordinary folks like you and me will take an active part in it. There are many ways to help out and get involved. You could join one of the political parties as a volunteer, and help them in distributing leaflets, putting up banners and flags; or help their candidates in research, writing speeches. You could be their election agents, polling agents, counting agents (the opposition parties especially need these).
You could blog about it, become a citizen journalist and report on what you see and hear in your constituency. You could question your potential MPs about certain issues you care about. You could persuade those who are apathetic to pay attention to the issues which will affect them. Or talk to your friends, relatives and colleagues about what concerns our nation. Write to the press about your views, write to TOC! The best thing to do to inspire others is to get involved yourself! There are a million things you could do during an election, even if you were not a candidate or a party member.
There are things you can do as ordinary Singaporeans to effect the change you want to see – just as the Malaysians did. Just as the Americans did.
So, to me, the biggest question about the next elections is not when it will be called, or who to vote for, or who will win and by what margins.
The biggest question is: Will Singaporeans take an active role in the elections?
The parties and the candidates are just one part of the equation. The second – and in my opinion, the more important – is the people.
Whether Singaporeans care enough to be involved will determine whether what we thought impossible is made possible.
So, while the wheels continue to spin on the rumour mills, lets ask ourselves if we would summon enough courage and give of our time to make the next elections truly a People’s Elections.
Impossible is nothing – if we want to see change we can believe in.
And please believe that you and me – ordinary, HDB-dwelling folks and everyone else – can make a difference.
For me, I already know what I will be doing when the polls are called.
And it is something which is not impossible.
So, do give a little thought to what you could do for Singapore when the hustings begin.
———
150) Gilbert Goh Keow Wah
You know what? you have 10 very good points that suggest that you might be right.
Considering that the PAP usually picks the worst weather forecast to call for an election, I feel it would be in January, at the soonest.
However, my gut feeling is that this time around, the PAP although might call one in January, it will still have to wait and consider how some of the current economic issues pan out.
And I think this will delay the election call. I suspect it is more likely to be called in the second half of 2009.
The bet is on!
Remember, just not too long ago, there were news that there were ywo major camps within PAP. GCT’s and LHL’s camps. They were able to co-exist becasue of you know who. – gemami (#137)
Don’t forget the older chinese-educated camp in PAP too. Looking at parliament membership, you can tell that this camp has been increasingly marginalised over the years. PAP disunity is definitely in the pipeline.
The rest I think can be ignored. LSH has started strongly as PM but has since faded away recently and I dont know why. Let’s hope that it is not the cancer sickness that he had before. That can only be bad for Singapore. – Gilbert Goh (#144)
Why bad? We don’t need a sick man to rule Singapore.
I realy doubt LKY is Singaporea and Singapore is LKY. There is life after him. – Gilbert Goh (#144)
There is life after LHL too. Singaporeans are among the most resourceful people and we will always work things out somehow somewhat. The Lees are a barrier to a better Singapore.
My gut feeling it will be as soon as January or February 09 right before the expansionary budget of juicy goodies to trick the population again. – Gilbert Goh (#150)
To provide for financial assistance to tide over the Global Financial Crisis is the government’s job. Credit is only due when the PAP government exceeds expectation and not when it is merely doing its job. Welfare has always the most neglected aspect of its job. If Singaporeans can’t see through this, they really deserve the s-h-i-t they are in.
Gemami/Gilbert
My bet is April 09 right after the budget debates.
1. They need some time for the minibond saga to fade into the background.
2. They want to throw some “ang pow” money to Singaporeans as part of the budget.
3. They need some time for all the ministers to seem to be working very hard for Singaporeans to justify their million dollars salary. Don’t be surprised all the ministers will be featured prominently in the MSMs in positive light for ordinary Singaporeans. In fact, this has already started with Lim Swee Say and Gan Kim Yong speaking out against DBS’s retrenchment.
4. The Elections Department need time to redraw the electoral boundaries. Don’t be surprised that Aljunied GRC will be dismantled. They also need some time to reorganise the grassroot machineries and get their candidates to do some ground work within the new boundaries first. Of course, the new boundaries info are for them only and will not be announced until much later. Something like “insider trading”.
5. Allow some time for the “fear” of a deep recession to stew a little longer. The fear now is not entirely widespread or deep enough. The more fear there is in Singaporeans, the better it is for them. Expect more retrenchment from big companies to come in the next 3 months just to fan the fire a little more.
Yamasan (#153),
Reading this Today article, I think that GE will be held in the second half of 2009. Judging from the concentration of propaganda in the article itself, which already hails a future PAP victory, I am sad to arrive at the same conclusions as you.
No matter how they dismantle or shift the GRC, I believe they will not be able to sustain their 66.6% anymore, if lucky with their inside adjustment they may still get slightly above 50%, if not then bye bye to them, too bad the citizens just want you out for good.
No matter how they dismantle or shift the GRC, I believe they will not be able to sustain their 66.6% anymore – tiredsingaporean (#155)
Actually, I think the PAP will set aside the goodies only for constituencies that had voted for them. In this way, it is most probably a sure-win and probably the most unethical means to win. It will be more pork barrel politics disguised in the name of national interest, although there might really be no competition against PAP. So pork barrel for what?
153) Yamasam
You could be right. GE very often coincided with the school holidays. Probably June.
I think Lai CF provides a valuable insight into the psyche of many Singaporeans, especially how he talks about democratic ideals and such being intangible and therefore, seemingly irrelevant. This is also why I feel our society is not ready for a liberal democracy…the basic attitude of the society is not there..yet.
Hi Smallvice585, Yamasan, Gemami, Tiredsingaporean, Chorus
I don’t think the ruling party will lose that many seats in Parliament yet. Maybe they may lose their winning margin compared to the GE 06. There are still many PAP supporters out there. People like you and me frankly are in the minority group that is we are those that would prefer some seats lost and even a change in govt.
However, due to the recent government’s mis givings, I foresee at least a GRC falling to the opposition together with the two long-held opposition wards. Singapore wants to send a strong signal to the govt that all is not well, they are unhappy. As in 1997, people want to let the govt knows that they will use the vote to twist the arm of the strong man. They will do it yet again as this time round things do look bad for the country.
I do hope that the opposition will seize this golden opportunity to look out for good and capable people to head their GRC as if they are selected all eyes will be on them again. They can’t just get elected and do nothing in Parliament as with the previous lot in 1997.
A better solution will be for a group of intellectuals with like-minded ideas to set up a new political party. Besides WP, the rest of the opposition parties could hardly be said to have create any impact in Singapore. Capable people like Alex Au, TKL, Philip Jeyeretnam, Mr Brown and others should stand up and be counted for Singapore. People know them and will vote for them by virtual of what they have done so far for Singapore. WHat have our MPs do for us even if they are elected by the people?
They will stand a better chance of beating the odds than any other candidates send by any other opposition. We tend to vote along party lines and this only favour the ruling party as who don’t know the PAP? However, if we have people whom the population knows and respects, the ball game is different. We have seen what TKL has done in HLP for the investors. My bet is that he has already won half of Singapore’s votes already. Most bloggers know Alex Au and he is quite a prominent figure. A new party of well known die-hard figures will only serve the country’s interest well.
Stand up for Singapore!
Hi Chorus,
I am a little surprise with your comment in #158, maybe a tinge disappointed as well. I have always regarded your views to be more pro-Singapore as opposed to pro-PAP. I see you as one of those who, in a way, tries to bring anti-PAP comments into a pro-Singapore perspective.
If one can re-visit CF Lai’s comments, you will see clearly that there is a hidden agenda that is not pro-Singapore, very anti-WP with a sublimal message to vote PAP and thus pro-PAP.
Not that this is bad in the narrow context of party affiliation or inclination. We respect an individual’s choice.
Also, with his take on the opposition, particularly WP, and why it was so quiet while claiming to supprt them, then it is also clear that he does not understand the workings of WP. Since when has WP played to the MSM’s gallery?
Party ot anti-party comments and sentiments aside, is there any ‘solution’ he has offered to his grieve? Yes, vote PAP. Now, this is also not wrong but he has to be clear that opposing views will be counter-offered.
Finally, when these counter-views are offered, he labels them anti-PAP. Don’t you think this is wrong? Many of us are pro-Singapore as opposed to anti-PAP. Believe me, if you were to put the WP in the govt’s position and should they behave the same way the PAP is doing, ignoring the voice of the people, the same level of disguntled accusations will also be directed at them, anti-WP.
So you see, it is not anti or pro parties sentiments. They must be seen as pro-Singapore. Even the ones who directly pour scorn on the PAP. These are the same people like CF Lai who does not know how to draw the line between PAP and Singapore, between LKY and Singapore and thinks that Singapore is either one or both of them.
This is totally wrong and any opinions thereafter must be judged based on this line of thinking. Therefore wrong.
I sincerely hope you return to your original position of being pro-Singapore.
Thanks
Party ot anti-party comments and sentiments aside, is there any ’solution’ he has offered to his grieve? Yes, vote PAP. Now, this is also not wrong but he has to be clear that opposing views will be counter-offered. – gemami (#160)
Lai CF failed to make constructive proposals on how to improve WP.
#159, Gilbert,
You asked capable people to stand up for SIngapore.
We had capable people like Francis Seow and Tang Liang Hong, they stood up, but where are they now?
It is better to wish for the old fart to go down than asking people to stand up.
Hi we are all armchair critics so it is all talk and no action also.
Unless we can truly rise up and do something concrete for our country, it is best not to criticise those in WP or any other parties who stand up and dare to go to the polls as candidates. These people are one in half a million among us and deserve our support and respect.
Some among us may want to do something during the next GE for our country – not neccesarily just as candidates. Some may just want to go and vote only. We all have a choice here.
We can argue till the cows come home and the ruling party will form the next govt for sure and even the next next. Our country is sheltered too long from indulging in party politics. We may have being guilty of leaving everything in the hands of the ruling party and now we have a foretaste of it all. Unless Singapore wakes up we are forever in this state of monopolistic control.
This is not only bad for the progress of our country in the long run but we may also suffer a slow death democratically. Our children and our children children will continue to be suffering in this state of inept governance whereby choices are taken from you. Whereby the govt says they know all and continue to dish out policies after polices at the detriment of our country. State institutions will continue to be privatised and cost of services will rise as new bosses look at boosting corporate profits more than providing reasonable services to the public. FTs will continue to come in droves as they are indispensable to our businesses for they are cheap and willing to work very hard. Employers will not want to employ our locals who need a certain minimal income to survive on.
Many Singaporeans I know have left the country in disgust. As many as 250,000 loyal citizens are abroad now both for work and study. Every year, as many as ten thousands more Singaporeans chose to stay abroad for reasons best known to themselves.
Let us rise up to do something for our country before it slides to nothingness.
16/11/08
Hi Gilbert Goh (164)-You have written many good positings and (165) the figure you quoted “as many as 250,000 loyal citizen are abroad……” maximum only 10% can just pack and leave and they are being replaced with the Foreign Talents (FT) who are now the “new Singaporeans or so called naturalised Singaproeans and bulk are from China and good example is like Gong Li (one can argue her husband is a Singapore born Singaporean).Next is how about the rest ie 90% who have to remain behind and their pockets are now hurt and burnt cos of high costs of living. Singapore is our only place we call Home and where can we all run to another Third Country, not so easy.
Regards
Andrew Chuah
Hi Gilbert,
I agree with Andrew Chuah that you have written some very good comments not only in this thread but in all the other threads of TOC as well. And I have also abserved that many of your posts do contribute in the way that it provokes one’s thinking in an angle the many might not even have thought of.
Your latest comment above serves to illustrate what I mean and the contents you have excellently included tells the whole picture doesn’t it?
For some, it might just be another comment by a poster too smart by half, but in reality, if one is to reflect deeper into what you have written, and look closer at what it might do for the future of Singapore, and to even think further than that, and give some thoughts to what it might do to our children, and our children’s children, then it becomes serious food for thought that should encourage us to do something about it right here, right now.
For others, all these talks might seemingly be, just talks. But yet, for some like you and I, this IS serious business. Seriouos enough to talk about it and do something about it. If not in big ways like joining a political party, then in small ways, like explaining the way I have been trying to do so, or to go help out with the political party of your choice, etc etc.
For these reasons, I particularly would like to highlight the paragraph you have written that supports what I have just narrated. It is all there is to it, isn’t it?
Unless we can truly rise up and do something concrete for our country, it is best not to criticise those in WP or any other parties who stand up and dare to go to the polls as candidates. These people are one in half a million among us and deserve our support and respect.
And we do this by respecting each other in the manner each would present his opinions, comments and rebuttals, and, as in the manner each has risen up to support the party of his or her choice.
There is no need for childlish banters without any offer of solutions at the end of it (see #161) smallvice585 ‘s comment), does it not?
Many Singaporeans I know have left the country in disgust. As many as 250,000 loyal citizens are abroad now both for work and study. Every year, as many as ten thousands more Singaporeans chose to stay abroad for reasons best known to themselves. – Gilbert Goh
Another sign of PAP failure to retain Singaporeans for Singapore.
16/11/08
Hi Gemami *166-Thanks for your posting. Perhaps, 90% of us who are Singapore born, who still stays in Singapore, continue to pray to God to deliver us a Singapore “Anwar Ibrahim” or “Obama” but he must not try to dismantle everything Singapore is since her independence and must always put Singapore and her national interests above everything else and continue Singapore as a Free Economy and not making Singapore a welfare state (this is what we are seeing in neighbouring Malaysia where the Opposition held 5state governments are working towards a welfare state.Singapore must always remain a Free Economy and also have the very best brains for our Civil Service and our civil servants are the real ones who keep our nation going and making what Singapore is today and I salute these civil servants as we have the very best like Hongkong, Australia, New Zealand, Europe and USA.To me,Ministers are merely for PRs (yes, it is a must they have a certain academic qualifications also but not the very best unlike the old guards many did not have qualifications but the best of our civil service and its civil servants were there and are still here today.
I always believe that Singapore born Singaporeans who are qualified should be given automatically free education up to University even PHD and this is a very minute percentage of our GDP. And, the real poor Singaporeans, must be given all the help but not be given a blanket cheque like what USA President Elect Obama who won on the promise that those Americans who earn US$250k below would get a cheque from the Government or like our neighbouring Malaysia where the Opposition controlled 5 state governments are working towards a Welfare State this will drain our financial resources.
166) smallvice585
Exactly, and this failure in played out in other areas of managing Singapore as well.
The reason behind such a failure is the PAP govt’s approach to doing things thinking they have the mandate (blank cheque) to do so from the whole populace. It becomes a supreme and sovereign right, empowered by the people to do so without the need to even consult with us in regards to policies that affects us.
And this flawed perception is the result of 66.6% of the voting electorate who voted for them. Population-wise, it might be lesser than 66.6%. This is made worse when it continues to downplay dissenting voices as irrational and just plain ‘pain in the neck’ that can be cast aside.
“No worries, we have enough support to continue to saty in power”, they assume to the point of arrogance. This is where the danger lies.
Now, being a govt, it has to exercise its moral integrity to care for each and every Singaporean regardless of their party affiliations, but it has never ever exercise this level of integrity, sad to say.
Whichever party that becomes the govt is duty-bound to look after every Singaporean regardless who he or she has voted for.
16/11/08
Hi Gemami-Our Singapore Civil Service and its civil servants have been duly acknowledged by Malaysia’s Opposition Leader Anwar Ibrahim during the Malaysia’s General Election on 8/3/08 and his By Election and he was disgusted with the Malaysia Civil Service and its civil servants bulk are not qualified to be there, unable to do their jobs and no brains and are there because they are Malays and Bumis (90% of the Civil Service are Malays and Bumis since the introduction of the New Economic Poilicy-NEP).
16/11/08
Hi Gemami *169-Many good points but let us not Blame the PAP, let us blame also our Singapore Oppostion Parties and their leaders who are Quarter Baked. We now see a reformed Worker’s Party under Ms Sylvia Lim and she has alot of work to do inorder to win more than 1 seat currently held by the Secretary General Low Thia Kiang but is not easy as the latter will not give her a free hand and she is a lady and being a lady she has her limitations also unlike the defeated New Zealand PM Helen Clarke or the late Prime Minister of India Indra Gandhi. We saw one particular party and its leaders who are Running Dogs of those Foreign NGOs and fighting causes as instructed by these Foreign NGOs and one of its members replied to me ie “We need Foreigners to fight the PAP”and I replied back, We are Singaporeans and we fight our own battles and I doubt the Singaporeans will come and fight and die for us” The foreigners turned out to be former Singaporeans who stood in the previous General Elections and fled the country and we just saw one being convicted in court recently and he also pleaded guilty for being disrepectful to our Judiciary. He thought being a US citizen, the US government would send their marines to rescue him like the movie Black Haw Down”….sad they did not and prior to his conviction, he wrote the US State Department and State Secretary are watching my case and very concerned.
In the coming General Election, Chiam most likely will not be standing as I understand his health is not good.
16/11/08
Hi Gemami-Those Foreign Talents (FT) who replaced those Singapore born Singaporeans who have left the country are second and third clases and many created Social Problems and a good example is China Mamas who brought their kids to Singapore so called stuy (many don’t have monies to sustain themselves and their kids and resorted to prostitutions or as mistresses and breaking up our Singapore familes).
Perhaps, time for the Government to take a more bolder steps to make Singapore born Singaporeans feel more at home and hence they don’t think of migrating to Third countries and don’t come back and taking out their CPF after becoming citizens of these Third Countries. These new naturalised Singaporeans are not equal or better than we Singapore born and many also left for UK USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand as Singapore Passport are very honoured and respected by governments of these nations. Time has come for the Government to make Singapore Citizenship hard to get for these Foreign Talents especaily those from China, and make Singapore born Singaporeans feel more at home.
16/11/08
*Correction-should read as I doubt those Foreigners will come and fight, and die for us
170) andrew chuah
let us blame also our Singapore Oppostion Parties and their leaders
I think we have to be a little more forgiving when we blame the opposition for whatever they may be found wanting.
There is a huge difference how people view the PAP as opposed to how they view the opposition. When one talks about PAP,one would most likely talk about PAP, the brand. Never mind if the faces change but it is the brand that people are looking at. And this brand has been so well advertised that people would even buy into it blindly. And the best part of it all is these people will never admit that they are buying into the brand blindly.
On the other hand, the oppositions do not have a brand name to crow about. Look at JBJ, his brand dies with him the day he died. Look at SDP, the brand died with CST they day he was booted out by SCJ. Look at SDP now, the brand name is so tarnished by the PAP’s relentless pursuit to destroy it. Look at WP. The brand name will cease to garner the respect it is garnering now should LTK cease to exist.
So you see, we have a huge problem. how can the opposition build up their brand names if the people do not even dare to try their products.
Honestly, at this point in time, I do not blame the people for not daring to try the Opposition’s brand because the PAP has been able to do enough for the people to mis-trust these brands.
So, in order to stand shoulder to shoulder, the opposition and their customers must go out and tell non-believers that their products are good enough for them to give a try.
But before the people can do this, the opposition must do whatever is necessary to gain their trust too.
16/11/08
Hi Gemami-Good reply. The late JBJ was kicked out of Worker’s Party and WP has successfully reformed itself under both Low Thia Kian and Ms Sylvia Lim.The latter has done alot good work especially in Parliament but all the power still under Low who is the Secretary General a very powerful position.She has her constraints besides being a lady and a law lecturer. Low only caters for a small segment of Chinese Singaporeans ie the Teochews and is Chinese educated (from Nanyang University) He is not charismatic enough and able to reach out across whole of Singapore and all SIngaporeans.
The late JBJ went very personal ie only after Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew and also refused go with time, and all out to dismantle what Singapore is today since her independce under Lee Kuan Yew, which is not acceptable by the majority educated Singaporean who knows this and spells rouble for all Singaporeans .Further, his ideas are outdated and obsolete, and he refused to adjust and fit himself into the success of Modern Singapore.
For Chiam See Tong, he is too old and has health problem and I doubt he will stand in the next General Election. As for Dr Chee after taking over SDP, he thought with his Phd, he was able to reach out to every Singaporeans which he failed and he is not fighting for Singaporeans genuinely and I have asked myself this many times and just a mouth piece for foreign NGOs-very wrong of him to bring foreigners to Singapore for this and that conferences.A member of his party replied to one of my posting in another webside “We need foreigners to fight the PAP” and to me this is tatamounting to treason. Worse, his recent “Civil Disobedience” call and his latest book launched showed that he is only a Good Actor” and his court papers admitted taking monies from these foreign NGOs which led me to call him and his party Running Dogs of those foreign NGOs. He has yet to opening come clean why he back stabbed his former boss Chiam and kicked him out of SDP. I wonder why he did this-Chiam was sincere and gave him good publicity. Inshort, I don’t blame the PAP for tarnishing Dr Chee and SDP, they blame themselves, brought all these themselves (including PAP never ending legal suits against him and his gang, one after another).
I think Singapore needs a radical shift on how we operate politically. We cant operate the way we are peviously i.e. let the govt gets away with things that we feel are against the country’s benefit – casino, FTs, rising cost, F1, etc.
When we just keep mum whenever we are poked, the poke will get harder until there is a huge hole in us. The one who pokes will also know that we will not get angry nor can we do anything about it. In psychological terms, it is called conditioning. During Hitler time, he introduced alot of silly policies and at first it was subtle but slowly he called for the persecution of all Jews as they were accused of taking away the jobs of the local Germans. Soon, the Holocaust came and all Germans became immune to it as the persecution just got more violent. But the German people were very immune to such awful systematic prosecution to even say anything about it. I think our population and country suffer from this form of conditioning.
Firstly, we need a large group of vocal social/civil activists who will stamp their ground unrelentingly on issues that affect the common people. What TKL did is very good as it has many merits:
1. Protesting as a large group regularly on issues that affect the common people (investors).
2. Protesting within the law and above board.
3. Protesting without any ulterior motive on the part of the organiser.
4. Protesting systematically and without any violence.
5. Protesting against an issue that was dealth with unfairly
What that works for Singapore many years ago does not work now. Singaporeans should rise up and take action as we love our country too much.
To Gemami and Andrew:
Hi your comments put me to tears. I am merely a Singaporean who loves his country too much to see it go down the drain even though I am abroad.
Let us do what we can however small it is as when we consolidate what all the small people have say we will then have a larger voice.
Keep it up guys!
Hi Andrew,
Very detailed assessment.
However, I think it is time for everyone to re-focus, look into our mirrors and ask ourselves what is it that we want. Do we want to continue assessing the opposition according to the personalities in the oppostion camps or do we want to look beyond the personalities and see the cause they are fighting for and why they continue to represent the people the way they do.
Apart from CSJ and the late JBJ, no offence to them, and staying neutral to any judgement, I think parties like WP and SDA do have relevant causes to fight for and this is why they have been endearing themselves to the people.
What I am suggesting in my earlier post was that these parties make some effort to publicise their brand names. The individuals in these parties are far to big for the names of their parties at the moment. They need to make the party name bigger than they are.
Take PAP for example, apart for LKY, are the rest of his successors bigger than the party? The party has to be bigger than the names of any members.
Hi Gilbert,
I don’t think Singapore needs a radical shift. This will be too de-satbalising to the country. What it needs is radical minds to do things diffferently with one main focus in mind – the people and their well being. Not the way PAP has been doing which is to keep telling the people that that they have the best solutions for everything and therefore the people just have to support them and floow blindly.
Thanks
Face it. Singapore is small and we can only have one party system, not two.
LHL is right when he said, “But it is not our job to build up the opposition or split the party into two, because it is hard enough to find one team to look after the country. How can we find two?”
Those of you who truly wants the best for Singapore, instead of being armchair critics – join PAP and change from within.
Else, you can talk cock sing song here until the cow comes home and nothing will change.
178) PAP Anonymous
I almost agree with your argument and I am not being sarcastic, just in case you might think so.
Why do I say this?
If I were to consider your advise, I would first look at what I can bring to the table of discussion. Then I will see if there is any real chance of getting heard because 99.9% of those already in there will be the those who already subscribe to PAP’s ideology.
After considering this, I will think further; will the 99.9% give me a hearing or will they conveniently shut me up? I say this because PAP supporters have a habit of echoing their leaders without giving much thought to what they are saying and the implications of it.
So you see, it might not be such a good idea after all.
Finally, one of the most important ingredient is very much lacking in your suggestion. The people or the diversity of views from the people.
Your suggestion can only work if you presume Singaporeans (100%) believe in PAP’s ideology for Singapore.
It will not work because almost half of Singaporeans either do not trust the PAP enough or does not trust it al all.
So you see, it is not for anyone to say that this or that is the best option for Singapore. Singaporeans will decide for themselves.
No one should patronise us and we don’t need a nanny anymore. We have grown up.
17/11/08
Hi PAP Anonymus *178-I eead your posting and it is not so easy as there are others who are more senior than you in PAP and you look up and tell yourself-Woh long climb to the very top and even you get to see Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew, he has to hear out your arguments and many who got the chance to meet him, will just sing praises and not voice out (same in Malaysia when Dr Mahathir was the PM, those selected to stand as BN/UMNO MP would sing praises. I am an old man,age 48 and tasted life since 1997 Asia Financial Crisis and lost more than S$30million pledged to those banks in Singapore and fought those Senior Bankers who lied in their sworned affidavits, up to Singapore Supreme Court.
What Singapore needs a Singapore Anwar Ibrahim who is for all Singaporeans regardless of races and knows how to fine tune PAP policies not to dismantle what Singapore is under PAP since her independence, besides putting Singapore national interests above all things ie (a) Internal Security Act-ISA still very relevant but needs to be modified and not used on Singapore Opposition members unless they are caught helping those terrorists, (b) Death Penalty for Capital Punishment ie Drugs Trafficking and Murder and (c) Singapore remains a Free Economy and not a Welfare State which Singapore Opposition Parties want to make it a Welfare State-this is rubbish as it will drains our financial resources.
17/11/08
Hi Gilbert Goh *178-Good to hear from you. I also travel alot overseas and hardly have time in Singapore and to us, Singapore is always in our heart and the only place we called “Our Home”, will die and be cremeated in Singapore.
Let us always put Singapore above all things and pray that we have a Singapore Anwar Ibrahim who is equal or better than the PAP and first he has to win a few more seats and then work with the PAP in Parliament and not dismantle everything the PAP has established since Singapore independence like the late JBJ who was a very selfish man-all out to dismantle what Lee Kuan Yew has established in Singapore and unable to fit himself into Modern Singapore and he played into the hands of Malaysia government which is UMNO dominated when he was first voted into Parliament ie he questioned our huge Defence Budget and this was a very wrong thing (this was and is still what the Malaysia government wants a weak defence force in Singapore). I met the late JBJ during my Singapore banking days in his old office in Colombo Court and I also met his protege MP Low Thia Kiang many times but I did not join the Worker’s Party. He did not play smart and he paid a very high price and lost everything and died without anything nor achieving his dreams for a Welfare State in Singapore.
What Singapore needs a Singapore Anwar Ibrahim who is for all Singaporeans regardless of races and knows how to fine tune PAP policies not to dismantle what Singapore is under PAP since her independence, besides putting Singapore national interests above all things ie (a) Internal Security Act-ISA still very relevant but needs to be modified and not used on Singapore Opposition members unless they are caught helping those terrorists, (b) Death Penalty for Capital Punishment ie Drugs Trafficking and Murder and (c) Singapore remains a Free Economy and not a Welfare State which Singapore Opposition Parties want to make it a Welfare State-this is rubbish as it will drains our financial resources. – andrew chuah (#180)
I finally see that we have some common ground here. But I don’t share absolute agreement with that is said. ISA should not be used on the Loyal Opposition. I have my reservations on the death penalty and I feel that it should be repealed.
On the aspect of welfare, Singapore should embrace welfare, but welfare does not have to be provided entirely by the state. In fact, I support further political liberalisation to encourage civil society to flourish and take up this role. Give trade unions the means to negotiate for their own welfare. Empower trade unions to manage their own welfare scheme, retraining scheme, retrenchment scheme, etc.
17/11/08
Hi Gemami-I have replied to PAP Anonymus and Gilbert Goh. We must know what we are talking and responsible on what we talk and on what we write unlike Dr Chee and his gang who are Running Dogs of those foreign NGOs, I have been writing short postings on Discuss-Singapore since 2001 and still write without fear or favour and have challenged Dr Chee to come clean why he back stabbed his former boss Chiam and he has failed to reply.
Let us write what is good for Singapore our only Home which we have. I have gone through hell and still struggling and moving forward in life, not so easy. For PAP Anonymus, I think he is a PAP member and very young man and just joined the PAP and believing in changing from within the PAP and this is not easy and just a dream very hard to be realised as one you are inside the PAP, Worker’s Party or even SDP, you have to toe the line.
17/11/08
Hi Smallvice585 *182-Good to hear that we have a few things in common.
My stand on Death Penalty is very firm ie must not be abolished at all costs.Despite Death Penalty for Drugs Trafficking since the law was passed, we still see these Drugs Traffickers using their runners to smuggle drugs and last week we saw a Malaysian youth age 19 sentence to death, and the same for Murder, we still see murders in Singapore. I have written on Discuss-Singapore that Death Penalty be used on International Drugs Syndicate in Singapore at all costs.
Welfare State will drain all the Singapore financial resources.President Elect Obama will fail in his Welfar State policy ie giving Americans earning US$250k and below a cheque. He is not a top calibre and will be a very weak President like the former Democrat President Bill Clinton and USA will be very weak in all front. I have written on Discuss-Singapore that free education to be given to all Singapore Born children up to University level and on TOC up to PHD and this is only a minute percentage on our GDP and will encourage Singapore Born Singaporeans not to migrate (many migrated also because of costs of education for their children). For the poor, the very poor, help must be given but not a blanket cheque.
Hi Andrew,
We all know that Chee has foreign support to do the things he does and it is also clear he has a lot of issues to grind with the PAP govt. With the mixture of these two components it is not surprising that the PAP finds it absolutely necessary that he and his SDP supporters be completely crushed and demolished.
When I first saw him and heard him at his first rally in Potong Pasir, it reminded me so much of LKY in his younger days (from the footages we often see on tv). At that time, I was telling my friends that we have to remember this name because the way he talked and the way he showed his passion was exactly like the man himself. I believe LKY saw himself in CSJ and feared for the PAP from that day onward. That is why the relentless obsession to destroy him. Sadly, CSJ played into the hands of the PAP and he lost himself after that trying in vain to clear his name.
I partly attribute Chee’s action to one who has been pushed to the corner and the only way out is to bite back even when all his teeth are being plucked out one at a time. If he has to end up biting with his gums he will continue to bite just to survive in the hope that he will be free one day.
I must be clear that I do not accept the methods he has adopted and is continuing to use especially with the dictation of these foreign NGOs. However, I will still support him only because this PAP govt needs someone to irritate them if not for anything else.
As to why he sacked CST, I shall not want to dwell on this as I have met CST a number of times and he can be quite headstrong and very firm on certain issues himself.
For people like PAP Anonymous, I do not have any quarrel with them. In fact, I would welcome pro-PAP comments so that we can discuss and find out why people still continue to give support to the PAP after all the wrong-doings that are so plain for all to see. Surely, the PAP is not perfect and there must be something these pro-PAP people would agree with us on?
Having said that, I will not hesitate to dish out in equal measure any anti-opposition comments that hit below the belt, or any over-glorification of the PAP.
PAP is not infallable and needs to be checked by an alternative voice.
18/11/08
Hi Gemami-Many thanks for your very interesting posting. We must have what is good for Singapore and her national interests and like Dr Chee and his gang being used by those foreign NGOs and taking monies for them to survive, and must not talk or write “hollows and unsubstantiated facts and “kena sue”. Yes, Singapore is not perfect especially now and the PAP is now too strong and very arogrant. Many of the PAP policies are flaws and need to be fined tune and open confrontation is not the solution in Singapore like our neighbours like Malaysia and Thailand ie taking to the streets as Singapore is too small and very fragile. Dr Chee’s recent book and call for Civil Disobedience are madness and absurd.
Going out meet clients now, write some more later (busy day today)
Lee Kuan Yew is SIngapore, Singapore is Lee Kuan Yew.
Singapoe for Singaporeans.
Vote PAP in GE2011, and Opposition can start thinking on GE2016 if theya re prepared and have the resources to survive till 2016.
WHy GE2011 for PAP?
SImply that if present recession which is most likely to turn into a full blown GLobal Depression worse that 1973, worse than 1980s recession, worse than 1997 Asian FInancial Crisis, worse than 9/11, at this moment in time, and for the next 5 years, who is in better place to pull Singpaore out of the recession?
What can 20% of Opposiiton do in Parliament – like British parliament jsut veto PM Brown rescue Plan?
Can Singapore affords to take that kind of approach of letting Opposiiton to hinder Economic Rescue Plans?
SIngaporeans?
Do they care so much about political opposition as to their livelihoods come GE next year, 2010 or 2011?
Me?
I will vote PAP as it is a Hobson’s Chocie, whetehr it is a nag or a steed, at elast I got the “ride”.
Opposiiton?
They can’t even afford to paln for a stable, let alone afford to buy a wind-broken nag.
Civil Disobedience and street disorders after demise of Lee Kuan Yew?
You must be joking as we recently commissioned those Leopold Main Battle Tank (MBT).
MBT is most unsuitable for jungle warfare, crossing numerous streams, plus a sittign duck in urban warfare that even the isrealis encountered in Gaza Strip.
Draw yur own conclusion as why SIngapore needs MBT.
Technology transfer?
All of you ahve high ideal, kudos to you all.
But like Chee Soon Juan and his ideals, do they “sell” to that 90% SIngaporeans staying in HDB Heartlanders?
As Low TK ousted Jeyaretnam, simalrly, who si goign to oust Low TK to move it into a new direction as what Low TK did for post-Jeyaretnam WP?
if this si the style of Low TK, defendign Hougang, an donly Hougang is Sngpaore to him, a smallish localised unique poltiical party centralised at Hougang only, you called that Oppostion in Singapore?
Like Chaim See Tong in GE2006, only Potong Pasir liek hsi eprsonal fiefdom.
No, germani, you read me wrongly.
COme GE2011, if given the chance to vote, I will vote PAP.
Clowns beling to circus, certainly not in Parliament.
As early as last year, I said I will vote anyhting but PAP, including Ah Meng.
But basing on WP performance on the Serangoon Gardens Worker Dormitory Incident in Aljunied GRC when WP si all by invisible, offering to moral support to residents there.
And yet, 34% or more voted for WP in Aljunied GRC during GE2006.
You call that Oposition party, so fearful fo even its own shadow in deciding to be good little church mouse.
Voting for Opposiiton?
What choice are they offering to “voters?
“A Better Singapore” only for the Intelligentsia which “understands” all thsoe high-sounding “poitical theories”?
But how about sellign that “A Better Singpaore” to all those 905 HDB dwellers, the very source of politicla power to PAP, and even to any political party in Singapore?
Dear lai CF,
I am taking a long, deep breath while writing this reply.
Now let’s see.
1. Let’s put your first declaration to the test. Why don’t you write on a big cardboard these words, ‘Lee Kuan Yew is Singapore and Singapore is Lee Kuan Yew’, hang the cardboard over over neck and walk around in Singapore with it?
How will you know if your declaration is right or wrong?
Well, you said the opposition has 20% support, so, if 80% of Singaporeans clap while you walk with the cardboard that bears your declaration, then you have proven me wrong. But if you see them laughing till their guts fall out of their tummy, you will know how stupid it sounds. Prove it to us and we will shut up for good and vote the party you want us to vote. Fair enough?
2. Global recession, it happened in ’73, ’80 & ’93 you say. You also said the PAP govt got us out of them. Take another minute or two to digest these words you are uttering. Done? Any enlightenment? No?
May I ask you, do you not think the people played just as imporatant a part? If you do not think so then you and I are the same in the eyes of the PAP govt. Nothing but digits. So what’s so grand about voting or supporting the PAP? They see no difference between you and me once the election is over. They will oppress you the same way they oppresses the rest.
Another thing, did they really got us out of those recessions? Indeed they did, from the frying pan into the fire, that is. Has life gotten any better, any cheaper, and more humane? Or have the PAP become more arrogant by the day that we now hear the head of the 14 PAP town councils telling Singaporeans we should be thankful for losing $16M in failed investments? Gosh! Why am I reasoning with you even?
3. Opposition. I concede that I more or less agree with some of your observations. But this is as far as I would go. Why? Because, when I know I am walking with a crook (PAP), trouble will find me before I find it. In such situation, I would prefer to follow even a cripple (Opposition). Clear enough?
4. Voting. To each his own then. I am glad that you have decided and you have your own reasons to vote for your choice. My hope is for all Singaporeans to take time to decide like you. You have done well in your own way and it is good.
5. MBT: What can I say? Are you deciding your vote because of the MBT (out of fear?), or, are you so head-over-heels with the MBTs that any party that possesses it will win your vote? Are you saying you condone violence and oppression? For to use or to even think of using military force on its people in peaceful time is tantamount to oppression. You have decided for such a party? Good for you, your family, your children and your friends.
Finally, you originally stated that you stood to be converted but it seems this is furthest from the truth. You were never ready to be converted.
Whatever, it is, thanks for sharing, and, don’t forget to prove your declaration of what LKY is to Singapore.Good luck! You need it.
Gemami/Andrew/lai CF
I think we all should give due respect to divergent views here. There is no point trying to convert one another. In due time, we will judge for ourselves who is right or wrong. Even then, it is a personal decision to make whether one stands for the ruling party or otherwise.
I find what lai CF wrote has it’s merits. Compared to other countries, we are better off than many. Having take a look at opposition politics here, one will make up the mind to vote for the ruling party given it’s solid credentials all this while and most importantly the stability factor. It is not surprising that at least 65% of our people will vote for the ruling party for many years to come. They are simply that good. If they have screw up big time, do you think people will vote for them?
There is no perfect political party in the world. Even the US will attest to that. In fact, sometimes I felt that the US system is like a big show with two candidates campaigning for 20 months to be President.
What we are talking here probably is the impact of swing votes. Will those who are adversely affected by the economy still vote for the govt? People change their voting pattern over the years. I have being a PAP supporter for many years but only lately have decide to swing my vote. Some who vote for opposition politics may also now decide to vote for the ruling party.
How many people swing their votes will probably be decisive especially in closely fought wards like Aljunied GRC. The ruling party won not more than 4% in that ward. The margin could be less than 20,000 votes. George Yeo and team could have lost and faded out of politics. It is that serious.
19/11/08
Hi Gi,lbert/Gemami/Lai CF-As I see it, Singapore Opposition needs a through revamping and perhaps merging into a sole entity to take on the PAP in the coming General Election and now the only credible Oppostion Party is the Worker’s Party who has revamped itself successfully and more relevant than before and the rest must follow likewise.Perhaps the winding of SDP will be blessings for the Singapore Opposition and a windfall of votes for the Worker’s Party.The SDP is a nuisance and a Running Dog of those foreign NGOs under Dr Chee and his gang also like the PAP believing that Foreigners are better than we local born Singaporeans and this I refer to one of his members reply to my posting on Discuss-Singapore ie “we need foreigners to fight the PAP”.
A total revamp for Singapore Oppostion is a must and perhaps after revamping to be headed by our Singapore Anwar Ibrahim and only then there will be light at the end of the tunnel.
Hi Gilbert, Andrew & CF Lai,
There is no doubt that Singapore’s opposition must revamp (and this is the only point I have agreed with CF Lai). It must come together to be the next alternative.
I agree with Gilbert that, as hard as it may be to accept, CF Lai has his valid points and it is his right to snigger and laugh at us, for now.
It is most unfortunate that I failed to make him see further than what the eyes can see. We need to see with our minds as well and see what the future will be like, in all sorts of possible scenarios.
Singapore is the people and the people is Singapore.
———
PM has already said that there is no room for a two-party system. Whether we like it or not, it is going to have its impact. The effect would be that most would still believe him blindly. Even those who do not subscribe to his believe will find that there is no room for anything more than two.
So you see, it becomes a case of ‘three’s a crowd’. If two won’t work for Singapore, you can forget three. Most Singaporeans will buy into this for sure.
Let’s just say the opposition is able to get together some top quality candidates, what happens next? They are not going to be able to take over and take control overnight. This is the reason why I have always preached patience and endurance. The erection of an alternative is going to be a long-haul process.
Singapore’s Anwar Ibrahim? This will have to wait. I do not see him in this election but I am hopeful that he will show himself at this coming election. And, I hope he will not be underhandedly suppressed before he can be any effective.
Politicis in Singapore is a gamble. PAP owns the casino.
19/11/08
Hi Gemami *192-PM Lee said no room for two party system, what is he talking about (our neighbour Malaysia has two party system now ie Barisan Nasional (BN) vs Pakatan Rakyat (PR). We are no longer in the Dark Ages and we have a huge middle class with education minimum diploma and maximum Phd and they travel abroad frequently for holidays and businesses (I doubt they support his idea ie no room for two party system). We in Singapore cannot run away from Two Party System and is here to stay and the Singapore Opposition must help themselves and be relevant by revamping themselves very thoroughly.
I don’t expect Singapore Opposition to win significant seats perhaps two more Single seat and a GRC (so help them God). Perhaps I will not agree with you that PAP owns the “casino” even casions can go bankrupt look at USA Sand’s casino which is on the verge of Bankruptcy. I do agree that Politics in Singapore is a gamble but a gambler must be street smart and prepared to hear from our neighbours regional and not like the SDP and Dr Chee being Running Dogs for those foreign NGOs (I have nothing personal with Dr Chee and I feel that what he has been doing, are very wrong especially bringing foreigners to Singapore and fight the PAP.We Singaporeas must fight our own battle and not allow foreigners to fight for us and will these foreigners fight and die for us and my answer is a big No.Look at Gopalan Nair now a US citizen and he did not put up a good fight and just surrendered (earlier he thought being a US citizen, the US goverment would send their Marines to rescue him like the movie Blak Hawk Down)
Hi Andrew,
For the record, I too cannot accept a one-party system. The fact is that with the statement coming out from PM, he has already won in the subconcious department.
As for Chee and SDP, yes, I agree with you that Singapore’s affairs should best be decided by Singaporeans and supported by Singaporeans.
Having said that, and as I have explained post #186, I still feel that Chee was left with no choice. Most of us would see Chee, the politician, if we can call him one in the first place, who later became an activist, but we fail to see Chee, the family man. He has a family to feed. There is a need for him to play a dual role as head of his family and activist for political and social freedom. Both are equally important to him.
Being crushed to the bone and with no one else to turn to, any normal person would grab at straws, what more when someone stands by your side with hands stretched out to pick you up.
Don’t get me wrong, I do sincerely hope that Chee would stick to his activist role and stay away from politics. This way, he will not be dragging the opposition down collectively especially during election time. The opposition without him would stand a better chance of getting better polling results.
21/11/08
Hi Gemami *194-Good to hear from you. Yesterday, was very busy with my work-I am working for a small boutique investment advisory company. We all are family man and we have a family to feed and no matter how desperate we don’t sell our national Singapore to the foreigners and bring these foreigners to Singapore to so called fight for us and taking monies from these foreign NGOs and being their Running Dogs. I gone to hell and back and now still struggling after I lost all in 1997 Asian Financial Crisis (more than S$30million in deposits pledged to banks in Singapore). We are Singaporeans and we have our integrity, dignity and principle
194) gemami on November 19th, 2008 3.46 pm
For the record, I too cannot accept a one-party system. The fact is that with the statement coming out from PM, he has already won in the subconcious department.
hi Gem, I agree with you. This 1party system is definately a no-no go for singaporeans. If we allow this to kick in is just as good as signing them our blank cheques to help them to empty our entire cpf life savings. By now, they already know their party have started to loose ground in singapore, they know they have lost the complete trust and faith of the citizens, and there is nothing they can change the facts of those strings of screwed ups that they cannot hide from the people any longer, and they also know that as the digging continues, more and more dirts will surface. So, the only way out now is to use force or whatever underhand methods they can to protect themselves now and not the country.