Is this suicide, accident, manslaughter or murder?

So how does this news relevant to TOC ?

Did MM, SM, PM masquerade as the tigers ? Is MAS Selamat lurking in the zoo ?

“OK lah! Bloody Zoo, why bring in white tigers?”

Oppps… if they tell us news about White Elephant, Kangaroos, Monkey, Gorilla, then I can see the relevance to TOC as these are significant symbols in Singapore. But White tigers ? How is it relevant ? Please explain.

Hey hey! white tigers siah! you know or not, to the local chinese, white tiger means something bad or some kind of bad thing going to happen when mentioned or seen one, and this news suddenly surface here in the zoo, some more in singapore zoo. Dunno if its bad news for which party but I think I know who leh.

white tiger some more which party you ask?

sorry TOC, now i know why the article appeared here.

gem, its tigers! a whole team of it so your guess is as good as mine lo….

7) tiredsingaporean

indeed, so careless of me . . . . .

Since the white tigers have tasted human blood, they must be put to sleep. I am worried for the zoo keepers tending the white tigers that these animals might think humans are food too. Curiosity kills the cat, eating the same old horse/deer meat might be less appealing, trying human flesh seems a delicacy.

Maybe the real theme is not about animal, it is about CAVEAT EMPTOR again ! Let the Visitor beware ! The visitor has to walk “WITH THEIR EYES WIDE OPEN” least they can kiss their life away.

Look like it really take a rocket science mind to figure out the intention of the post, TOC’s standard and expectation of reader are getting higher now, haha….

Daniel,

What TOC standard and expectations of our readers are higher? Looks more like our readers have higher standards than us.. haha..

We put it up because it’s an unusual thing that happened – and a sad incident too.

That’s why I am a little disappointed with the comments here so far, to be honest.

A man died – and in the most heinous manner possible.

Lets not make fun of it or ridicule the incident.

Thanks.

The snide remarks are disgraceful.

Singapore Zoo falls under which GRC / SRC?

Just making sure which organisation the white tigers belong to?

White tigers that have killed at least a human should be put to sleep, no matter how endangered they are.

I still don’t get it on why and how a man would actually leap into the tigers’ enclosure on his free will.

maybe he went for the wrong kind of white tiger :D

I shudder to think what must have happened to drive oneself to end his own life in such a manner?

Actually i do question the accuracy of the report.
Why would someone commit suicide in a tiger’s den??
Even if you want to die, you would definitely choose an easier and painless method.
Why die such a slow and painful death?

It’s scary..too scary to guess what actually happened.
It’s scary to guess that the cleaner was actually being forced to go inside the enclosure by the authorities. He might be forced to pick up some garbage which might caused an eyesore to the visitors. And in the process, the mishap happened. Just like Mas Selamat’s case, they cook up an interesting story to say that the man was mentally disturbed.
ya ya ya like i believe you…

The only question in my mind for all TOC viewers is
Being endangered species, does it mean the killer tiger will not be executed?
4 vs 2.

I just wonder why the zoo keepers only try to scare the tigers and not shoot it down immedaitely. Is the life of an animals more precious than the life of a human being who behaves abnormally. GOD created human beings above animals. That is why God asked Adam to name the animals in Genesis. In the states, one dog lover who allowed her dog to atttack a man to death was given life sentence. The judge viewed that she should not view her dog as more important than the life of a human being. I hope the authorities in the zoo will review their std practice so that in the event there is a human life being endangered by the most endangered species, is it to “shoot or not to shoot.”

18) Is animal above human?

Good point. Now we have something to tlak about.
should somebody raise this question at hlp?

Why didn’t the zoo kill the tigers to save the man?

Firstly… i find that it’s not the white tiger’s fault because the man went into the tigers’ den at 1230pm when the tiger’s feeding time is 230pm!!! So of course the tigers they’ll be like “hey it’s feeding time i see food!” Not that they didn’t wanna shoot the tigers down but because the zookeepers they are not given the authority to :) Plus it’s a 2minute inciden,t if they really go and take the rifle (which they did eventually) and come back the man’s already dead by then! He’s the one courting death and definitely it’s not the tigers’ fault. I pity the three white tigers. Not the man. Obviously he wanna commit suicide (but have no idea why the hell choosing this method…) because he even said “goodbye i won’t be seeing you all again” (something like that, to his colleagues or something) before he left…. haha yeap just an opinion of mine yea :)

20) Von

A few points of contention.

a. feeding time at 2.30pm but man went to meet the tigers at 12.30pm. is there a typo in here? (before i comment further).

b. you said the zookeepers they are not given the authority (to shoot) but you also said they eventually did (went to get the rifles – - – a contradiction here isn’t it?

c. Whether it’s a one or two minute incident, the zookeepers reaction must be one that automatically consider the safety of the human being first. No other excuse will do. What if one of these fine days, the monkeys over in the zoo starts to attack visitors and the zookepeers say: “oh well, we cannot do anything because by the time we get there with our rifles the visitors would be dead already. let’s wait to save the monkeys”

d. It isn’t obvious that he wanted to commit suicide. According to ST, the man was behaving in a trouble manner. He could be having some mental lapses, not suicide tendencies even though he did say goodbye.

a) 2 hours = not much difference, to the tigers that is. haha yup.

b) okay, they did went to take the rifle but IF I’M NOT WRONG they are not given the authority to kill the animals and especially its the white tiger. Imagine the consequences the zookeepers they have to face if they really shoot the tigers down.

c) yes, they did tried to help isn’t it? monkeys they are totally different. they are being trained but white tigers they are not. monkeys they have always been in contact with human whereas tigers they have never been in contact with human before! that’s totally two different thing. lets just say if you jump down the sea and got eaten up by a shark, which means we have to actually hunt for all sharks and kill them all?

d) okay quite true. but it’s not the tigers fault after all, because he actually went in with a broom and used the broom to agitate the tigers. (well, that’s what everyone is saying in the zoo..) i’m not trying to fabricating news but in fact i’m working in the zoo. Not that because i am working there so i’m siding the zoo but because its the fact that it’s the man’s fault.

many they’re asking why the zookeepers they didn’t wanna use the tranq rifle…. cus it actually takes around 5 mins for the tranquilizer to take effect yea. put yourself in the zookeepers’ shoes. if you are one of the zookeepers there, would you actually go and shoot the tigers when you know that you are not supposed to kill the animals?

22) Von

You are saying the zookepers went to take the rifle which they knew they couldn’t use, so why go take it then whhen the time could probably have been used to try and save the man instead? I’m baffled.

Also, I’m not too comfortable with your explanation that one has to imagine the consequences of killing the white tigers over the consequences of letting a man being mauled to death.

Okay, maybe monkey is a wrong comparison but the issue is still the same. Would the zoo workers let a man die over an animal . . . yah I know zoo keepers are very affectionate toward their animals but they are still animals right?

No question that it s not the tigers fault but the zoo really ought to review its ‘no killing of animals’ policy.

“Also, I’m not too comfortable with your explanation that one has to imagine the consequences of killing the white tigers over the consequences of letting a man being mauled to death.”

easier to be said than done. the whole commotion is so messy and WHAT IF the one you shot down is not the tiger but the man instead? we are not especially trained to use the rifle but just zookeepers… okay, so if it’s not the tigers fault why do we have to kill them? leaping into the tigers den on purpose and trip & fell is a different thing y’know. If the man trip and fall then being mauled to death by the tigers, okay that’ll be zoo’s fault and we might need to put the tigers to sleep. If the man actually went in on purpose, i don’t see the need for us to kill the innocent tigers. I know human and animals are equally important but then again… IF the man he actually trip and fall instead, he’ll eventually land in the water or something. So IF we are actually allowed to kill the animals, we still have the time to go and take the rifle using it to distract the tigers if they wanna attact(which is possible but they won’t really get into the water so not much danger)/worse come to worse shoot the tigers down. But even IF we are allowed to use the rifles but the man swim/walk all the way to the shore and reach the tigers, there’s nothing we can do because by the time we go and take the rifle it’ll be too late.. 2 minutes is not very long you see…

attack*

Hi Von,

Take a deep breath. I am not here to find fault with you, with the zoo or with the tigers. I am trying to understand what you have wriiten. Please try to read my postings with a smile on your face because my words are not meant to hurt you or anyone. They are mostly questions, which will help me try and understand what you are trying to tell us.

The picture is becoming clearer. This whole episode happened very quickly and i suppose you are one of the zookeepers who tended to the tigers? Never mind.

I can understand that you have concern that after taking the rifle, you might have to consider whether you would end up shooting the tigers or the man. If you do not mind, I would like to ask a few questions.

a. can you open fire in the first place? I ask this because I still have not gotten an answer as to whether the zookeepers or anyone else working in the zoo, can open fire.
b. if one is allowed to open fire, is there any standard procedure that the zoo exercises and has there been any drill carried out by the zoo to ensure that the employees of the zoo know exactly what to do in such event?
c. does the zoo teaches its employees to view, in your own words, “….. human and animals are equally important …..?”. It it did, then it is wrong, don’t you think?
d. you described that it was the man who entered the tigers’ encasement and provoked the tigers into attacking him, does it mean that the zoo allows it employees to judge the situation before they react or provide assistant?

These are just a few of the questions that trouble me and although the incident had already happened and there is nothing we can do about the poor man who died, it does not mean that we cannot learn from the lesson and put in place some procedures to help both staff and visitors of the zoo.

Can we be so sure that similar incidence like this will not happen again?

The idea in this discussion is not to find fault because the damage is already done. It is to help us find ways to make the zoo a better and safer place for all. And it is people like your good self who are brave enough to come here and share and discuss with us that we can find solutions that may be helpful to the zoo.

Don’t you think?

haha yup sorry if i’m a little too harsh :)

okay i’m just one of the staff there no no zookeeper!

a) for this i’m not too sure so thats the reason why i used a lot of if(s) because i don’t want to actually assume something which is not yea :)
b) i’m not a zookeeper…
c) to me, i really think that both are equally important, both are lives.
d) that’s not what i meant! okay, do you think they even have the time to judge? saving a life is important i know, but tell me, how to save him?

I know you mean well and i’m sure zoo they’ll take all this questions many people that have asked into consideration.. I’m actually working in a restaurant there and what i’ve said is based on what a zookeeper told me. except those that i’ve added in if(s) and all. Just like a man trying to jump off the building, all we can do is to consult him and try to save him. But if really jump off like that, there’s nothing we can do. Haha yup.

I know you mean well and i’m sure zoo they’ll take all this questions many people that have asked into consideration.. I’m actually working in a restaurant there and what i’ve said is based on what a zookeeper told me. except those that i’ve added in if(s) and all. Just like a man trying to jump off the building, all we can do is to consult him and try to save him. But if really jump off like that, there’s nothing we can do. – von (#26)

So Donaldson Tan (#1) had already asked the right questions.

There is only one explanation….White Bengal Tigers are extremely rare and endangered with only a few left in the world…while malaysian cleaners are all over this island.

yep white tigers are very rare, i think 200 left on earth! (my mom told me? haha) but well, a malaysian cleaner is still a life! I was just wondering what ways are there for us to save him if we could turn back the time…. Hmm.. He could have get into the water when the tigers attacked! Instead of crawling up using a pail to cover his head.. There goes a life :(

curling up*

Actually, why do you people care so much? Just make sure you or your loved ones don’t climb into the enclosure in the first place. I have seen the exhibit before, It’s not easy to climb in. Certainly takes a lot of effort. Incidents like this are rare and isolated. No point in wasting resources trying to prevent an incident like this from happening in future.

If some looney decides to hang himself from a tree tomorrow, what are we going to do? Saw off all the trees? Make sure the branches don’t grow too thick and will snap easily if someone hangs himself from them?

In any case, I don’t think it’s fair to shoot the tigers to save the man. After all it was clear he was the one who climbed in himself and tried to agitate the animals.

In any case, I don’t think it’s fair to shoot the tigers to save the man. After all it was clear he was the one who climbed in himself and tried to agitate the animals.

These are thoughts made on hindsight after what had happened and we are in possession of details which we otherwise would not have known.

What is important is the reaction to such situations. Do we stand by and assess the situation asking all sorts of questions like, is he committing suicide? Is he deranged? Is he this or is he that?

The first reaction ought to be the consideration of the man’s life.

Let’s just say if that man was your son, your father or someone close, would you say the same thing?

Dear Gemini, not saying that your thinking is wrong. But… what if we shot the tigers? Then realised that hey acutally it was the man who was knocking on death’s door.

Then what? “It’ s okay lah, they are only ANIMALS.”

34) Husky

For the love of human lives; yes; they are just animals.

“An ape’s an ape, a varlet’s a varlet, though they be clad in silk or scarlet. Even a space ape must urinate.”

Hi Husky,

No offence but I do understand that animal lovers have their own perculiar way of associating with them and I respect that, really I do.

However, I, in my own personal way, cannot ever bring myself to place the lives of animals anywhere near those of the human lives. We can never be equal because if we do so, we need to come down to the level of animals, which I cannot see my doing.

I hope you understand.

34) Germani

I share your view GERMANI.

The zoo must have something like a creed ‘Save Human First’. This will give a clear signal to all the zoo keepers that if a similar incident occurs no one should need to deliberate who is at fault first before saving the human being. And they should not fear having to justify for such an act or being punished for their action if it was a mistake.
Earth quakes in indonesia can cause tremors in parts of Singapore. Thus, it is not too remote to think that a severe earth quake can also cause tremors in the calm zoo environment. If the white tigers are currently on high alert and breathing heavily after mauling a man to death, what happens if there is tremor.
My heart goes out to the family of this man, who is so poor that they cant afford an air ticket to bring his body back, and probably dont know if they have a right to question the zoo authority or seek compensation on not saving his life.
If euthanasia or assisted euthanasia is not allowed here, i am wondering, by allowing the tigers to maul this man, ‘who may want to say goodbye’, also assisted euthanasia?
Another point is that zoo keepers are dealing with animals. No matter how trained an animal is, it is stll an animal with animal instinct. Is it right to allow a man who seem deranged to continue his daily routine in the zoo? What if he opens the gates and some animals got wild and run out of their enclosures. Are the employees in the zoo screened periodically to ensure that they are not in a disturbed state of mind.
Is the zoo really a safe place AT ALL TIMES? I am not comfortable until the zoo authorities share their std practices and contingency plans in the event of a disaster with the public.

The zoo needs to review its policies, rules and regulations on how to protect humans over its animals.

To animal lovers, a life is a life, whether it is human or an animal it makes no difference. This is wrong and must be corrected.

Even if it is the last animal on the planet and a man’s life is in danger, there should not even be the slightest consideration to kill the animal to save the man.
The zoo must be clear on this and its employees must also be clear on this.

Without this, visitors to the zoo will never be safe because when trouble surfaces, the likelihood of zoo workers saving the lives of the animals over the lives of visitors is real and will be dreadfully tragic.

Dear Gemami,

I just think it stinks to have to shoot the poor animals dead when it’s not any fault of their own. Firstly, the odds of accidentally falling into the tiger enclosure are really low. I mean, when was the last time you heard of people falling it? That plus his actions inside the cage, were pretty evident that the cleaner was not an ordinary victim. Had it been a lapse in the zoo’s security measures allowing say a child to fall in. I say, shoot the animal. Yeah. Save the child first. We talk later.

Here we are talking about a deranged man, who has decided for whatever reason , to go into a tiger enclosure. Shoot the tigers. Save him. Well done! Tommorow if you find him inside the Panda’s enclosure, well… take no chances… shoot the pandas too. The day after tomorrow, if he ends up at the house of “Is animal above human”. Then what???

Back in NS, when I was a Guard Commander. I was told, I am authorised to shoot when it’s clear that a person is causing danger to SAF personal or property. In this case, if the shooters need to shoot anyone, perhaps it should be the man. By going into the enclosure, he is posing a danger not just to himself but to the animals.

As Mr or Miss “Is animal above human?” has pointed out, that man is a danger. Instead of jumping into a tiger enclosure, he could have released some other animals. If he had did that instead, I wonder if we will still be talking about how poor the man is, and pity his family blah blah…

I also read with great amusement how some people are asking for the zoo make public what safety measures they have in place etc… Let’s put it this way. When was the last time an incident like this happened and was traced to a fault in the zoo’s management? On the other hand, how often do we hear of road accidents? Are we going to press LTA for an accident free solution? Or ban driving?Somehow, we know that’s not possible. So we all just try to manage the risk by driving carefully. No matter how much safety measures the zoo undertakes, we can’t stop someone if he wants to play drums to tigers and invite them to maul him to death.

So, get over it already I say. Deranged man climbs into tiger enclosure. Tigers maul man to death. Period. It’s animal instinct! Take a knife and stab yourself. Surely you will bleed. What did you expect? Relief of stomach itch? Then sue the manufacturer of the knife? Cos they didn’t warn you you can’t use it to sccratch your ass?

Dear Husky,

My reply is just one question.

What would you have done if the man you see is (no offence intended) your father, or brother, or close friend?

Er… shout out to him:” Get the hell out of there! There are other (less painful) ways to die!”

Hi Husky,

Thank you. I fully understand your position now.
Thanks for the discourse.

37) is animal above human?

I still can’t accept the fact that you guys are placing human above animal. Its not about animal lover or whatsoever. Afterall both are life… for eg.. when a man is torturing a dog and the dog actually bit the man, we should actually kill the… innocent dog? Plain rubbish. The tigers they don’t deserve to be shot down.

Have you guys read the newspaper?

“Q: what should zookeepers do with animals that have attacked humans?
Mr Vinodh: I don’t think there’s a need to do anything.

Mr Chandra: Nothing should be done to the animals. You can’t blame anyone for what happened.”

Whatever it is, the plight of Mr Nordin etc.. it was his choice to commit suicide very obviously. Though we can see that he regretted after which (when he tried to fight back)

“Here we are talking about a deranged man, who has decided for whatever reason , to go into a tiger enclosure. Shoot the tigers. Save him. Well done! Tommorow if you find him inside the Panda’s enclosure, well… take no chances… shoot the pandas too. The day after tomorrow, if he ends up at the house of “Is animal above human”. Then what???”

TOTALLY AGREED.
If they really shoot the tigers down, i ask, is there justice? No.

Thank you Von. That’s exactly what I wanted to say. It’s not about animals vs humans, tiger vs man or rare animal vs abudant cleaner whatsoever.

Say, if a Husky starts biting people for no reason, (no pun intended) perhaps it’s justified to put the dog down cos it’s a danger to others. But in this case, clearly the one posing a danger to others is the man not the animals.

I don’t know if this is once again a reflection of the Singaporean thinking. Man above animals. Me above others. Always blame the other party where possible.

Some food for thought. (Again, no pun intended) A few years back, I recall reading a letter in the forum. A “concerned” parent wrote in complaining that the food court has unsafe furniture that may cause children to be injured if they start running around.

To me, that was the most ridiculous argument I ever heard. I wrote a reply back saying that the foodcourt is not a playground. Children running around in a foodcourt are a danger to themselves and others. Imagine running into a person carrying a bowl of hot soup?

According to the logic of some of the writers here? Shoot the man carrying the soup! They are children for Christ’s sake.

a suicide or an accident?

Depends on which angle you’re looking from.

Man’s angle: Attempted suicide, he changed his mind but could not get out.
Zoo’s angle: An accident, the zoo workers did not know whose life to save, the tigers’ or the man.
Tigers’ angle: Neither. It was free lunch what.
Man’s family angle: Murder. No one took the necessary precautions when they knew the man was behaving abnormally. Imagine if he had decided to free some predators at the zoo?

Hi
Hope this article below help shed some light. Read in Yahoo News Singapore (cant locate the article now), that the judge sentenced the owner to jail becos she loves her dog more than man. Well, the judge here may not think the same.

Woman sentenced to 15 years in jail in dog attack case
===========================================
Tue, Sep 23 12:18 PM

San Francisco, Sep 23 (DPA) A woman whose two dogs attacked and killed her neighbour in the hallway of their San Francisco apartment building seven years ago was sentenced to 15 years in prison.

Superior Court Judge Charlotte Woolard said Monday that Majorie Knoller, 53, had not bothered to put a muzzle on her aggressive Presa Canario-mastiff-mixed dogs before taking them out of her apartment and did not call for help or retrieve a weapon while the animals were mauling 33-year-old Diane Whipple for at least 10 minutes, the San Francisco Chronicle reported.

In 2002, a California jury found Knoller guilty of second-degree murder, but a judge reversed the decision and found her guilty of manslaughter and sentenced her to a four-year jail sentence.

She spent three years behind bars before being paroled.

Last year, the state Supreme Court ruled that the judge had used the wrong legal standard in overturning the murder verdict. Woolard reinstated the jury’s murder verdict at a hearing last month.

Knoller’s lawyer said he would appeal the murder conviction.

http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20080923/890/twl-woman-sentenced-to-15-years-in-jail.html

You’re welcome, Husky :)

Anyway there’s no point for us to argue because we can’t possibly turn back the time. I find it so ridiculous when i read the newspaper when a consultant actually suggested that employees at the zoo should undergo psychological tests, and heads of departments should monitor the emotional well-being of staff members before letting them go work. And from now on they have to even look out for people that looked troubled. Gosh, so people that look troubled we have to go up and ask them to… leave? Oh man.. The worse line…. “perhaps the zoo could conduct briefings and educate everyone on this, before letting people go in, whether they are workers or visitors.” For goodness sake man! Imagine you just want to visit the zoo but still have the go through briefings, psychological tests before going in!!!! Ridiculous. Look what the man has done, created so many trouble for us all.

I will definitely quit my job if i were to go through psychological tests and briefings everyday before my work…and i bet nobody wants to work in zoo/visit the zoo anymore. Madness.
gemami, so maybe this is the right kinda safety precaution that we have to take? seriously i don’t see the need for all this… If a man wants to jump off the building (okay i can’t think of any other examples anymore) what kinda safety precaution can we take?

Hi Von,

You have quoted some very extreme measures you have read and you ask me if these are the same measures I would wnat to see adopted by the zoo. The short answer to your question is, No.

What I have suggested are solely based on the accounts of what had happened, during the white tigers episode, as related by commentators who happened to be working for the zoo and witnessed the tragic event.

If you had read my posts correctly, you would have noticed that my suggestions leaned towards providing pre-emptive solutions based on the descriptions of what had happened.

It is plain and clear to all readers that neither the zoo, nor its employees, knew what to do. Because it never happened before? Because the zoo had an excellent track record on zoo safety? Are these reasons valid? What can be done?

Scrutinizing every visitor for suicidal tendencies is betond the zoo’s control but do you not agree that the zoo can put in place some measures within its control? Let’s not get hypothetical here. Simple measures will do.

Don’t you want the zoo to be better prepared the next time round, even if you think the next time might be 50 years from now? How sure can you be that it will not happen again this weekend?

Dear Von,

I know exactly what you mean. To me, the case is a very isolated one. I mean, how often do you see people climbing into tiger enclosures to commit suicide or for some other unknow reason. Really, it’s a waste of time and resources trying to prevent a similar incident from happening in future.

It is not only pointless but totally impractical to implement all these “safety” measures. If someone hangs himself with a rope, do we make people go thru psychological screenings before they can buy ropes? Or sign a letter to declare they are not going to hang themselves with the rope they are buying? I never understood why, time after time, the reactions of the authority is always to implement some silly measures that doesn’t make any sense.

Recently, I think I am starting to understand WHY. It’s not so much to prevent a similar incident in future. But to “address” the “concerns” of the people. Just as yellow leaves may be gold coins to satisfy crying children, thus so called safety measures and preventive strategies appease the ignorant citizen.

Dear Gemani,

“It is plain and clear to all readers that neither the zoo, nor its employees, knew what to do. Because it never happened before? Because the zoo had an excellent track record on zoo safety? Are these reasons valid? What can be done?

Scrutinizing every visitor for suicidal tendencies is betond the zoo’s control but do you not agree that the zoo can put in place some measures within its control? Let’s not get hypothetical here. Simple measures will do.”

So share some suggestions with us how to prevent this from happening again.

Dear Husky,

“Just as yellow leaves may be gold coins to satisfy crying children, thus so called safety measures and preventive strategies appease the ignorant citizen.”

LOVE THIS LINE

Dear Gemani,

Who are you to judge which life is greater than which? Please don’t play God.

Animals above humans or humans above animals? The plain fact is they are all sentient. The action required is really to minimise the loss of lives as much as possible, whether its human lives or animal lives.

According to the zoo, by the time the rifles arrived, the man is already dead. And it is the tiger’s instinct to kill (they’re probably only playing but its deadly enough!). Tigers are master predators, remember that.

You cannot blame the tigers for killing the man and make the tigers pay with their lives. Your view is bias because you are human. If you hold this view and if you are a dog, you would say that a dog’s life is above-everything.

We have been told by media stories that Noordin was deranged …etc

He was cleaner, there was a broom and pail (if the reports were correct), he was in tiger den …..

It is in all animals’ instinct to defend themself, and yes, humans included.
Let’s say a man entered your house waving a knife at you, will you not find something to defend yourself against that man?

It’s the same as what the tigers did, the man jumped in unannounced, and started waving his broom at the tigers. So the tigers see him as a threat to their territory and went up to the intruder, it was also stated in the news that the man tried to put his pail over the head of the tiger. I’m sure that even a human would retaliate when someone tries to put something over his head forcefully.

I feel sorry for the man but I do not feel that the tigers should be killed just because of the actions of the man. If he did not jumped in, would the tigers have killed anyone at all?

Dear Von, Moonlight, Husky, Tiger & Alvin,

I shall not comment any further as I respect your stands even as I do not agree with your reasons for taking those stands. I have laid bare my reasons, views and opinions and there is nothing else much to add to them.

It therefore suffice for me to conclude that your bosses at the zoo has concurred with my suggestions and have admitted publicly that there are measures that can be reviewed and adopted due to this incident.

Thanks for all your views and opinions.

I have enjoyed sharing my views with you guys and I hope we can leave this discourse carrying away with us some important ingredients that make us think the way we do ;)

BTW, the keepers carried the rifle and not shoot it is not because they do not have permission or sort…

The rifles are there in case the tigers do not back down and continue to attack even after the keepers chase them away from the victim. If it comes down to that, they will have to shoot the tigers to ensure no other casualties occur. So it may seem that the tigers are endangered so they do not shoot them, but keepers should know the behaviors of the animals in the zoo well enough that even if the tigers are tamed, they are still wild animals and that unpredictable things WILL occur.

Well, gemami, as long as you stand by firmly on what you believe, I have nothing to say, just wanted to let people die more often from car accidents and other sorts than from an animal attack, let alone one in a zoo.

actually its a suicide…sort of but he regretted going inside

I think the topic here is going out of the question..like moonlight was saying..we are bias coz we r human…ur not bias coz ur not human?? or coz ur an employee there?? u see this kind a quote doesnt makes the world better for human or even animals..in my opinion..YES..Human lives are more important than animals..YES the tiger should not be shot..NO..!!! we shall not decide if its a suicide and blame the man of stupidity..coz only he himself knows wat actually happen..we are quarreling here but the family is in extreme sadness..im sorry for their loss..and another thing..i know this may soundcrude(no intention of hurting anione) if the deceased were my relatives,i would want to shoot the tigers..i wouldnt be saying er..get out!!! there are other ways to die..coz im a human..i love my relatives more than animals… =(

hi ther readers im sorry if my writting or spelling is incorrect or lots of typo coz im not good in english…

here i want to review the articles regarding about tigers attacked man recently in singapore zoo….

Justice voice i don’t think its was a tigers faults in this accident, the fault come from that man himself. 1st thing the man is a cleaner and not the zookeeper and also has no authority to enter into the tiger cage for no any purpose or reasons… cleaner the job is to cleaning certain area which has been athorised from the managment site, whereby the zookeepers their jobs maybe feeding, bathin or trained the animals, but don’t mistaken… not all the zookeepers can go to any animals cage, zookeepers has been trained have a certified cert and also have been post to which animal they should belong to and take care of. if you would said that tigers should be blame but not the man, do you think this is the answer??? just put this scenario, if someone unknown enter your house without you knowing who is he, will you shock in the beggining?? quickly take the broom or anything to whacked that fellow??? of coz ;-) or will you just keep quite and smilling certainly not…! ;-) will any of your family member put you in a sleep or shoot you to death after all the happening they see what you did??? here comes the actual case, the cleaner man is entering into the tiger cage for no reason, and of coz the tigers does not recognised him and yet of coz for protections the tigers will attacked him coz they think that this man trying to harm them or maybe shoot them… at the 1st place out from the blue moon why is this cleaner man trow himself into tigers? whereby he knows that what he want to do is crazy, dangerous and his life is at risk stage???? or maybe he want to be a zoo hero which can escape from the tigers mouth??? hello this not a action movies in films okey and his not even qualified to be a safari guy… Lol…. i show you 1 examples scenario, if you would see a train(MRT) coming to fast and you know if step on the yellow line possible that the train(MRT) will hit you rite??? but if you know that if you jump down from the train(MRT) track the train will knocked you down do you still want to jump??? only if you insist, but if you did,,, will the people put a blame on the MRT manangment saying that they have no safety and want the MRT to stop process or shoot the train to die just because of 1 stupid man fault that jump off??? of coz not am i rite???? then why must you guys put a big fault on this poor innocent animals??? isit just becaouse thoes animals is dangerous, got no brain, cant talk cant argue and useless??? so you happy2 blame on this tigers??? is that so??? ohh for god sake please wake up my dearest friends…. if you preview back the last articles or the videos, if you see that the tigers is insides the cage and not outside the cage, and the man from no where enter without invitations…. so its means the man himself go in into the tigers cage and he deserved it, unless if this cleaner man is sweeping or cleaning outside the cage at the very far distance and sunddenly the tiger jump out from the cage and chase the man, is ok if you want to blame the tigers or can make the tiger sleep, or maybe shoot the tigers to death even myself want to do that out of anger ;-) or maybe you can also have a action taken against the zoo managment for not having a safety precaution… that yesss i agree without objection… but look at this the tigers is is inside the man that trow himself in, that why the tigers attacked him somehow the tigers dosent know who the hell is he….! am i rite to say this??? ok now i don’t want to talk about tigers man eater… now i want to talk about animals, all animals got no brain, they cant think whatever people give they think is a food, not only tiger all animals even a dog or anything…. 1 more scenario… if you were to know that this dog is a very dangerous creature, will you make yourself near them? do anything funny??? of coz not rite coz you know its dangerous and what happened if i come near them of coz they will run chase me and attacked me rite??? hey even the ghost will attacked you if you come to their place and do funny2 things Lol ;-) hey come on guys all the animals in the zoo is well trained and maybe they also given mediciance or some injections. From wild animals they now become loving pets… look at all this poor animals they even far from their families come here and entertain you people why don’t you people appreciate the good deeds they giving to you??? why must you destroy them??? don’t you see how cute they are??? why you people want to make this issue bigger??? dont you care about their feelings too? dont think that they have no feeling okey? they have feeling too, who knows rite now the tigers is feeling sad and talking among themself why is this thing happened out of sudden ;-( … why the zookeepers who feeding them or trained them not been attacked? and why this cleaner man been attacked? i don’t see no reason the tigers want to attacked this man without any resonable reason, do you think that this man look delicious and yummy to them???? Lol ;-) even night safari all the animals come out i don’t see anyone been there and been attacked by animals??? i think i have 1 sudgestion, Lets no make things difficult for everyone especially the zoo managment who now carried a biggest responsibility because of this cleaner man action, why not the zoo managment install a CCTV camera at every corners in animals cage and monitoring 24hrs everday for references, just in case if such like this accident happened again the managment can rewind and playback the video and watch what is actually happened and how the accident happened and how does its start… i think thats is good sudgestion otherwise everybody will pointed a finger here and there and putting all the blames…my dearest fellow friends please use your brain and think about it, dun use your anger coz when you are angry you cant think which 1 is rite and which 1 is wrong, think also about the other party have a justice…thats all i about to say my oppinion… thank you and have a nice day….

i believe that it was a mistake done by cleaner nordin. the animals were not at fault. jus consider it to be a misadvantureat of d death. may he rest in peace, n they b in peace also. waheguru…

To all…

Lets not blame e man or e tigers either.. We dont even noe e real situation n which is which.. Everytiing happen for a reason.. Nothiing happen for no reason.. Its between god n e victim itself noe wat’s reallii happeniing.. or maybe a poliice job to fiind out wat’s reallii happeniing but i guess they wont get e truth situatiion as e person alreadii dead.. Let stop blaming either one of it animal or human.. lets just hope tat e man rest in peace.. iits not good to blame anyone speciially those tat oreadii not iin diis world.. let’s put it diis way.. do eu liike iif eu diie iin diis manner n people keep on sayiing diis n tat which is not true at all.. you all r here blamiing diis n tat but hs family down der pretty sad.. iit even more hurting iif any of his family or relatiiives to read all thiis.. tiink back jus tiink wat iif ur at their shooess..

tats all ii cann comment.. just an adviice no harm aiite.. Cheers!! =j

Reactions to the White Tiger Incident
On the 13th November 2008, an apparently disturbed worker was mauled to death by three tigers at the Singapore Zoo on Thursday when he deliberately jumped into their enclosure. The white tigers pounced on the 32-year-old contract cleaner after he jumped into the moat surrounding their enclosure and then moved toward the animals. Fellow workers reported that he “was acting a little bit erratic and odd, throwing papers around” before the incident and the victim even told one of the zookeepers, “Goodbye, I won’t be seeing you again.” The zookeepers only threw rocks to distract the animals while the victim, after the first bite from the tigers, put a pail over his head. After a while, the zookeepers had suceeded in luring the tigers away but it was too late for Norbin Bin Montong.
Although numerous tourists and locals have raised questions about the Singapore Zoo’s safety measures, I feel that the Singapore Zoo is safe. I do not feel that the incident was all the fault of the tigers.
Firstly, the man is a cleaner and thus has no authority to enter the enclosure. The cleaner’s job is only to clean the areas authorized by the zoo management and certainly not the tigers’ den. Even among zookeepers, only those zookeepers with certification can be posted to enter the den. Therefore, when the cleaner entered the tigers’ den, the tigers’ suspicions were aroused for they had never seen the cleaner before and did not recognize him. Especially since the cleaner was waving the broom at them, the tigers reacted out of self-defense as they are very territorial animals. That plus his actions inside the cage were pretty evident that the cleaner was not an ordinary victim. By going into the enclosure, he is posing a danger not just to himself but to the animals.
Secondly, the whole commotion involving the killing of the cleaner was in a short two minutes, not a very long time. Even if the zookeepers had gone to take the tranquilizer gun, he may not have reached the enclosure in time to save the cleaner. The cleaner had the intention to enter the den, he wished to die. But if the tiger had somehow dragged the cleaner into the enclosure, that would have been the zoo’s fault for not training the tigers properly. Here we are talking about a deranged man, who has decided for whatever reason, to go into a tiger enclosure. Shoot the tigers. Save him. Well done! Tomorrow if you find him inside the pandas’ enclosure, well… take no chances… shoot the pandas too. The day after tomorrow, what if he ends up at someone’s house?
I feel that man is a danger. Instead of jumping into a tiger enclosure, he could have released other animals. If he had did that instead, I wonder if we will still be talking about how poor the man is, and how much we pity his family. No matter how many safety measures the zoo undertakes, we can’t stop someone if he wants to play drums to tigers and invite them to maul him to death.
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Depends on which angle you’re looking from.
Man’s angle: Attempted suicide, he changed his mind but could not get out.
Zoo’s angle: An accident, the zoo workers did not know whose life to save, the tigers’ or the man.
Tigers’ angle: Neither. It was free lunch what.
Man’s family angle: Murder. No one took the necessary precautions when they knew the man was behaving abnormally. Imagine if he had decided to free some predators at the zoo?
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i copied some stuff from other posts because i fully agreed and wished to emphasize them. credits: Husky & gemami :D

P.S. i’m only 13 so pardon me if i make any mistakes or offend anyone :D

oh yeah. and credits to nefa too ;)
i just touched up abit on his english for my 2nd paragraph :)

To all you animal lovers out there! Please help to save Steve Irwin Wildlife Reserve!
Sign the petition at http://www.savestevesplace.com/

Steve Irwin is one of the best Conservationist and Animal presenter ever, so please help to keep his legacy alive! Thanks

(I know this have nothing to do with the article. But it is important that we do our part in saving the wildlife.)

yah (: agree (: ty alvin for the suggestion :D

yeah.. such a scariiest incident jus hope e man rest in peace..

Anyone has the 4mins video? Can send me video at Living_corpse89@hotmail.com plz plz plz…thank u!

yah i agree with husky’s post on nov 17 2008, if a man really wants to shoot himself with a gun, what could we do? ban all the guns on earth to pluto? pratically impossible. just mind your own business and make sure you are in the right state of mind.