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	<title>Comments on: Not secret society</title>
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	<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/</link>
	<description>Singapore&#039;s #1 Socio-Political Site</description>
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		<title>By: George</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-106644</link>
		<dc:creator>George</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Sep 2009 12:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-106644</guid>
		<description>When a TC published it annual report with all its revenues and expenditures fully accounted for and also open to question to justify expenditures would I consider they are open and transparent. Before that happened, doubt would remain as to what and where the money is spent . If TC had made investment decision that resulted in &quot;negative growth of the fund&quot; then they should clearly say so. To try to hideit  from the town tax payers is both unethical and dishonest. A little bit of  honesty would goes a long way. But our political climate do not encourage such quality. Official are terrified of failure even when it was due to external factors that were way outside their control.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When a TC published it annual report with all its revenues and expenditures fully accounted for and also open to question to justify expenditures would I consider they are open and transparent. Before that happened, doubt would remain as to what and where the money is spent . If TC had made investment decision that resulted in &#8220;negative growth of the fund&#8221; then they should clearly say so. To try to hideit  from the town tax payers is both unethical and dishonest. A little bit of  honesty would goes a long way. But our political climate do not encourage such quality. Official are terrified of failure even when it was due to external factors that were way outside their control.</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41994</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Dec 2008 13:18:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41994</guid>
		<description>84) Anonymous on December 23rd, 2008 9.11 pm Think out of the box.

Can the residents go to court to force the TC to disclose details of their investments?

Why not? I&#039;m sure alot of us are happy to contribute money in bringing those TCs to court. Remember TCs are independent companies managing public finds and the funds are collected from the people to maintain the flats. And if there are accounts irregularity then the people involved have the rights to do so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>84) Anonymous on December 23rd, 2008 9.11 pm Think out of the box.</p>
<p>Can the residents go to court to force the TC to disclose details of their investments?</p>
<p>Why not? I&#8217;m sure alot of us are happy to contribute money in bringing those TCs to court. Remember TCs are independent companies managing public finds and the funds are collected from the people to maintain the flats. And if there are accounts irregularity then the people involved have the rights to do so.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41992</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Dec 2008 13:11:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41992</guid>
		<description>Think out of the box.

Can the residents go to court to force the TC to disclose details of their investments?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Think out of the box.</p>
<p>Can the residents go to court to force the TC to disclose details of their investments?</p>
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		<title>By: Muhammad Shamin Bin Mohamed Sidek</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41450</link>
		<dc:creator>Muhammad Shamin Bin Mohamed Sidek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:04:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41450</guid>
		<description>Hehehehe....so funny. Are you trying to joke with me Khaw?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hehehehe&#8230;.so funny. Are you trying to joke with me Khaw?</p>
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		<title>By: Zeitgeist</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41448</link>
		<dc:creator>Zeitgeist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:03:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41448</guid>
		<description>JOQ (just one question)

So this is not secret society activity?

Great! Make sure it won&#039;t come out that the Official Secret Act is executed when it come to pass that Town Councils must open their books to the public or judicial query for what ever reasons. Can that assurance be made?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JOQ (just one question)</p>
<p>So this is not secret society activity?</p>
<p>Great! Make sure it won&#8217;t come out that the Official Secret Act is executed when it come to pass that Town Councils must open their books to the public or judicial query for what ever reasons. Can that assurance be made?</p>
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		<title>By: Curious</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41447</link>
		<dc:creator>Curious</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 12:49:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41447</guid>
		<description>WKC - &quot;but why GST?&quot;

If you notice the GDP growth in Singapore is below 5% off late. If you take away GST which is 7% tax on goods &amp; services we could be in recession for the next few years with negative GDPs.  In my opinion, this is why GST is necessary. 

Giving back cash (from GST collections) to the people as GST offsets is akin to a stimulus exercise and this tends to encourage people to spend and enhances the GDP figure.  Looks like both GST and GST offsets tend to enhance the GDP.

But if you take away the GST, ARF, COE, maid and foreign workers levies, in my opinion, we could be in a permanent recession with negative GDPs!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WKC &#8211; &#8220;but why GST?&#8221;</p>
<p>If you notice the GDP growth in Singapore is below 5% off late. If you take away GST which is 7% tax on goods &amp; services we could be in recession for the next few years with negative GDPs.  In my opinion, this is why GST is necessary. </p>
<p>Giving back cash (from GST collections) to the people as GST offsets is akin to a stimulus exercise and this tends to encourage people to spend and enhances the GDP figure.  Looks like both GST and GST offsets tend to enhance the GDP.</p>
<p>But if you take away the GST, ARF, COE, maid and foreign workers levies, in my opinion, we could be in a permanent recession with negative GDPs!</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41435</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 11:34:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41435</guid>
		<description>LKY should be able to answer your question. As for the rest, they are being paid millions to keep the system going for him and his party to stay in power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LKY should be able to answer your question. As for the rest, they are being paid millions to keep the system going for him and his party to stay in power.</p>
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		<title>By: Curious</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41433</link>
		<dc:creator>Curious</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 11:25:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41433</guid>
		<description>Talking about transparency, does anyone know how much the GIC and Temasek lost in the rush to invest in CityGroup, UBS and Merrill Lynch?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Talking about transparency, does anyone know how much the GIC and Temasek lost in the rush to invest in CityGroup, UBS and Merrill Lynch?</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41397</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 05:21:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41397</guid>
		<description>A very good example is one who is operating just a small F&amp;B pub who have to pay for entertainment license, liquour license, tobacco license, TV license, karaoke license, food license, compass license . . . . . the list goes on and on . . .  how to survive to pay for so many licenses??? if this is not extortion, then what?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A very good example is one who is operating just a small F&amp;B pub who have to pay for entertainment license, liquour license, tobacco license, TV license, karaoke license, food license, compass license . . . . . the list goes on and on . . .  how to survive to pay for so many licenses??? if this is not extortion, then what?</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41396</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 05:14:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41396</guid>
		<description>If TOC or someone can list out each and every taxes implemented by this garments in this tiny  country called singapore and show it to the people, I think it will be more shocking to know the truth of what we has been paying all these years. I bet you there are still many people here who do not know what they are paying for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If TOC or someone can list out each and every taxes implemented by this garments in this tiny  country called singapore and show it to the people, I think it will be more shocking to know the truth of what we has been paying all these years. I bet you there are still many people here who do not know what they are paying for.</p>
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		<title>By: WKC</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41393</link>
		<dc:creator>WKC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 04:37:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41393</guid>
		<description>Let&#039;s be realistic, costs of living in many areas have gone up significantly and the people who are most affected are the majoriity of the working class. 

What has the government done? Little or not enough.

Why should people have to pay GST for hospitalization and other medical costs? Becoming ill is bad enough and having to incur medical bills is another blow; but why GST?

Why should the cost of seeking treatment at the emergency clinic of a government hospital [SGH, for example] be set at a minimum of $90? One would not normally visit an emergency clinic unless it is an emergency. But look at the hefty cost one has to pay. 

How many government depts, if any, are not operating on a profit basis?

Singaporeans may be interested to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s be realistic, costs of living in many areas have gone up significantly and the people who are most affected are the majoriity of the working class. </p>
<p>What has the government done? Little or not enough.</p>
<p>Why should people have to pay GST for hospitalization and other medical costs? Becoming ill is bad enough and having to incur medical bills is another blow; but why GST?</p>
<p>Why should the cost of seeking treatment at the emergency clinic of a government hospital [SGH, for example] be set at a minimum of $90? One would not normally visit an emergency clinic unless it is an emergency. But look at the hefty cost one has to pay. </p>
<p>How many government depts, if any, are not operating on a profit basis?</p>
<p>Singaporeans may be interested to know.</p>
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		<title>By: Balajian Skuravi</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41388</link>
		<dc:creator>Balajian Skuravi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 03:44:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41388</guid>
		<description>Since NO ONE OWES US A LIVING,

we must have initiative and fend for ourselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Since NO ONE OWES US A LIVING,</p>
<p>we must have initiative and fend for ourselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Just wondering</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41387</link>
		<dc:creator>Just wondering</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 03:39:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41387</guid>
		<description>Hi think-out-of-the-well-readers ,

I wonder and wondered,
TC sinking fund is people&#039;s money.
Specifically, the money belongs to the people who LEASE flats,
which are not cheap at all.

IF this situation happens in 1st worlds like Switzerland, France, Germany, Norway, Sweden, England, California, Sydney, Melbourne, Tokyo, Seoul, Quebec, etc,  WHAT THE .... WOULD HAPPEN?   HOW DIFFERENTLY WOULD THE REACTIONS BE?

Note that I am limiting the scenarios to only purely the well developed countries known for their standard of living.

Like the song the lemon tree, I wonder how , I wonder why, ......and I wonder.

:(

You can run, hide, avoid but the FACT REMAINS in our face.


regards
1st world citizen of the type R.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi think-out-of-the-well-readers ,</p>
<p>I wonder and wondered,<br />
TC sinking fund is people&#8217;s money.<br />
Specifically, the money belongs to the people who LEASE flats,<br />
which are not cheap at all.</p>
<p>IF this situation happens in 1st worlds like Switzerland, France, Germany, Norway, Sweden, England, California, Sydney, Melbourne, Tokyo, Seoul, Quebec, etc,  WHAT THE &#8230;. WOULD HAPPEN?   HOW DIFFERENTLY WOULD THE REACTIONS BE?</p>
<p>Note that I am limiting the scenarios to only purely the well developed countries known for their standard of living.</p>
<p>Like the song the lemon tree, I wonder how , I wonder why, &#8230;&#8230;and I wonder.</p>
<p>:(</p>
<p>You can run, hide, avoid but the FACT REMAINS in our face.</p>
<p>regards<br />
1st world citizen of the type R.</p>
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		<title>By: mad93</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41384</link>
		<dc:creator>mad93</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 02:43:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41384</guid>
		<description>Transparent? Why take months after lehman brother collapse then you tell us?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Transparent? Why take months after lehman brother collapse then you tell us?</p>
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		<title>By: $illy$ingaporean</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41367</link>
		<dc:creator>$illy$ingaporean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 19:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41367</guid>
		<description>This is crazy!

The transparency is so invisible.

We asked why the Punggol/Pasir Ris and Teo Ho Pin&#039;s TC invested in toxic products and lost our money, the Straits TImes came up with almost 4 pages of crap about the Health MInister&#039;s take on transparency and brags about his particular Sembawang Town Council is.

3 words to describe it all : Full of Shit!

&quot;You know, the cure for all this talk is really a good dose of incompetent government. You get that alternative and you&#039;ll never put Singapore together again: Humpty Dumpty cannot be put together again... and your asset values will disappear, your apartment will be worth a fraction of what it is, your jobs will be in peril, your security will be at risk and our women will become maids in other people&#039;s countries, foreign workers.&quot; - Justifying million-dollar pay hike for Singapore ministers (Straits Times, 5 April 2007)

Congratulations folks, really getting a good dose now!

More secrets from the society akan datang!

Good luck!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is crazy!</p>
<p>The transparency is so invisible.</p>
<p>We asked why the Punggol/Pasir Ris and Teo Ho Pin&#8217;s TC invested in toxic products and lost our money, the Straits TImes came up with almost 4 pages of crap about the Health MInister&#8217;s take on transparency and brags about his particular Sembawang Town Council is.</p>
<p>3 words to describe it all : Full of Shit!</p>
<p>&#8220;You know, the cure for all this talk is really a good dose of incompetent government. You get that alternative and you&#8217;ll never put Singapore together again: Humpty Dumpty cannot be put together again&#8230; and your asset values will disappear, your apartment will be worth a fraction of what it is, your jobs will be in peril, your security will be at risk and our women will become maids in other people&#8217;s countries, foreign workers.&#8221; &#8211; Justifying million-dollar pay hike for Singapore ministers (Straits Times, 5 April 2007)</p>
<p>Congratulations folks, really getting a good dose now!</p>
<p>More secrets from the society akan datang!</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
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		<title>By: smallvice585</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41366</link>
		<dc:creator>smallvice585</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:46:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41366</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The ongoing riots in Greece is unbelievable, just see what the people did to the own country. I have a local friend there who send me updates of whats been happening becos the present garments are not doing anything to help the people.&lt;/i&gt; - &lt;b&gt;tiredsingaporeans (#69)&lt;/b&gt;

The Greek ruling party has been fattening its coffers and neglecting populist needs over the years. There has always been a tension between the ruling party and the electorate, and all it took was a murder of a young boy carried out by a policeman to spark an all-out uprising. If indeed there are peaceful means to awake apathetic Singaporeans who don&#039;t want their boat to be shaken, then only violent means should be rejected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The ongoing riots in Greece is unbelievable, just see what the people did to the own country. I have a local friend there who send me updates of whats been happening becos the present garments are not doing anything to help the people.</i> &#8211; <b>tiredsingaporeans (#69)</b></p>
<p>The Greek ruling party has been fattening its coffers and neglecting populist needs over the years. There has always been a tension between the ruling party and the electorate, and all it took was a murder of a young boy carried out by a policeman to spark an all-out uprising. If indeed there are peaceful means to awake apathetic Singaporeans who don&#8217;t want their boat to be shaken, then only violent means should be rejected.</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41363</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:34:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41363</guid>
		<description>The ongoing riots in Greece is unbelievable, just see what the people did to the own country. I have a local friend there who send me updates of whats been happening becos the present garments are not doing anything to help the people. I just dont wish to see this things happening here but then again, there are already too many foreign aliens keep coming here with our garments welcoming them and things can just gone berserk anytime in time to come.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The ongoing riots in Greece is unbelievable, just see what the people did to the own country. I have a local friend there who send me updates of whats been happening becos the present garments are not doing anything to help the people. I just dont wish to see this things happening here but then again, there are already too many foreign aliens keep coming here with our garments welcoming them and things can just gone berserk anytime in time to come.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41362</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:19:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41362</guid>
		<description>They says Mas Selamat escaped but I says the greatest escape attempted of this year is MP Teo Ho Pin. Least remember Mas Selamat did not cause our tax money of 16 millions to disappear into thin air even though he is branded a terrorist by our unbelieveable government. Not only MP Teo Ho Pin escape legally but also happily getting his salary. Anyway, didn&#039;t this Teo get extra salary been as overall in charge of TC fund ? Anything it is not nothing new, they have been performing David Copperfield&#039;s tricks for more than 4 decades.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They says Mas Selamat escaped but I says the greatest escape attempted of this year is MP Teo Ho Pin. Least remember Mas Selamat did not cause our tax money of 16 millions to disappear into thin air even though he is branded a terrorist by our unbelieveable government. Not only MP Teo Ho Pin escape legally but also happily getting his salary. Anyway, didn&#8217;t this Teo get extra salary been as overall in charge of TC fund ? Anything it is not nothing new, they have been performing David Copperfield&#8217;s tricks for more than 4 decades.</p>
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		<title>By: tiredsingaporeans</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41361</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredsingaporeans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:12:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41361</guid>
		<description>See how easy to get away with things when you are in power these days. Just move here move there then disappear into thin air and those millions of taxpayers $$$ being lost, what is going to happen? just gone up in smoke like that? with no one to be accounted for?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See how easy to get away with things when you are in power these days. Just move here move there then disappear into thin air and those millions of taxpayers $$$ being lost, what is going to happen? just gone up in smoke like that? with no one to be accounted for?</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://theonlinecitizen.com/2008/12/not-secret-society/comment-page-2/#comment-41360</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 17:58:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theonlinecitizen.com/?p=4229#comment-41360</guid>
		<description>So next time people want to ask the gov or the committee what happen to TC fund, the gov will reply no answer as MP Teo Ho Pin has move on to other position and say we have to move on too. Typical of world-clown government system here. Elite Kangaroos are ruining Singapore.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So next time people want to ask the gov or the committee what happen to TC fund, the gov will reply no answer as MP Teo Ho Pin has move on to other position and say we have to move on too. Typical of world-clown government system here. Elite Kangaroos are ruining Singapore.</p>
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