Will be there to give moral support – the least I can do. Doing something is better than not doing anything at all.

Ask not what others can speak up for you but what you can do for those who speak up for you.

I empathise with the poor, though I’m not wealthy myself. I came from a very poor fireman sole breadwinner family. I’ve accompanied my father to pawnshops and chettiars when I was young.

BUT, I decided that I do not want to make my children go through the same experience. I studied hard, I worked hard, and I’ve given my family a much better life than I had when young.

So what happen to these people? Do they choose to be single? Have their children abandoned them? If it was fate that made them lose their families, then they deserve all the help the government can give.

BUT, if their children refuse to study hard or work hard, or choose the easy path when young, or if they themselves have chosen the kind of life that led them to this end, then the government must balance the kind of help, with their own effort to survive.

As it is, one can just look around and see how much is spent on pubs, discos, liquor, gambling, womanising etc. How many of our young men are actually `working’ not caring whether they have CPF or Medisave as long as they have more to spend.

Then look again at our schools. Just ask any teacher and he or she can tell you all about the studenst who went to schools simply because their parents wanted them to. Some had to be bribed with expensive handphones, holidays, just to come up with a passable result to be promoted, or eligible for the Normal Stream, not that I look down on the Normal Stream. Ask any teacher about the usual end-of-year promotion exercise which actually means adding marks to help such students to go on to the next level, simply because there is just insufficient place to keep them back, or that there was no point in doing so. Add to that the many more students-at-risk, despite all the efforts of the friendly neighbourhood policemen.

They and their parents know what the future would be like.

Is it fair for chiildren who work hard, sacrificing for delayed gratification, and later on have to pay higher taxes, so that the poor are never left behind?

The self-help groups, be it CDAC, Mendaki or Sinda, are praiseworthy organizations, and they can do much more, if only the message is very clear to all those irresponsible parents and students. Do something now, before you will be help in future.

I expect a lot of noise from other events that are always held on saturdays at HLP main area, either martial arts-lion dance music or other events that use heavy duty loudspeakers that makes listening to speaker’s corners speakers a difficulty.

all of a sudden HLP become so utilized…..

I expect a lot of noise from other events that are always held on saturdays at HLP main area, either martial arts-lion dance music or other events that use heavy duty loudspeakers that makes listening to speaker’s corners speakers a difficulty. – LJ Meesiam (#3)

Last week, the “Taste India, Dance India” Event clashed with Tan Kin Lian’s rally for Lehman-affected investors. It was unfortunate but Indian cultural event was already planned to take place on that day at Hong Lim Park since a year ago.

Pictures are fake!

Liars!

“You go down New York, Broadway. You will see the beggars, people of the streets…Where are the beggars in Singapore? Show me.” – Lee Kuan Yew

“There are no homeless, destitute or starving people [in Singapore]…Poverty has been eradicated.” – Kishore Mahbubani, Singapore’s permanent representative to the UN

http://www.singaporedemocrat.org/poverty.html

which country does have the poor and homeless at any one time? this video is biased. in comparison with the rest of the developed world, Singapore has far less poor and homeless, that’s the crux of the matter.

if one is so “concerned” about these people, then everytime you see one, call up the police and let them deal with it, instead of politicising this matter.

partisan (#6),

You are the one politicising the issue by accusing ToC of politicising the issue. Just because Singapore has far less poor and homeless people does not make the marginalisation of these people a less worthy cause. Poor people are Singaporeans too, and they should have a representative voice in society and parliament. If giving the voiceless a voice is deemed politicisation, then there is nothing wrong with politicising an issue at all.

TOC:

You need projector to show some slides like this? Photos speak of thousand words. I am willing to bring my projector if you need to. It never failed to sadden me when I see slides or short video clips like this.

I wish to contribute, thanks

Call police? Why not the ISD. I tot suppose to call ComCare?

Hi TOC,

You did not state the time when the speeches will kick off.

Yup, there are no beggars or destitutes or homeless in Singapore. Most of them are locked up for it is a crime here to beg or to sleep on park benches. As one esteemed leader put it, they are an eyesore on the bright, clean and wealthy face of the country. They must not be allowed to sully the image of our 1st world country now in its Golden Age. Those old people we see picking cans, cardboard, etc and selling tissue papers and cleaning toilets are NOT poor or destitute. They are examples of the dignity of employment even in advanced old age.

Oops! sorry, did not watch the video first. It’s between 5pm and 7pm.

Dear partisan,

Politics ought to have seen to it that these poor folks are taken care of. It does not matter that other countries have them. If can we help them then we should, so that other countries would follow us and all the poor people in the whole world would have their human dignity restored to them.

This has to be politicised. It is the right thing to do . . . if your blood is red and warm.

6) partisan on December 4th, 2008 1.03 pm
which country does have the poor and homeless at any one time? this video is biased. in comparison with the rest of the developed world, Singapore has far less poor and homeless, that’s the crux of the matter.

]]] You are right syntactically, mathematically. But have you factored in the small population compared to other countries? Likewise, have you given any thought before you commented? I cannot help it, the flaw in your logic is humongous and I feel ashamed for you.

#6 partisan
“if one is so “concerned” about these people, then everytime you see one, call up the police and let them deal with it, instead of politicising this matter.”

Hello? Are you able or unable to tell us :

1. What thingie in this world will NEVER be or can NEVER be a political issue?
2. Considering all the many thingies that can be political when the circumstance is right, are you advising the people that all issues is potentially political and we should not use the mouth?

RED-man,

Thanks for the offer of help with the projector. I do not think it is allowed, however. We’ll need to get an entertainment permit for that. In any case, it will be too bright for anyone to be able to watch a slideshow. Perhaps in future if and when we have an indoor event, we might need your help… :)

I hope everyone will turn up on Saturday… :)

Just being present is support enough…

Andrew

“if one is so “concerned” about these people, then everytime you see one, call up the police and let them deal with it, instead of politicising this matter.”

Naive and lacking EQ best describes you, PARTISAN.

If you think by “sweeping” the less fortunate people off the streets will solve society’s problem, you’re no better than those who practised genocide, holocaust, etc.

By the way, is this your personal opinion or you were taught by your parents or are you part of a group that believes in this economic holocaust?

The only mitigating factor for your opinion is that you’re unbelievably INMATURE! Please get someone to tutor you on social studies. It will enlighten you for your good future.

Hi Andrew & all,

All of us have to help publicize this Saturday’s event to make it an EVENT. The momentum must be kept up if we hope to see changes along the way because apathy is well ingrained in most Singaporeans.

Be there, be seen and together, be a locomotive for much needed positive changes.

cya on Sat ;)

Yes, let the people know the truth of singapore. Many are still living in the dark and the only source of information they get was through our national TV and MSM where only the good stuff are being told. So sick!

Good initiaitive by TOC. Good job Andrew and team.

I have been to the airport on few occasions in the middle of the night to sned people away and found alot of people sleeping at Changi T1/2/3. It pained my heart to see our people having no where to due perhaps due to personal reason.

I knew some divorcees slept underneath the Benjamin Bridge also when they divorced and have no where to go as their flat was repossessed by HDB. Some make it to neighbouring countries such as Batam, JB and Tg Pinang where the standard of living is lower.

When I worked in a family service centre, there are grown men who told me they have no shether due to various reasons. When I checked whether any available resources were available then, I was shocked to find out that there was a lack of such welfare services. There are shelters for battered women and their kids but not for men.

In US and Australia, there are welfare sheters for all gender if they are street people. Of course, some prefer to stay out on their own due to various reasons.

Nevertheless, a properly run shelter for the poor and homeless needs to be in place at least for the interim period before people find appropriate housing.

17)Harrison

Hi I think that was a very strongly worded post. Though we can agree to disagree, lets do it with courtesy.

We want a civil exchange of ideas and views but certainly within reason, mutual respect and love.

Thanks all.

Hi Gilbert,

Thanks for your reminder.

I felt a great need to question and send a strong reminder to those who are lacking in general compassion and emotional quotient, a result of society’s declining values and in fact, a reflection of our government’s attitude.

It was a strong message meant to draw a reply from PARTISAN. Lets hear from him/her.

With all the negative comments against me, I would think it is an irony that some of you intend to gather to celebrate the “Declaration of Human Rights” (if anyone bothered to know what it is all about).

“Why do you focus on the splinter which is in your brother’s eye, and fail to notice the plank which is in your own eye?” (Mat 7: 1-6) Do not be so hasty in passing judgment. I am not against being vocal about human rights nor freedom of speech.

However, I felt that the “poor” and “homeless” are often exploited to push for other agendas. Of those so-called “poor” and “homeless” featured in the video, do you know how many of them rejected help from welfare organisations? Go ask the old lady picking up the cans from the rubbish dump or the old man stacking old cardboards to sell, it would be interesting to hear their reply.

This is the rationale for me stating that this video is politicising the poor and homeless: It seemed to me that the video is showing that the Government doesn’t care or don’t bother. On the contrary, some of them featured also rejected help. To be fair to the Government, they do provide welfare and help to the needy, why is it not featured in the video? This video is one-sided, designed to draw sympathy.

Anyway, most people are often armchair critics who just want to have a go at PAP’s but still belong to the 66% who will voted for them. Talk only no action.

Paul, erm i mean partisan,

u wrote : “Anyway, most people are often armchair critics who just want to have a go at PAP’s but still belong to the 66% who will voted for them. Talk only no action.”

your 66% will be even more meaningful if in this tiny little country everyone voted and then your argument would be even more bombastic and convincing, not that it is not bombastic and unconvincing.

Tis is fun.

Everybody’s havin a piece of you Partisan..feelin the heat eh?
Started to be frustrated or maybe motivated to lambast back..It could be a ploy to gain some popularity..

Anyway, Just because the poor doesnt want help, that doesn’t mean they don’t need help. My friend’s aunt lived alone and she gets by sellin crackers and sardine puffs at MRT stations. She’s got gout and whole history of hypertension and diabetes. A very proud woman still and refused to be help watsoever. But I gues we can all do our part to flag these people to the correct ministry for help bcos the authorities will continue to ignore and turn the blind eye.
Now she gets some form of financial relief thanks to my friend who encouraged her and more importantly, stayed relevant to her life with visits and company.

God bless us all.

Hi All

I think all of us here want to do something for our country abeit in a very different way.

We are all make differently, have different asipirations and environment and so see things very differently from one another.

There is no need to actually attack one another here. It will only make us feel hurt and empty inside. As if the world right now is not chaotic enough.

Many wars were started by a small spark and the consequences were devastating.

I have all along advocate a forbearing spirit here despite our differences.

For this site tb e great and solid, it needs to continuously attract views from different sources. We agree to disagree but let’s do it civilly and with respect.

What is so great about this site if we only attract anti-establishment netizens? The site is only great if we can attract pro-establishment people and listen to their views with respect instead of shooting them down.

My dream is for all partisan or non-partisan netizens to have a good argument here with mutual respect and courtesy for all mankind without attacking each other personally.

Only if we can rise above our own views and yet able to love all others that we can truly be called great men of our land.

I’ll be there in spirit … am currently half a world away.

Have you guys tried contacting Dr Lily Neo to get her to show up as well? It seemed (barring the possibility of political posturing) this is a matter close to her heart.

As for partisan’s (#6) comments – have you considered what the police would do for these people when they “deal with it”? Frankly I do not know. Our police is an efficient law-enforcement force … I do not know how much social work capabilities or connections they possess.

I would hardly consider this a “political issue”. This is a social issue and I believe TOC is doing the right thing by bringing this into the public light so Singaporeans can be made aware of it and try to do right by it. I was blissfully unaware of the problem while living in Hougang and even when I started observing these scenes in Chinatown where my girlfriend lives. For a long time I truly believed the government line that poverty had been eradicated and that we were a nation of middle-class citizens.

Gilbert (#21),

I think the government should consider additional facilities suitable as temp dorms for foreign workers to also consider them for use as shelters for the homeless and the destitute. They can be provided food donated by citizens (given how much Singaporeans donate to the NKF, wouldn’t even a fraction help provide food to these people?). If some of the elderly are fiercely proud of their independence, they can “earn their keep”, doing artwork for sale or even continuing to collect cardboard boxes and other recycling materials that the shelters would pay them for.

Social activists can then be invited to help these people get their lives together again at such shelters.

24) partisan

the “Declaration of Human Rights” if anyone bothered to know what it is all about.

Human rights or Individual rights, they all boil down to one common denominator – RESPECT.

One thing I just cannot comprehend enough, why we have so many commentators jumping in to TOC, shout their arrogant and brainless thingies, and when shouted back at, they all go crying foul and blame the rest for having planks in their eyes when they know for certain that they have that little splinter in theirs to take care of first before they go tell the whole world about their splintered vision of it.

Take off the splinter first and there will be no planks flying toward you. Your ’splinter/plank’ quote of the Bible is meant for one who does not know that he has a splinter in his eye; and not for one who knows he has it there, but does nothing about it and still try to be smart to others, telling them to take off their planks. By doing so, your splinter becomes a plankfull, enough to build a bridge across a river.

Now, let’s return to our sanity.

However, I felt that the “poor” and “homeless” are often exploited to push for other agendas. Of those so-called “poor” and “homeless” featured in the video, do you know how many of them rejected help from welfare organisations?

No denying that both your statements hold some truths in them. But then again, ask yourself why there is this ‘exploitation’? Because, for every one ‘exploited’, there are a hundred more who are in dire need of assistance. To me, the need to exploit is seen more as a need to educate, to bring awareness to the existence of such people in such plights. While we continue to argue whether each is a genuine case or not, we will be missing out on those who truly are. Are their rights of these genuine cases being compromised while we argue?

As for the poor rejecting help from welfare organisations; did you for one moment stop to think why these poor folks are rejecting such avenue of assistance? Do you understand the Asian mentality at all. A person can be dying of hunger, yet claim not to need any help because he feels he need to have his dignity intact, o,r save face. Do we leave them be and say it is their fault then? Have we tried harder to find ways to help him by adopting a different approach? Most of these people are waiting just for that.

I recently caught a glimpse of something on tv (I usually do not watch the telly at all) and there was this man who, when prompted by the show host to sell off one of his unused luggage bag for $50 so that he could use the money to support his family; his reply was, he did not want $50 for it. He only wanted to sell it for $20. When questioned why, he said he has his dignity and that taking $50 is akin to selling off his dignity for the additional $30.

What I am saying is very simply this; that these welfare organisations look beyond just providing monetary assistance and look to see if other areas like housing and providing for these poor folks in a dignified and humane way, unlike the bureaucratic ways is now adopts, where one seeking help has to first face-off with strangers who ask all sorts of probing questions that strips one off his dignity and lacking in basic humanity.

Soemthing else for you to think about. Why are we doing so much for the FW as opposed to our used-and-now-deemed-useless generation of senior citizens?

Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber. – Plato

No time for being online macho/partisan/battle of words, I’m going down this Saturday. :) These are exciting times.

Yes. i am for a shelter for the homeless and destitute. A place where philantropic singaporeans can donate their money and time to feed and clothe these people. This is something to the buddhist lodge (i think) which provides free lunch for those who bothered to show up every day at its premises. yes..there are those who will take advantage of this form of charity and abuse it…e.g. they are actually ok financially but just want free accomodatios and meal…but SO WHAT?…if want to genuinely help, everyone that shows up would be helped; much like the buddhist lodge..you think everyone that shows up cannot afford a meal?..i dont think so.

At these centres, these people can be organised properly to pick the cans in a systematic manner such as given proper uniforms, tools etc or be given other types of jobs etc. Such centres can then access the needs of each stayer and refer them to proper authorities for more long term help.

Yes..i would rather the govt identify 10 locations to house these people and help them systematically than 10 locations to house the ever growing numbers of ah nehs..after all the accomodation of foreign workers should be the problem of the contractors who brought them in…if you want to use them, please take care of their accomodation too.

I think Spore is going full steam ahead and developing at such a break neck speed that everything nowadays is evaluated in terms of cost and benefit…dollars and cents…sad.

.

32) raymond

Agree with you in general, but you might want to elaborate further on what you mean when you say “….and refer them to proper authorities for more long term help. Who are the authorities you are suggesting?

The same authorities that these same people had shun in the first place or a newly set up independent decision making body affiliated to the prescribed shelter that has nothing to do with the government?

Won’t we be doing the job of the govenment then? What happens to the govt’s responsibility to its people?. Now, I’m not saying we, the citizens, cannot do our part. What I am saying is that the larger part of this responsibility belongs to the govt. How then can we get the govt to play the part is has to play?.

Other than this, I think you have some wonderful ideas worth exploring further.

#33) PAPpal on December 6th, 2008 1.12 pm

Your scaremongering tactics won’t work in cyberspace especially with the younger generation. Please come up with something new la.

Allow me to quote gemami:

“Won’t we be doing the job of the govenment then? What happens to the govt’s responsibility to its people?. Now, I’m not saying we, the citizens, cannot do our part. What I am saying is that the larger part of this responsibility belongs to the govt. How then can we get the govt to play the part is has to play?.”

I fully agree with gemami that we can and should play our parts in helping poorer people that we come across. However, we must be mindful not to take too much of social responsibility. A main function of any government is to provide social stability and look after the welfares of the weaker and poorer citizens.

patriot

Govt got no time to take care of the poor, govt busy investing money overseas and then made a loss so got no money to help.

partisan (#24),

Did you go to Speaker’s Corner to take up your issue against TOC? It is clear you didn’t and you don’t know what human rights is. No one protested at Speaker’s Corner against TOC during the event itself, including you. If you genuinely felt you had a strong case, you would already be at Speaker’s Corner already.