i think gilbert has forgotten that the professionals and engineers have a lot of savings in their cpf. better don’t suggest more savings.

in paradise, savings means money no longer see the daylight, not for you to say when you can have it back. then must save some more and more and more. never save enough.

it is so frightening.

Read Gilbert’s forum letter on ST today.

yup, he is spot on in my opine.

but as long as these higher educated people no ask for help,
the status will be the quo.

alas, only Mr Gilbert dared to voice up.

this RECESSION or DEPRESSION
is affecting the Professionals , Executived and Managers.

The only SOLUTION that in my opine is a REAL Solution to this unemployment problem is

when Real Jobs for these Professionals are CREATED. Able or Unable to Create these jobs is the real measure of success of solving this problem.
Real Jobs : an accounting trained lands a job doing accounting.
a IT manager getting a IT manager job.
a Programmer getting a programming job.
a Marketing executive getting a marketing job.

Anything else : not really solving the unemployment problem. Will still lead to future problems for these professionals who could not earn enough to pay and pay their installments they agreed to pay during the so-called more good years and the golden period.

I got a half solution to provide jobs : create a company called P L P to employ thousands of part time short term contract singapore’s rivers cleaner positions, any Professionals , Degree Holders (inclusive of PhDs) are welcome to apply. still got quite some litter in the rivers and longkangs. target is to make them transparently clear water without stink and bacteria and litter. Like this got a long term potential for professionals to get a job – as a cleaner. Still a job right? Is this solving the unemployment problem? Like all thingies in this world, its DEBATABLE. Depends on how good lawyer you got.

okie lah, I go back to sit in the shelter in the park liao. jobless and nothing to do. but i get out of home each day dressed for work but office is in the park.

wow, i look at my cpf statement so many zeros wor. almost left 1 zero liao.

/// However, the current crisis seems to have hit many PMEs (professional, mangerial and executive) right now. This group of people is highly qualified and may not benefit from such retraining…

More can be done to help this growing group of unemployed who continues to be left out of government initiatives… ///

Gilbert, I am afraid you might be barking up the wrong tree. PMEs are largely outside the purview of NTUC. Although some managers and professionals do become NTUC members, the number is very small, and most of those who became member did so because of the discounts at NTUC Fairprice and other perks, and not for main objective of protection of workers’ rights.

This is a pure numbers game and political capital is the main concern. There are hundreds of thousands of lower-end workers and these are your political middle ground where the votes matter. The thousands of PMEs who are jobless – tough – luck – they can become taxi drivers or migrate…

Don’t get me wrong. I sympathize with all workers. But the political law of numbers dictate that you take care of the masses first…

Ya the unemployment rate keeps on growing and most of my friends now are either retrenched or having their pay cut. Some have to work PT i.e. half pay for half month of work.

I advocate for unemployment benefit as this is the only way to provide for a safety net in this time of need.

Many PMEs though well paid hardly save up for raining day. Maybe this is also our own fault as we are a nation of upgraders.

Just yesterday I read the Today about this guy who was jobless and worked very hard to make about $2k a month. His wife is also working PT to supplement his income.

To my shock, he said that he wanted to work hard to accumulate enough to upgrade to a condo and buy a car! I shook my head in disappointment as I found that many of us have this problem of moving ahead at the expense of taking on too much loans and debts.

We are all ok if we live simply even when jobless for a few months. We are all dead duck if we take on $300,000 mortgage loan, $50,000 car loan and chalk up $30,000 credit card loan and once we are jobless we are there for the taking by all the banks and credit companies. We got nothing to back us up when we are so much in debts.

Hopefully, this recession will wake us up to live simply even if we earn $5k or $10k a month. The day of reckoning will come when we get the pink slip suddenly one fine day.

A friend working in Shanghai just emailed me that he was laid off on 31 Dec 2008. He worked as an IT specialist there. He told me he was lost and deeply depressed.

I told him to hang on and keep in touch with me so that we can help one another out.

Take care all and learn to live simply – motto of the year for all.

i’m against another ’saving’ fund, else we will create another cheap source of funding for extravagant buys in western banks for super long term investments.
anyway whatever fund that’s been allocated need to be made available for the pool of people unemployed. we all pay taxes and contribute to the economy during good times, if need to be re-trained, then make those funds available for all to be ‘re-trained’. the concept of re-training is getting outdated, all we hear are always re-training re-training… i wonder is our education so screwed up that singaporean workers always need to be ‘re-trained’ to stay employed or is it we have too many cheap labour that it’s made us redundant?

uhm, since when the NTUC chief ever got his priorities right in public? things like boasting about feeling rich when looking at his monthly CPF statement really makes my day, and makes my blood boil. upturn the downturn anyone?

i’ve given up on him as a politician. i still think he makes a fantastic comedian. we should really give him a new portfolio. and eliminate his current one, given that he does nothing anyway.

Most people pay by installments. Whatever installments.

If can pay cash, most would have.

When they out of job,
it is so tough on them.

who are these heavy on debt (installments for condo, 5 rooms, mazda rx8 or higher, big insurance premiums, private property etc )?
the PMEs.

credit card companies were very successful in getting people to use credit cards and his created problems many now cannot run away from.

people should not spend and spend beyond their means. dont be too greedy also.
else, you deserve it. as simple as that. injoy!

“7) Chen Guo Hao Raymond on January 6th, 2009 11.34 am
people should not spend and spend beyond their means. dont be too greedy also.
else, you deserve it. as simple as that. injoy!”

Ya loh, say you bought a decent private unit based on a certain income (bcos you just happen to cross the household income limit not qualifying for buying a hdb flat) and out of the sudden you are out of job, quite common now even for high flyers. So what say you leh. greedy ????

Even HDB has their own “stylish” built-to-order units (space may not be big but price not so small lah).

Yeah lo, in the near months to come, we may begin to see more and more converted greedy people loh.

While private sector can get chopped anytime in their job, our public sector of those high flying ones can have their secured for at least another 2 years. as simple as that. injoy!

[...] Recession – TOC: Disappointed with NTUC chief’s top 3 priorities [...]

i’m not sure if i wld want to give up 1% of my income to provide for unemployment benefits in singapore.

the reason is simple: look at how they run the town council and gic funds. what assurance do we hv that there will be transparency, accountability and prudence in managing or dispensing the funds???

the $$$ shld come from somewhere e.g. part of the interest on our multi-billion-dollar reserves. after all, it IS a rainy day for the unemployed singaporeans when they need to tap into this.

i definitely do not support the idea for unemployment benefits in singapore.

now, sg citizenship is so easily attained, this system might be easily abused by new citizens. i will not give up part of my income to support these people.

unless they tighten up the citizenship criteria, i will not give my support for this system.

#2 )

I feel that your solution could potentially bring down the unemployment rate TO ZERO.

well done! the other way i thought of was for unemployed to register a company so that they can tell others and their family members or wife they are going big and quitting their jobs to become an entreprenuer.

in this crisis, though small businesses especially the new ones may have zero business, little business or tough business, unemployed can become bosses and become employed – SELF Employed and bring down the unemployment rate to ZERO.

some think my idea very funny. i no no leh.

aiyoyo

if commoners no see effective solutions from ELITEs

then not sure why there’s need for ELITEs?

aiyoyo

So, the REAL Question is

if Unemployed registers a sole proprietorship

he is out of the unemployment statistic?

like this, if so, i wonder how accurate is statistics.

intellectuals, have you ever thought about this or choose to ignore and remain super apathetic?

If the Minister and his team is viewed as lack of wantings in his actions to arrest the slide in this recession. What other alternatives can TOC offer???? Plse, plse all TOC wanabies, bongo and half-baked peo[ple, do not just be armed in your chairs and cocooned in ivory towered air-conditioned seats, go out in the open, offer and champion some out of the box solns. Have you all TOC also run out if better solns!! Do not just talk big and do nothing. If some of the TOC BIG Heads (Toa Len Kon) can offer better solns, then it would be wonderful. But can YOU? It is always easy to shoot down others but can you save yourself some bullets? If not, GO home and sleep!

Since when has it become the prerogative for citizens to solve problems that fall under the responsibility of the world’s highest paid politicians?

Who are the ones who gets paid multi-million dollars to do their jobs to run this country?

Sure, once you can get those Ministers to willingly quit, then we talk about your hollow challenge to harvest the collective intelligence of the TOC readers.

In the meantime, we are all ready to hold LHL’s team’s performance against the salary that they’ve been drawing.

Just because one cannot cook does not mean he cant tell that he’s been served bad food. If we are so accepting, then it is our fault that we have to forever eat lousy food.

At least we have common ground that our Division One team is “viewed as lack of wantings in his actions to arrest the slide in this recession”.

That is the very reason why I stressed the TOC should form up a strong team right now in the open to challenge the ruling party. Just talk and continue with the TOC forum will get all of you and us nowhere as the GE will be called anytime these 2 yrs. Wake up all TOC wanabies, bongo, half-baked and half-past-six people. It will be too late again if the GE will be called immediately, surprisingly and suddenly after the budget in 1 month time!!! Do not get caught off guared. Politics wait for no one. In consolations, Oppositions will only blamed the government for this change of events and disadvantaged the Oppositions or what TKL preferred “alternatives” people.

> Plse, plse all TOC wanabies, bongo and half-baked peo[ple, do not just be armed in your chairs and cocooned in ivory towered air-conditioned seats, go out in the open, offer and champion some out of the box solns. Have you all TOC also run out if better solns!! <

And bail those elites out?

Aww, we cannot mollycoddle them by rewarding under performance and their failure to come up with viable solutions. Doing the job for them will just encourage them to have a crutch mentality.

Just as S’poreans do not have a financial safety net, the leadership should not expect to be bailed out.

Seriously, what kind of constructive result did you really expect with your “bull-in-a-china-shop” taunts?

In politics stupidity is not a handicap.
- Napoleon Bonaparte

“Plse, plse all TOC wanabies, bongo and half-baked peo[ple, do not just be armed in your chairs and cocooned in ivory towered air-conditioned seats, go out in the open, offer and champion some out of the box solns.”

At least, we do not claim how super we are and that is why a lot of us are not so qualified to warrant that kind of million dollar salary.

So many rules and you want out-of-the-box solutions. If those multi-million-dollar super stars have all the space to control this and that (hey 84+ over 2 oppo), why don’t you ask them to excercise some super power to think of out-of-the-box solutions.

“Wake up all TOC wanabies, bongo, half-baked and half-past-six people. It will be too late again if the GE will be called immediately,”

Be patient. Just bcos of some shouting from you Oscar, that does not mean that people must be presurred by the your desired pace. What off guard lah, real ground conditions and circumstances will decide who gets caught off guard, not you and me lah.

What else is new, all lip service only, never really look at the root of the problems, no worries, monthly income set for life, just talk co<k and fart and all you dump a$$es listen,only must remember to put some money in all your account before the gereral election,

15) Oscar Choy on January 6th, 2009 1.16 pm

If the Minister and his team is viewed as lack of wantings in his actions to arrest the slide in this recession. What other alternatives can TOC offer?

If only the ministries holding the key information (data, statistics etc) are willing to provide them, Singaporeans will be able to provide alternative solutions.

Remember the following exchange:

SINGAPORE : Singapore Democratic Alliance’s candidate for Tampines GRC, Edmund Ng says he is taking up the challenge by National Development Minister Mah Bow Tan to build HDB flats at lower cost.

But Mr Mah, who is leading the PAP team in Tampines GRC, says the SDA candidate is just ‘fishing’ for figures and he has asked the HDB not to entertain him.

ah choy,
solution got patent rights or not?
1 solution 3.5 million can or not?
half solution 100k per month can or not?
wow, if solution worth so much, must patent first then reveal to public forum.
hee heee
kidding kidding onlys cans or nots?

Hello TOC,

can I know is it that there is anyone responsible for creating jobs?

i mean, I dunno lor. anyone confident to say they know?

who? I got question to ask him.

rgds
kenna L…’ed

Mr Choy,

you lamented :
“Wake up all TOC wanabies, bongo, half-baked and half-past-six people. It will be too late again if the GE will be called immediately,”

you got solution to solve the above problem you described or not?

i hope I no need lament you do not have solution oso.

10) pigscanfly

I agree with your statement.
The gov have huge reserve fund.
They have to use it in rainning days to help the citizen who need it.

Three days ago in newspaper report.
One lady was caught stealing chicken at supermaket,
to cook for her two children at home.

Because she tell the judge she been retrench from her factory job and no money at the moment to buy food for her children.

And this sad lady have to go to jail.

Why the gov have huge reserve fund but ignore the citizen.
Retrench workers especially.

24) Bung Key Loooonged on January 6th, 2009 3.22 pm

can I know is it that there is anyone responsible for creating jobs?

Obama promised to create jobs for Americans.

It is the government’s job to create a healthy economic environment so the people can be employed. However, this is an extra-ordinary time and the normal ways to attract business is not going to work.

So we are hearing government bringing forward some projects and MOE, MHA etc are recruiting. It is increasing internal spending to create jobs.

Priority 1:
Increase profits
Priority 2:
Increase my own pay!
Priority 3:
Ensure priorities 1 and 2 are fufilled

That is sadly the case. “where did the increasing GST to help the poor” go? ahhh, i know, it is just like the hand of God, working in a subtle way that we can’t see, helping the needy. So yeah, the gahmen is doing their best helping the needy, and you shouldn’t expect more since they are already doing it.

Just like the people say. with such a great PM and party leading SG, we must be appreciative of them. YAH RIGHT, i will curse myself if that is my real thinking.

My response to Oscar Choy actually jolted me and got me thinking of a proposal for you guys.

Since ACCOUNTABILITY is something that we sorely need to see in some gahmen functions, perhaps we should have a section in TOC where TOC/TKL/other rep can write or raise issues to MPs and or gahmen bodies on issues that concern the citizens.

While MSM has the right to reject any forum questions, here, you are in charge and can chronicle the paper flow for every query raised that concerns the people.

Each query that we send to them and each reply that they give will be archived. Even a lack of a response will be recorded accordingly. In so doing, you’ll be able to build an archive of information that anyone can draw from in order to write informative and accurate articles.

Perhaps there could even be a function where netizens get to vote which issue they think is important so when the letter or query is voiced, there is the citizen’s “weight” behind it.

To take things further, you can consider going to go to the public meetings of the concerned MPs and ask the relevant questions there.

The benefit are:

1. You get to publicise TOC to new markets when you introduce yourself, especially to those who are neutral but got dragged into filling up the seats for RC events. Perhaps some hard core pappy supporters might even be interested in alternative views.

2. It gives any one interested in running for politics the opportunity to be seen asking tough questions. Besides, the questioner can practice his/her oratorical or sparring skills. Newbies need practice in tenacity as they can be expected to be brushed off or dismissed initially.

3. TOC can give coverage for such events should the MSM refuse to cover it.

Do think about this suggestion.

Just to clarify for message 30, when I wrote “go to the public meetings of the concerned MPs”, what I was referring to should be the scheduled Q&A sessions during their walkabouts or official events.

“22) sarek_home on January 6th, 2009 2.33 pm
But Mr Mah, who is leading the PAP team in Tampines GRC, says the SDA candidate is just ‘fishing’ for figures and he has asked the HDB not to entertain him.”

“fIshing”. How would people know what to say / question / respond with hard facts if most things are not being made transparent and open.

Yet, some people got the ‘busuk’ cheek to demand “out-of-box” solutions.

[i]Oscar Choy on January 6th, 2009 1.53 pm That is the very reason why I stressed the TOC should form up a strong team right now in the open to challenge the ruling party. [/i]
and you would have mocked the new oppositions for failin to fill in the norminations form properly
even the video camera have proof from the electoria board
which is supposed to be NEUTRAL
how come they still takes instruction from the disgraced home affair minister?
and when the prime minister comes within 500 meter of the counting ballot boxes
which is ONCED against
is DISQUALIFIED under international rulin…
yet he still become the prime minister?
so ole wise 1
cared to show
ME THE LAW
since i can show you international rulin…
smart talk will get you NOWHERE
put YOUR money
where YOUR AS S is…

You think the recent jobs MOE said they are creating will ease the problem? Just wanna hear everyone’s opinion

“Singapore Democratic Alliance’s candidate for Tampines GRC, Edmund Ng says he is taking up the challenge by National Development Minister Mah Bow Tan to build HDB flats at lower cost.

Mr Ng says he has written to the Housing and Development Board requesting for costing information.

But Mr Mah, who is leading the PAP team in Tampines GRC, says the SDA candidate is just ‘fishing’ for figures and he has asked the HDB not to entertain him.”

I think we should get Mr Ng to post his request here, and the subsequent replies from HDB. Not that opposition are not up to the job, but when they want to do the job, they kerna blocked. This is called chao kuan.

The gahmen can create jobs in Singapore if it wants too, like during the days of the New Deal in USA in the 1930s and what Obama is trying to do.

Is the pap doing it and will it do it?

During the 1930s recession in NZ the gahmen there did what Roosevelt did in USA and they got thousands of men to plant trees on a big area and this became the biggest man made forest.

I am sure the pap can think of huge projects by our standard and we can even use the cangkul and spade to create something big and it will be money well spent for us and for our grandchildren.

To come to the guts of the matter how many retrenched people are starving and how starved are their offsprings? How stunted are their kids?

Come on social workers the great champtions of the poor and the great do gooders, move around at the bottom of society to find out.

I bet they sit in their aircon offices to hear the miserable stories of the poor down and out people.

Finally I ask what is the pap doing for the really poor retrenched? So far, not much. Just a few NTUC vouchers and can you get food for the long term unemployed. This time the recession is going to be bad and there will be long term unemployed.

Hohapata tariana hoi hoi

welfare state helps in a recession see and learn from US how they cope Recession!
8,000 HDB lessee having problems on their mortgages so how?

Can unemployed tap into CPF?,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,No way!
CPF – CANNOT PROVIDE FINANCING???

Best is to have unemployed gals meet unemployed males…………get hitched, make love, make babies………………get baby bonus and spend

You aren’t being fair by stating your disapointments with Mr Lim SS like that. There is only so much a labour chief can do. He is in for a very difficult year ahead and you people aren’t helping matters.

I am very much against a collective pool fund. Such a system is too rigid and inner core problems are bound to surface as soon as it is implemented. Besides, this financial recession may be long or short-termed depending on the actions of goevernments all around the world. You cannot keep spending your way out. Bail outs aren’t good options.

Our government isn’t wholly against state welfare, but against open welfare. A collective fund will only aggravate the situation in Singapore. you don’t seriously think that it will work do you? Such policies or solutions take months, if not years, to work out. They aren’t the by-product of silent thoughts and never will be.

Some of you pointed out New Deals and such. I must say, these people are damned stupid and immature. They just want to use big terms without any knowledge of what they truly represent. Anyone here even know what the New Deal by Franklin D. Roosevelt means? Such a solution is going to bring Singapore down and smither her economic foundations to smitherins.

Jobs aren’t created just like that. Besides, the civil service is still recruiting. That’s a sign. In a crisis like that, we ought to unite and follow the govt in the hope that they will lead us to a better tomorrow. You can oppose and obstruct, but you guys are just one in many. Obstructing with reason is better than opposing for nothing.

I said this many times and I will repeat it again. Just because Obama became president, does that mean every country in the world should follow his lead and vote opposition members just because they dislike the incumbent? There is a reason why Singapore made voting compulsary.

Back to topic, the writer states his disappointment with the three points but doesn’t exactly seem to know why? Those three points, though modest in nature and not that revolutionary, are the fundamentals that every small and open economies such as Singapore’s need to adhere to. It is the best way to survive.

Let’s say, your hero/idol Tan KL was NTUC chief and decides to implement generous welfare benefits for unemployed and all those in need of it. What will happen then? People won’t bother to work harder in order to keep their jobs. Companies go broke. Taxes increase in order for the state to finance the welfare expenses. I don’t think I need to elaborate further.

So in all, I think the writer’s idea of a collective welfare pool at this point of time is idealistic but entirely unworkable.The government’s dollar for dollar scheme or something like that for re-training of workers is a very good idea. It will suffice for the time being.

Don’t be pessimistic. Take this crisis as the steepest part of mountain after the smooth sailing before. Only after we overcome this crisis will we emerge stronger.

I support the govt on this labour issue wholeheartedly.

30) To TOC on January 6th, 2009 5.06 pm

i juz have 1 concern. remember the time when 1 guy asked about whether oil price when dropped the hiked transport fare should be lowered ? remember somehow reply included things like you want free transport and GST increase ?

i not sure why the question got the answer which was so bombastic. maybe too cheem for me to understand. But how many people really understood? can tell me if you understood?

Hi Zefly (aka Joshua Chiang),

“You think the recent jobs MOE said they are creating will ease the problem?”

I doubt so. And i feel that the reason they create more jobs is just like the reason for private schools expansions.

[i]panter92 on January 6th, 2009 10.52 pm You aren’t being fair by stating your disapointments with Mr Lim SS like that. There is only so much a labour chief can do. He is in for a very difficult year ahead and you people aren’t helping matters.[/i]
wah
another ypap supporter
hello ole friend
if he find that he has done so much for so many zero$$$
he can alway retired
you know
his job is easily replaceable
if limboonheng
can do it
who cannot?

32) Busuk people on January 6th, 2009 5.55 pm

You pointed out a very important issue.
Without sufficient information about public policies,
many could not even form a question. Even if info about policies are available somewhere, the people may not understand it? If so, TOC may add value to the community by describing it in more layman terms.

What i mean is, in general, if you do not know what is going on
with something, how can you even question?

I believe TOC can add value to the community by educating us about issues and policies that concern us. It would be even better if more contribute to this Blog by sending in their articles that can benefit the rest. After learning more and getting more info from TOC, more readers can then be able to form more intelligent questions when they get the chance.

If we don’t even ask, how can we ever understand more? questioning is the mother of all knowledge.

“I support the govt on this labour issue wholeheartedly.”

Do anybody wanna have a bet that mr panter92 will support them on any issue?

and panter92, maybe you will like to read up on human resource management before you post? and that will tell you more on the human aspect of these management issues.

anyway that’s just your speculation. you are not Micheal Armstrong and if you are, the view will be entirely different and it is something we can trust since what he wrote has been put into practice, not just speculations.

lastly, companies go broke because their staff don’t work hard to keep their jobs? what a joke! do you think company will keep staff that are unmotivated or not committed and like it drag them down? Geez, uncommitted staff only lead to their own dismiss and not to a company’s dismiss.

I am surprised that so many of you here rejected the idea of unemployment benefit.

Most developed countries supported the idea though of course their taxes are much higher.

I often wondered why we collected so much GST (7%)? I heard that it is into the many billions per year yet I saw very little was given to the poor and needy.

We built super highways that costs us $1 billion a kilometer and plunged into loss making ventures by Temasek and GIC. If only one percent of the losses make by GIC can be re deployed to deserving breadwinners, I am sure many people will live in dignity and self respect when they are jobless.

Once again, my call is for the govt to come up with new initiaitives besides the upgrading slogan repeated many times throughout these years.

Many jobless will live a tough life for the next few months and I am afriad that some might even take their own lives out of desperation.

I have a friend whose husband committed suicide during the sars crisis. He was a banker and laid off for a year without a job. He leapt off a building one bad night and that was the end of him. Of course, besides the financial issue he also suffered from a bad case of loss of esteem and confidence.

oh talking about who responsible for creating jobs …..

USA Obama just mentioned in the news he aims to create 3 000 000 . 00 jobs when he starts office.

wow! a cool 3 million jobs just like that, from the horse’s mouth, so-2-speak. it takes a confident and capable person to be able to make such a promise. He knows that if he fails to deliver, the Alternative party, ie. Republicans would come after him. On the brighter side, a strong Alternative party keeps Obama and his party on their toes which in turn translates into better service to the country USA.

From what Obama said, I take it that he holds himself responsible for creating jobs for his people. A People’s president ?

Unemployed with stomach empty, yet all ears are full with these theoretical statements:

Teach those who learn themselves
Hire those who employ themselves
God help those who help themselves

Till death do us part with all these theories.

43) Gilbert Goh on January 6th, 2009 11.41 pm

Does anyone know when was the Reserves ever used?
Does anyone know under what condition will the reserve ever be used to help the people?
Is there a known condition where the Reserve will have to be used? Minimal criteria is what?

I also feel that some welfare should be given to retrenched middle class higher educated and skilled workers. This crisis affected the middle class more than the last crisis, as i understand.

But can our super elites dare to commit such jobs to the people of singapore? wait long long OK, you die your business! and if they cannot deliver what they promised, then they start finger pointing and blame on others and the citizens. Whats new in our country, the same old shits all these years.

The UK Government recently unveiled a new welfare scheme to help the unemployed to continue having a roof over their heads by paying for the mortgage interest (up to £200,000 per house) for 2 years. Will the Singapore government unveil a similar scheme to help the retrenched to finance their HDB loans so that at least Singaporeans who lost their jobs will still have a roof over their heads?

No government can be long secure without formidable opposition.
- Benjamin Disraeli

When you are young – study until no play liao
When you are adult – work until your health liao
When you are old – pay medical bills until your $ “liao”

Belinda

Ya i agreed with you that this current recession hits the PMEs more than the blue collared.

It is sad that due to various reasons, the PMEs are often marginalised when it comes to welfarism.

In overseas countries, there is no criterion for people seeking welfare aid. It is almost cutting across the board and most people affected can claim unemployment benefit.

Unless the govt has a good check and balance system I am afraid that they will continue to rule us with an iron fist.

I foresee more unemployed coming into the picture and crime rate will spike up as people rob or steal in desperation.

Many families will also break up as financial issues took a toll on us all.

Children will be affected by the financial issues that hit their families.

Homes will be repossessed by the hundreds as we struggle to pay our mortgage loans.

Bankrupts will increase as banks recall loans by the thousands.

Companies will close down by the thousands as the recession reins it’s ugly head.

Our ministers will sadly still be paid millions though as the people suffer…

In reply to post 40

> i juz have 1 concern. remember the time when 1 guy asked about whether oil price when dropped the hiked transport fare should be lowered ? remember somehow reply included things like you want free transport and GST increase ? <

That is fine.

It is a minister’s prerogative to answer such queries any which way he likes, but he has to be responsible and pay the due price if the answer lacks substance or if he fails to deliver a clear and satisfactory explanation.

If the answer is dismissive or confusing, still record it as so in the section that I suggested to TOC.

With a compiled list from many of the MPs and ministers, perhaps it is possible to study if they have any favorite way of dealing with questions from the public.

When the next elections comes, the people can get to read the standing record of the type of answers their elected A team office holders gives to them in a complete archive for the last 5 years.

Then there is a better chance that the electorate can open their eyes and vote wisely.

If the MPs and ministers are worth their salt and live up to the people’s expectations, hey, this service may even help them boost their votes.

Gilbert,

I advocate for unemployment benefit as this is the only way to provide for a safety net in this time of need.

Many PMEs though well paid hardly save up for raining day. Maybe this is also our own fault as we are a nation of upgraders.

You have articulated exactly why the focus should be on the lower-income folks instead of the PMEs. Reason is very simple: they have been having it good all these years. While they were earning more, they should have saved money instead of buying their cars and condos. So your point that unemployment benefit is the ONLY way to provide a safety net is WRONG; the other way is for them to have saved up money while the going was good as their safety net. Now, those who didn’t pretty much deserve what they get for their lack of prudence and foresight. They have no one to blame but themselves. If they have to suffer, they suffer; the Govt should only come in, at the same point where it currently comes in for the lower-income folks. No reason to give them preferential treatment.

Given the seriousness of the current crisis, there is no reason for the Govt to give them preferential treatment. The lower-income folks have suffered for a long time and we haven’t even quite “solved their problem” before this recent crisis hit.

It is not the role of Govt to ensure that people’s standard of living do not fall in times of crisis. The Govt should be there to ensure a minimal standard of living and to ensure that there are opportunities for those who work hard to climb out when the recession is over.

It is sad that due to various reasons, the PMEs are often marginalised when it comes to welfarism.

This is nonsense. The criteria for welfare benefits has nothing to do with profession. They are based on income and wealth. A hawker who earns say $100K a year is as unlikely to qualify for welfare as your PMEs. :-P

from panter92 “Let’s say, your hero/idol Tan KL was NTUC chief and decides to implement generous welfare benefits for unemployed and all those in need of it. What will happen then? People won’t bother to work harder in order to keep their jobs. Companies go broke. Taxes increase in order for the state to finance the welfare expenses. I don’t think I need to elaborate further.”

my opinion on your comment… generous is a blurr… if i earn $1000 and the unemployment benefit is $5000.. i might look forward to loosing my job…

but if i am earning $5000… and unemployment benefits is like $1000… do u think i will not work hard to keep my job?

anyway… i am all for helping those people who loose their jobs… if we need to give them monthly allowance for a certain period of time, then we should.. we cannot expect them to go and steal to support their families… not too much of cos..

i dont mind paying extra taxes when i am earning more knowing that if i ever loose my job, i would get some financial support… if i never ever loose my job, that would be the best thing for me and my family…

I think PMEBs might have benefited in the good years but they were also bearing the brunt of the tax burden for a long time now since a large proportion of Singaporeans apparently don’t need to pay income taxes.

I would like to see singapore create 3 million jobs like Obama, the great.

Not to mention being “forced” to buy more expensive properties as they are “earning too much” to buy cheaper ones.

I am glad that today’s ST reported that the govt initiative SPUR programme will cover more courses. Nevertheless, there is no real details on what these courses are.

What are the 800 courses that Mr Gan so advocated today? Are they are over lapping courses that cover mainly hospitality or healthcare industries? Not much details were provided so far.

I still feel that nothing much hs being done for the PMEs in terms of providing support and tangible help.

This time round the unemployment affects the PMEs more than the blue collared.

Unless the unemployed rise up I wonder if their silent cries will fall on deaf ears.

51) smallvice585 on January 6th, 2009 11.54 pm
The UK Government recently unveiled a new welfare scheme to help the unemployed to continue having a roof over their heads by paying for the mortgage interest (up to £200,000 per house) for 2 years. Will the Singapore government unveil a similar scheme to help the retrenched to finance their HDB loans so that at least Singaporeans who lost their jobs will still have a roof over their heads?

No lah, they just send you a letter to attend court and then slap you with another fine, the judge will not want to hear your explaination and only ask you “Do you plead guilty or not?” NEXT!

Frankly there is no solution, just ask yourself and you will know the answer.

This so called solution will be repeated 10 years later, We pay millions and we can broken record playing the same old tune over and over again.

Its the same like saying 1st world govt, golden period. etc , etc

[...] Please also read our report Disappointed with NTUC chief’s top 3 priorities. [...]

do you know that there a minimum special account in addition to the minimum sum? Then there are 2 limits for the medisave account? you need to get your Medisave above both the limits to get some money out.

Have anyone ask themselve if these scheme really help them or simply pay more interests into the account help them more?

Why the complexity?

How is one going to plan for his retirement under such volatile rules?

It will be funny if the board can give us an idea how much an average Singapore can get out the system after he retires. How much a worker (average) will get under the schemes?

Do we have to end up paying a lot of cash for our root top etc?

Why is the government hoarding all this money for?

Why are they going to use it for?

What are they going to do with the excess in return for?

In exchange for a lower of medisave / special account interest rate, the government actually increase the limit therefore increasing our ability to withdraw excess savings? is that normal?

If our government is that rich, why are they doing all that?do you know that there a minimum special account in addition to the minimum sum? Then there are 2 limits for the medisave account? you need to get your Medisave above both the limits to get some money out.

Have anyone ask themselve if these scheme really help them or simply pay more interests into the account help them more?

Why the complexity?

How is one going to plan for his retirement under such volatile rules?

It will be funny if the board can give us an idea how much an average Singapore can get out the system after he retires. How much a worker (average) will get under the schemes?

Do we have to end up paying a lot of cash for our root top etc?

Why is the government hoarding all this money for?

Why are they going to use it for?

What are they going to do with the excess in return for?

In exchange for a lower of medisave / special account interest rate, the government actually increase the limit therefore increasing our ability to withdraw excess savings? is that normal?

If our government is that rich, why are they doing all that?do you know that there a minimum special account in addition to the minimum sum? Then there are 2 limits for the medisave account? you need to get your Medisave above both the limits to get some money out.

Have anyone ask themselve if these scheme really help them or simply pay more interests into the account help them more?

Why the complexity?

How is one going to plan for his retirement under such volatile rules?

It will be funny if the board can give us an idea how much an average Singapore can get out the system after he retires. How much a worker (average) will get under the schemes?

Do we have to end up paying a lot of cash for our root top etc?

Why is the government hoarding all this money for?

Why are they going to use it for?

What are they going to do with the excess in return for?

In exchange for a lower of medisave / special account interest rate, the government actually increase the limit therefore increasing our ability to withdraw excess savings? is that normal?

If our government is that rich, why are they doing all that?do you know that there a minimum special account in addition to the minimum sum? Then there are 2 limits for the medisave account? you need to get your Medisave above both the limits to get some money out.

Have anyone ask themselve if these scheme really help them or simply pay more interests into the account help them more?

Why the complexity?

How is one going to plan for his retirement under such volatile rules?

It will be funny if the board can give us an idea how much an average Singapore can get out the system after he retires. How much a worker (average) will get under the schemes?

Do we have to end up paying a lot of cash for our root top etc?

Why is the government hoarding all this money for?

What are they going to use it for?

What are they going to do with the excess in return for?

In exchange for a lower of medisave / special account interest rate, the government actually increase the limit therefore increasing our ability to withdraw excess savings? is that normal?

If our government is that rich, why are they doing all that?

why do a kachang puteh buisnessman
or a hawker/taxi driver
must topup their medisaves
before they can renew their license?
what does medicsaves gotta do with business/roc in the 1st place?

I think ultimately the biggest mistake made by the government is depending too much on foreign consumption. PM Lee once said for every $1 spent, 60c goes to out of Singapore, thereby indicating that domestic consumption ain’t gonna help much.

Every 5 years, the government only listen to Singaporeans during election day, we are totally ignored for the remaining 4.999 years…

juz to touch on the issue of saving jobs,
I feel that CEOs should be paid as high as they FEEL they deserve.
Why i say that : if they resort to compensating themselves via the backdoor, aka Fraudulating, the whole company may dive into serious financial trouble. I relate to the case of indian listed firm whose founder was found to have frauded and its share price skyrocketed the other way, causing stress to its employees who fear losing their job due to company performance or the lack of it.

I think, if this founder was paid millions more per month, he might not have fraudulated. alas! its too late now. but my only worry is how many more millions will satisfy a person? after adding 10 million more, will that Satiate his hunger which relates to his Ego?

Always understand law of demand and supply, see how Americian’s politicians gracefully transist powers.

All Singaporeans are subject to competition with Work Permit, S pass and E pass holders(Respectively $600, $1800 and $2500) and those who hold great powers don’t subject themselves to competition and that why we are in the state now.

Our world class enterprises can’t even win the competitions in electronic manufacturing with the Taiwanese not less with world class enterprises like Apple or Microsoft. Our hardskilscan’t beat the Chinese and our softskills can’t beat the Indian, so what are we now? I really don’t know, still hoping for more good years! Ha! Ha!

“All Singaporeans are subject to competition with Work Permit, S pass and E pass holders”

while I understand what you r talking about,
i like to correct you that Not All singaporeans are subjected to that.
About 1 % of them. when u round it off.

lim ss said

“…we are against retrenchment as a 1st resort…”

>>> can you comment on what you have done in response to retrenchment by DBS? what real effect or protection can come from NTUC when companies retrench as a 1st resort?

71)

At least now the govt is trying to assist those professionals who are being laid off by offering job counselling and support group activities.

So far, the PMETs are excluded from alot of such govt assistance.

I only hope that relevant courses offered can help them to propel on.

In Australia, many laid off professionals move on to uni to get their second degree or post grad courses almost fully paid by the govt. They will get a leg up by the govt compare to ours who always advocate that we are fully self reliant.

One wonders why we have the govt for then?

@65
They fail to announce their losses of hundereds of billions of national assets. No one knows the exact figures and can only estimate.

Thats where all your monies are going to help make up for.

The problem is not Singaporean don’t want to work and depend on Government. It is an employer market and with large supply of Foreign Talents couple with downturn, Singaporean with or without Degree can’t find decent Jobs.
Had applied for Civil Service but they only look for people below certain age!
We don’t need to argue anymore, this is fact of average Singaporean in 2009!
Pls challenge my statement if any disagreement!