This article is from The Times Online. We highlight it here for discussion. Read the full article on the Times’ website.

Why should marriage plus kids equal happiness? A Post-Modern Spinster makes her case for life without marriage

Kate, a married friend, said to me in that kindly patronising tone reserved for mad old women and naughty children: “Don’t you think it’s time you stopped running around like a middle-aged teenager and tied the knot before it’s too late?”

“Too late for what?” I thought – a lifetime membership of Ikea and a man who is going to turn from Mr Perfect into Mr Sulk/Unfaithful/Slob within two years.

The truth is, while wedded bliss is great for some women, there are those of us who are not cut out to find a man, marry and reproduce. I am 43, unmarried, without a child and I am not crying myself to sleep.

Why should I? This is not the 19th century: I am not going to freeze to death in a workhouse. Nor is it the 20th century: I am not going to write an angsty desperate-to-be-married Bridget Jones-style diary or worry about the biological time bomb.

Continue with the full article here.


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51 Responses to “On the joys of being a spinster”

  1. pugdragon 16 February 2009

    That’s the way to live our lives. To have individual wants & goals in life. What other people are trying their best to achieve may not even be what I want at all. People, especially Singaporeans, should shed the “herd-following” mentality. You wanna get a degree, get a good job, get a car, get lotsa money, get married, retire with comfortable amount of funds? Go ahead, if it’s what you want. It’s wrong for almost every Singaporean to think this is the “correct” way to live a life.

    Personally, I feel being a holidaymaker & exploring different countries is way more fun than the “prescribed way of life” in Singapore.

    Reply
  2. It’s human instinct to find a lifelong mate, not herd instinct.

    Who knows why some people are unable to build deep, emotional relationships with others, and fear the loss of “freedom”? It’s a me-first, short-term mentality that smacks of an unwillingness to compromise and adapt to other people.

    Everyone has the right to make their own choices in life, but I wonder how many of the die-hard singles still feel this way when they get too old to settle down and start a family?

    Reply
  3. Zefly (aka Joshua Chiang) 16 February 2009

    I happen to love Ikea. :(

    Reply
  4. LOL kate. 43 is too early to tell. It is not too late to conclude at the age of 55. Not cut out to marry, have children? Seem like a excuse to me. By the time you are old and desperate, any man will do. By then, it is people that choose you not you choose people. Please wake up lah.

    Unless one day, reproduction is purely manfacturing process in the hospital to meet the demand of country needs. Until then, having a family and someone you can share your life with, is part of the meaning process of life. Once there was a man tell me this. You can be very sucessful in business and life. The sucess is only half truth if you have not rise a family and take care one.

    ikea? Used to like that place, but I think you are just not paying for the worth there now. And mind you, it is not cheap at all.

    Reply
  5. I like the article and the meaning it convey to readers :-) It really begs the Qs on why r we marrying and why do we wana have children? Do we do all of these for sake of doing it or do we really find it meaningful for our lives?

    esp this sentence (in the article) that corresponds to my reasoning n experiences: “happiness depends on what you consider to be personal contentment”

    To each his/her best. no right or wrong form of lifestyle a person shld engage in as long as it is conducive towards his/her personal growth n becoming a fully function human being :-)

    Reply
  6. It’s an individual’s choice to get married or not. I guess it depends on our perspective of life/world and the experiences we go thru tat make us decide. But some people marry because they see others marrying. While others say they wan their legacy to live on or thenext generation to carry on. But the question is after you are gone, your next few genartions, will they even remember who the @#$ you are!. They get on with their own lives ..some may even be cursing you..If their lives are good maybe the will remember you..if bad they would be cursing you.
    When you look around the world as to what is happening well do u wan to bring another life into this world? Life is good but the world is BAD. Murder, killing, pain, illness, disease, poverty, homelessness,sorrow, anger , hate, backstabbing…the suffering is more than joy. Are we in this world to suffer?Just take a look at this world. Have we changed in any way? This is 2009. Since caveman’s time until now have we human beings really changed? Yeah, the world has changed – better technology, medicine, houses, transport system and so on. But we human beings are actually still the same since caveman’s time. Caveman’s kill & will do anything to survive. They are barbaric. We are the same ..only we use modern weapons&means. It doesn’t mean when we wear modern clothes & with new technology we have improved. Our attitudes have not changed. We are still like the caveman ..surviving. Not living. When u wan to survive u will do anything to survive. When we live that’s life. In this world when we have not changed our attitudes, still cling to caveman’s attitudes, what right do we have to bring another life into this world..knowing very well they too are going to come into this world and be like one of us as they will learn from us the art of survival not of living. We are repeating a cycle..this cycle must be broken ..our attitudes must change, world where there is love for one another, peace & truth. Then we will have created a world where we know our future generations will live peacefully and so we go forth & multiply..

    Reply
  7. correction 17 February 2009

    marriage plus kids plus french cooking lesson equals happiness!

    Reply
  8. Plesae lah 17 February 2009

    Please lah, I don’t think it’s a human instinct to find a life long partner, I think it’s a human instinct to want companionship.

    Please lah, Is having a good job, having house, having a car, having a family, being married, having kids something you really want? Or something society wants out of you? Or something people wants out of you?

    People follow their own choices, if they want all these, by all means go ahead. If people want to stay unmarried, by all means go ahead. They may change their mind later if they feel that having a family is something they want.

    If you really know what you want, by all means go ahead. Please don’t fault people for doing what they wanted and say they must do this and that. So there’s no right or wrong if a person wants to start a family or stay unmarried.

    Reply
  9. smallvoice585 17 February 2009

    I think this article by Post-Modern Spinster is a pathetic piece of self-consolation and self-deception. If she were to meet a wonderful man tomorrow, I’m sure she’ll jump at the chance to marry him.

    Sane and still in demand? Choosing a go-it-alone existence? Forgoing the traditional family way by achieving happiness in your own terms? Freedom to pursue personal goals and fulfillment and time for travel and fun? Ha! Why think of so many justifications? More likely, PMS is feeling uncomfortable in her shoes.

    I think we humans over-estimate ourselves in being able to make independent choices for our lives. If we go through the pros and cons of marriage vs single-hood, ultimately it boils down to this – deep down we feel that it’s natural to marry and reproduce. Just like the animals. Yes, just like them – after all we are a mammalian species driven by instinct. And this survival instinct to reproduce has been written in our computer programme – our genes.

    And to make sure that we obey our genes, we are made to feel a sense of happiness and contentment when we are with our family. Instead of rebelling against this human instinct and fate, I think we should embrace it.

    Reply
  10. aiyoyo

    this is not bad an idea, but old age not sure how? (export to neighbor land?)

    anyway if got $ think anything is ok la..

    if this country birth rate drop

    think ELITEs got to import ‘new FT blood’

    by the way, since ELITEs so $$$, how about they make more new blood?

    aiyoyo

    Reply

  11. (some) Readers here may not be ready for this type of discourse. Or was THAT the point of bringing this topic up?

    Those who say she is wrong might be in knee-jerk reaction mode – typical of the indoctrination of our education system (moral values, family unit, and other such keywords). Plainly, it is up to her how she wants to lead her life and she has not asked anyone to follow suit – just to stop bothering her and respect her wishes.

    The point of the article is alternative perspectives should be respected – something lacking here in Singapore, isn’t it….

    Nicely done there TOC!

    Reply
  12. hansolo:”Who knows why some people are unable to build deep, emotional relationships with others, and fear the loss of “freedom”? It’s a me-first, short-term mentality that smacks of an unwillingness to compromise and adapt to other people.”

    Some would say having your own deep, emotional relationship isn’t too different from the ‘me-first’ mentality you brought up.

    Just that the ‘thing’ you are chasing is different. You want a relationship, others want different things. In the end, both are still a ‘me-first’ mentality.

    Reply
  13. lobo76: Just that the ‘thing’ you are chasing is different. You want a relationship, others want different things. In the end, both are still a ‘me-first’ mentality.

    Getting married or starting a family is about compromises and sacrifices, others now come first.

    Singles can do whatever they like on their whim and fancy. They fear the loss of their freedom. Hanging out with friends is enjoyable but doesn’t have the deep connection of a life partner.

    That is what I meant by their “me-first” mentality. I don’t care what others do with their lives, it’s just grating to hear their excuses and forced justifications. Dressing it up in fancy acronyms doesn’t change anything.

    Reply
  14. Marriage is a personal choice. If you decide to marry and are happy with that, that’s fine. If you decide to remain single and are happy with that, that’s fine too. There is no need to be apologetic being single.

    The author’s article sounds defensive. It would have been better if she had explained what are the benefits she enjoys as a single, rather than lamenting that she is not “cut out” for marriage – or subtly taking a dig at her married female friends.

    In all, the article sounds more of a sour-grapes single lady, rather than a true-blue fun loving single woman who chooses to remain single.

    Reply
  15. To smallvoice585:
    Sure, one can meet the most beautiful person ever, fall in love and hope to live together happily ever after …
    Of course, life seldom turns out like that. More often than not, couples who fall in lust at first sight only remain together when they discover that care, commitment and a certain sense of responsibility (as when children come along as a result of lustful bliss) is what it takes to keep the relationship going.
    How wonderful it is to enjoy a night of bliss with a new-found friend and lover. How difficult it is to say goodbye after that first lovely encounter. That’s why many of us continue with the relationship. Most get married … and some, alas, regret taking that fateful step. They divorce. Some go on to find happiness with new partners.
    My point is this: We all search for happiness. Some, just some, achieve it within the comfort of a union with another person. Many stay within the relationship even though they may not be that happy. Many others prefer to stay single and take their share of happiness as and when it comes.
    So, to each his or her own. Be happy, don’t worry too much.

    Reply
  16. smallvoice585

    Why so judgemental? Why can’t you respect the views and lifestyles of others? And not put them down?

    Maybe STOMP and PAP website are yr natural sites?

    Reply
  17. wat4stay 17 February 2009

    i would think ultimately, it’s each individual’s happiness.

    if they are happy being unmarried, why not? as long as no one else is hurt in the process. there’s no need to impose one’s ideology on another.

    Reply
  18. Lightning Strikes Again 17 February 2009

    The world population has double in the last 40 years and in the next 100 years, half the world will live with shortage of food..

    I say it is ok to be single and childless if that works for you.

    Reply
  19. hansolo: “Getting married or starting a family is about compromises and sacrifices, others now come first.”

    that’s it… may that’s the ‘thing’ (compromises and sacrifices) you are into. It’s the same why some people thing pain to be pleasurable. (i know that it is not fair equating ‘compromises and sacrifices’ to pain).

    Or the ‘thing’ you are into is companionship, family, and you are willing to pay (compromises and sacrifices) for it. It’s not unlike a single paying (companionship) for freedom.

    The article just seems like someone who is sick and tired of being asked the same question again and again. Remember when you were young, and every Chinese New year, relatives will ask when you have a gf/bf or when you are getting married? It gets tiresome after a while.

    Reply
  20. Lobo

    If you going to bring that that “me-first” attitude into a relationship, it doesn’t matter if you are woman or man. It is gonna failed and ended up nasty. Therefore, by arguing that both remaining single and going into marriage is a “me-thing” is very much a weak one. I think that is the reason why the M word sound like going to hell for you.

    Hansolo did not disagree with people who want to go solo, but don’t give excuses just because you have a few failed relationship in the past. It is the solutions not the problem that make people wiser. Strange is that, no one explain why his/her past relationship failed. If our parents were to think like what this articles wrote, I suspect none of us would have been here to even start a argument.

    Are you also saying that if your boss give you a difficult tasks, then you better quit the job and remain jobless? Success and failure is part of life, does not matter if it is work, family, friends, children etc. If it seem so difficult for a person to commit in life, yes my answer is that go ahead and remain single. Don’t make that U turn when thing don’t work out right. In life, some thing has no second take. But if you do have a chance, I hope you do it correctly this time.

    Please cut the crap about freedom thing. When you want to be loved, learn how to love first. There isn’t anything “me-first” in a relationship.

    Reply
  21. My wife and myself enjoy each other companion alot. Both of us is stubborn and sonetime I am unreasonable. Most important, admit that you are wrong when you are. But of course you need to know that you are wrong in the first place (most people simply refused to admit that). Ask why the government failed to realize that they are out of touch with the people? The answer is very much nearer than you think. Just look into the mirror!

    Now we have a 6 months old baby, and there will be another soon. Do you know how much happiness she bring to my family on day to day basis? Everyone want to bring the moon down to her. Her smile, laughter and unhappiness is so truth with even slight pretends. You can get this from your friends? Your friends will remain single forever? They don’t get sick, they don’t die, the don’t have their own personal problem? Come on……

    Remain single by all mean, my children might end up bad in the future, yes maybe. But not if I can help it now. And if he/she became bad, well, that’s because I have failed her and myself as a father. “me-first” my ass, you need to make that first step out of your house to buy something if you are hungry. Just because it is troublesome I simply refuse to eat and say it will make me fat?! What a joke.

    Reply
  22. Correction:

    Truth without slight pretences

    Reply
  23. smallvoice585 17 February 2009

    Dear Riddler,

    I’m not being judgemental to Post-Modern Spinster. But I would like to point out the underlying reason behind her conflicted feelings – which is that,deep down despite the false bravado she puts up, she feels a sense of inadequacy and incompleteness.

    I believe it is pathetic to continue with this self-deception. Most people here are ambivalent and accepting of both marriage and single-hood and most people are afraid to give their opinion one way or the other for fear of causing offence. If 0 degree is OK and 180 degrees is also ok, no discussion can proceed.

    I’m obviously for marriage – not because my spouse is the most perfect being nor because I derive happiness from it. Marriage is just one of those major life experiences that you should not deprive yourself of, whatever the outcome of it. It is one of the projects in life that you put in much effort and you’ll enjoy the ride. Happiness has nothing to do with it – in fact, happiness is not that important, but having the complete life experience is.

    Reply
  24. smallvoice585 17 February 2009

    Dear RED-man,

    I applaud you for speaking the truth. Experience teaches you the truth!

    Reply
  25. Please be positive in life. Marriage or single both has it’s advantage. Like what smallvoice said, life is a learning curve. Marriage and have a family complete this learning curve. While the married people can see the prospective of being single (since they were once single before), the experience in marriage cannot say the same for single.

    Final straws of life would be, looking back in the past, you have no regret with your children, wife, work and friends is where life has come to a full cycle. Every part of your life prepares you for the next until it ends.

    Next time when you ask what is the meaning of life, ask how much you tried first and how much affort you put in. You want to put the seads into the soil and expect it to grow on it own and enjoy the fruit later? Also must be sweet? You must be joking. It is very fundamental.

    What really chill me to the bone when I read the comments for this articles, almost 80% of the people hold the same mindset. I think the world scienists better start research on how to manufacture human. Maybe for some here, might want to consider watching the movie “family man” by nicolas cage.

    Reply
  26. Lobo

    Again I want to point some error about your comment, how can single be paying with companionship when in the first place they find it troublesome to have one? Equal to pay nothing right?

    On the other hand, when a person go into a marriage, or companionship, he/she has to pay every single day. Financially or emotionally. What “me-first” are you talking about? Seriously, it seem that you are a very emotionally insecure person from your comment reaction to hansolo. Maybe, you want to do some work in that area. It might improve your life.

    Reply
  27. RED-man,

    I think you are defining the me-first altitude too narrowly. That’s why all your examples are like Lim Swee Say’s, only 2 choices.. (shoulder the difficult boss or be jobless, remain hungry or buy something to eat).. see the similarity to (Job Credit scheme or cut in CPF)?

    me-first is about your ultimate (can be long term) joy… not just the short sighted thing you seemed to be thinking. For a child, it may be about rearing a most wonderful child bring joy to YOU (aka me-first); for a wife, it would be companionship with YOU (aka me-first), despite some difficulties for both in the short term.

    This sentence seems very me-first by the way
    “You can get this from your friends? Your friends will remain single forever? They don’t get sick, they don’t die, the don’t have their own personal problem?”

    See, you are very into companionship, and that is your ultimate me-first goal.

    ———————–

    And smallvoice’s me-first goal is Complete Life Experience.

    ———————-

    It’s the same rationale I apply to people doing charity. I do not think altruism really exists. If at the end of the day, they don’t feel ultimately positive about doing charity (regardless of short term hardship), would they still do it?

    Reply
  28. RED-man
    “While the married people can see the prospective of being single (since they were once single before), the experience in marriage cannot say the same for single.”

    I think there are Singles who were divorced, so your statement is not necessarily true.

    “Final straws of life would be ..”
    be subjective. It will be different for each and everyone. By pre-defining and following the ‘cycle’ of life, it is why some would call this herd mentality.

    “Next time when you ask what is the meaning of life…”
    again, your very limited examples. meaning of life should be about what you want, followed by if you tried. etc, etc. You seemed to have skipped 1 step.

    “What really chill me to the bone when…”
    people have ‘a’ concept of happiness, and think everyone should be the same.

    Reply
  29. bechalorboy 17 February 2009

    This kind of articles would never see the light of day in our MSMs
    because they have a duty to promote govt policies like encouraging women
    to give birth to more babies .
    We have become just a digit for the govt grand designs for the economy.

    Reply
  30. Single who divorced and you call that married. That i said is going into marriage not knowing the purposes. And yes Lobo, already mentioned to you so many time by me, hansolo and smallvoice. No one is changing your mind, you are the one that is in defensive mode.

    Say as much as you like, it is your life not mine.

    Reply
  31. Your mentioned to hansolo already betrayed you by saying: the single had to give up companionship to stay single and enjoy life.

    1. Now if you really enjoy being single, why bother about giving up companionship?

    2. Or are you saying, why this world so like that? I want companionship but don’t committment mah, why my partner kept asking me when to get married?

    Reply
  32. If that is not “me-first”, I don’t know what is?

    Reply
  33. pugdragon 17 February 2009

    smallvoice585 quoted “Sane and still in demand? Choosing a go-it-alone existence? Forgoing the traditional family way by achieving happiness in your own terms?”

    Forgoing the TRADITIONAL family way? Yes, why not? We need no “prescribed” ways to live a life. We should not be constrained & think “inside the box” only. Not to live our lives based on what we are told or what many people believe to be “normal”. Every individual has the right & need to be different & to want something different in his or her life.

    Somehow, the word “traditional” goes along the line of “old-fashioned” to me. & we’re in the modern world where humans have seen many new things & acknowledge each & everyone’s unique differences.

    Reply
  34. Shoo-shoo 17 February 2009

    i hv two kids too, whom i love tremendously. i enjoy their company and are wonderfully amazed at watching them grow up.

    but i can also see kate’s point of view. i see a lot of my frens being able to pack and travel at the drop of a pin, splurge on anything they want, and experience the kind of fulfilling dreams they have.

    i say, to each his own. marriage, parenthood or singlehood – none is a bed of roses.

    Reply
  35. smallvoice wrote:
    I’m obviously for marriage – not because my spouse is the most perfect being nor because I derive happiness from it. Marriage is just one of those major life experiences that you should not deprive yourself of, whatever the outcome of it. It is one of the projects in life that you put in much effort and you’ll enjoy the ride. Happiness has nothing to do with it – in fact, happiness is not that important, but having the complete life experience is.

    well smallvoice, not to disregards what you have wrote based on ur experience and reasoning. what you wrote is ‘true’ only valid in ur own reality. i have nothing against marriage nor singlehood (though i still favor freedom). yet what you have missed out and overlooked is the point made by the author of the article. similar to yours, she is entitled to an opinion of her own.
    you seems to b making inferences (using ur personal experiences and reasoning) abt the whole of human nature based on what she wrote; whether u have or have not notice that.

    i tink this is v.offending and short-sighted to generalize all mankind based on one’s experience. a person’s sense of self and ultimately his/her behaviors are so complex to be simply put into words..other factors that are likely to influence one’s thoughts and behaviors include personality, childhood experiences, society, genetic and unconcious (if u believe in it) etc.
    what i agree w u is that we seek to live a complete life. or in other words a fulfilling life regardless of the pain n suffering our choices may bring to us along this fulfilling process. i tink the author is living to be a complete, fully functioning human being like u n me in this world but in our own unique ways. cheers to mankind for our diversity :-)

    Reply
  36. Hummm…. lets see.

    1. What is TRADITION?
    2. What is Old thinking?
    3. What is Old fashion?
    4. What is think out of the box?

    Some of the thing find in the modern day has already been done by the ancient (Such as make-up by Egyptian).

    So you think you are 前无古人 后无来者? What you are doing is consider “out of the box”, “up-to-date” etc etc. Well, for so many years human has been very much advance in thinking contrary to what most people think. If not, you will not have the computer and internet to do this discussion now.

    Wait! Are we really advancing? What about pollution, Climate change, diseases, world war, atomic bombs etc etc? We may very much become our own maker one day. What’s my point? The point is, there are some order in life that cannot be changed. When by nature it is dictate that man and woman have sex will then reproduce, there is no “otherwise, but, if”.

    “Otherwise” would have the outcome of aids, when man intercourse with ape or man (I mean, these people also think out of the box what?). Say what you like, we are old thinking, one-way traffic. I am very sure your future will reveal itself in the end. There is a saying, “NO MAN IS AN ISLAND”, those that think he/she can become Robinson Crusoe, I do hope you find your Friday someday. Cheers

    Reply
  37. RED-man,

    I thought we were just voicing our opinions on this issue. I just have an opinion on why the women wrote that article and the rationale behind it.
    For you to label me as defensive when we are just ‘talking’ about an issue, shows that you are being ‘offensive’… (I meant in an ‘attacking’ sense). Maybe I should label you as defensive about the values of being marriage then? lol

    2. Or are you saying, why this world so like that? I want companionship but don’t committment mah, why my partner kept asking me when to get married?

    I am saying why this world must have a fixed pattern of living? Is it the only pattern to live a life? When people talking about alternative ways to live a life, they are being labelled as defensive?
    from your post, you have already ‘fixed’ how life should be (companionship must be with one fixed partner only). When others give alternative lifestyles and how it can be enjoyable, you people become defensive of your lifestyle, and attacked that person by saying THEY are defensive… oh.. the irony. ho ho ho.

    If that is not “me-first”, I don’t know what is?
    I think you lost your way in this discussion…-_-”’
    My position is that ALL lifestyle is me-first. The Single lifestyle is a me-first (I have never said it wasn’t), but so is the marriage lifestyle.

    To me, marriage is like … 5Cs. Good to have, but okay to don’t have. Life can be rewarding with the 5Cs too. It’s not the only way to measure your ‘success’ in life.

    p.s to be truthful, I am not For nor Against single or married lifestyle (nor am I imply there are only these 2 options), just that I like to take the opposite side of any debate/discussion. Usually, I take the side that opposes the ‘standard/tradition’ stand, or that of the majority. hehehe.

    Reply
  38. Plesae lah 18 February 2009

    > The point is, there are some order in life that cannot be changed. When by nature it > is dictate that man and woman have sex will then reproduce, there is no “otherwise, > but, if”.

    Didn’t you just pointed out the contradiction? Yes, man and woman have sex. That is biological instinct. Yes, this is an order in life that does not change. Will then reproduce? Depends.

    Being in a marriage (one partner of the opp sex for life), that’s one of a human social constructs. This is not an (absolute) order in life.

    I think it’s great if you have a fulfilling marriage life. It is also great if you have a fulfilling single life. Of course, and all the shades in between.

    What society (govt & people) imposes on us is what society thinks is the better good for everyone. Whether it is true or not, depends.

    Point is, don’t fault people for having a different lifestyle than you.

    Reply
  39. Share with the people here a story some elderly man told me 6 years ago. a story about a Fish and Turtles:

    Turtle being able to move onshore and offshore was able to see both part of the world as compared to the fish. One day, the turtle told the fish, if you ever see a strange creature thy walk on two legs, please do not bite on the baits thrown to you. The fish laughed at the turtle and simply ignored what the turtle said.

    On one occasion, the fish saw a worm a immediately bite on it. He was eventually lifted up by the man and that was the first time the fish release what the turtle was saying. Lucky enough for the fish, while the man try to release the hook, he slipped and the fish went back into the sea.

    The fish quickly went back to the other fishes and warn them about the human. Somehow, however hard he tried, not a single fish believe him. Now, moral of the story?

    When people are ignorance, there is no problem keep spinning with them. Let them go taste it themselves. Like what Hansolo had said, myself also wonder how many single can stand the test of time especially when they found that age is catching up with them, disco, pub and friends seem to be getting further and further away from their life. Well, maybe if you are rich it will last you abit longer. So, how many of these singles can get old rich? The way I see it, try to avoid going along with the herds? Do you have what it takes to be special?

    Truth is that, in the animal kingdom, the one that left the herds usually die faster. Just like any so-called strong government that suppressed their people and choose to get out of touch from it’s people. Down the road, they are always the LOSER.

    Reply
  40. some people are just too selfish to commit for their family

    Reply
  41. Correction:

    1. Fish realized what the turtle trying to say.

    2. There is no point kept spinning with them (already can see where it will be heading anyway).

    Reply
  42. RED-man

    Fish and Turtle story…hahaha..
    reminded me of the Cat and mouse story told by the minister.. forgot which one was it.

    Reply
  43. Referring to: Please lah

    Enlighten me, why there are so many of us come to TOC to FAULT the PAP? So maybe we should close down TOC and stop FAULTing people right.

    Some people who choose to be a crown, will always stay as one. No reply required for people like that.

    Reply
  44. Crown as in king of fools, making fun of people only to make himself look like a idiot and childish. Now we know why the relation failed.

    Reply
  45. Sumiko Tan – where are you?????

    Reply
  46. #23

    Isn’t this a judgement and put-down on yr part?

    “which is that,deep down despite the false bravado she puts up, she feels a sense of inadequacy and incompleteness”

    Live and let live so long as the life style of others do not hurt you.

    Reply
  47. lobo76

    “just that I like to take the opposite side of any debate/discussion. Usually, I take the side that opposes the ’standard/tradition’ stand, or that of the majority. hehehe.”

    I m Just curious to koe that have you ever been sceptical abt what you personally believe in and question your own stand too?

    my defination of ‘stand’ is the knowledge, experience which constitute how u look and behave towards issues as well as others.
    do you, urself, question ur personal knowledge and ideas abt the world ard u ?

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  48. zj,

    when something i experience or see, make me question my stand. yes.
    until then, no. I will not, out of the blue, reexamine my beliefs.

    Does this answer your question?
    I would give some example… but it’s time to go home! ;D

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  49. Well, to me, love is something that comes along, really internal and nothing to do with social expectations and baggage. But it gets really sensitive when one wants to start a family, for it tends to pull all external factors, parents, relatives, money, status, etc… sometimes traumatising if environment is hostile.

    When any bond between a couple ceases to exist, I guess our society (in my opinion) is generally happy for the relationship to be dissolved. It is democratic in a way that you have the right to choose who to love, whether or not to love, and the right to choose whether to legalise your marriage (accordance to prevailing regulations), democracy is like a marketplace of choice.

    Its only that government is trying to ‘pile’ their own version of ‘values’ upon people that worries me. Their attempt feels half-handed (not thorough, rash and weak, for it was not thorough) and it also does not really address the fundamental material and ideological concerns for the well-being of the citizens.

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  50. hi all, just want to add one last perspective to the discussion.

    It’s not just about the me-first attitude, but also the short-term thinking. The die-hard singles look at what they lose in the short term:

    freedom
    money
    time
    opportunities

    But they don’t realise the long-term benefits of a stable relationship:

    contentment
    family warmth
    companionship

    So good luck to all, may you be happy with your choices.

    Reply