1. Ancient China considered itself the centre of the world and called itself the Middle Kingdom. And well it should. It was far more advanced in every way than Europe of the Dark Ages. Maybe China is thinking of making a comeback.
2. But we already have a new Middle Kingdom now. During Lee Kuan Yew’s triumphant visit to Malaysia he made it known to the Malaysian supplicants that Singapore regards the lands within 6000 miles radius of Singapore as its hinterland. This includes Beijing and Tokyo and of course Malaysia.
3. Of course this self-deluding perception places Singapore at the centre of a vast region. It is therefore the latter day Middle Kingdom. The rest are peripheral and are there to serve the interest of this somewhat tiny Middle Kingdom.
4. Kuan Yew also explained that the fear Singapore Chinese would control Iskandar whatever is not justified. Malays can also work there. It is good to know that Malays can also work in their own country. I wonder as what? Maybe someone should make a study of the Malays of Singapore just to know what it is like to be a Malay minority in their own country.
5. As for the 3 sen per 1000 gallons of raw water supplied to Singapore Lee says it was absurd for the former Prime Minister of hinterland Malaysia to ask to increase it to RM8 per 1000 gallons. I don’t know where he got this. Some Malaysian officers did suggest this figure but we were ready to bargain and maybe settle for RM3. And why not? Johore sells raw water to Melaka for 30 sen, 1000% higher than to Singapore. And Melaka is, I believe, a part of Malaysia! Some Malaysians may see the irony of this.
6. The great 5th Prime Minister has decided that since the people of Johore did not want to sell sand to Singapore, Malaysia would not build any bridge, straight or crooked, or negotiate and settle the other issues like the Central Provident Fund, the Railway land. Maybe the 5th Prime Minister thinks he is punishing Singapore. Actually he is giving Singapore what its wants including the 3 sen per 1000 gallons water until 2061. Think of how many grains of nasi lemak we can buy with 3 sen in 2061. Imagine what 1000 gallons will earn for Singapore at that time. Can’t think of a more astute PM for Malaysia.
7. All those who met the great man from the little country were lectured on how Malaysia should be run. We should not have anymore problems now. We have been told the direction to take. MCA must help UMNO to win because Singapore does not want an Islamic Party like PAS to win. We must ensure this. Sorry PAS. Working with the DAP, the offspring of PAP has not endeared you to Mr Lee.
8. I have a lot more to say about this little Emperor but I will reserve it for later.
A loser tends to become an angry man. The world rates LKY highly compared to the petty and egoistic mamak. Mahathir will do everyone a favour by keeping quiet but instead he never fails to sabo his successors, his country and his neighbours. Only racists and his cronies would support Mahathir’s views.
15) T
If I may add,
The existence of the railway land, slicing through the island, was a farewell gift from the British when they “de-colonise” Singapore and Malaya. They literally left part of Malaysia inside Singapore.
The Points Of Agreement on the Railway Land provides for a “maximum period for the railway station to be moved from Keppel, that is within five years from the time the MRT reaches Woodlands New Town, which it did on 10 February 1996.
Now is 2009. The KTM have been “illegally squatting” here for over 13 years liao.
to Student,
“I think LKY is a gentleman”……..can you elaborate why you think so ?
“he uses his intellect to help S’pore”…….really ? do you mean he helped S’pore remain a fake democratic system which has fooled many ? lol
“you are ungrateful and possess a closed mind ” …….because I disagree ?
then enlighten me, who should I be grateful to and does a person who question a leader and his system actually has a closed mind ?
Did you learn that in school ? or are you really a student ?
#50) KopitiamApek
‘Now is 2009. The KTM have been “illegally squatting” here for over 13 years liao.’
……………………………………………………………..
Former Malaysian Finance Minister Diam signed the POA which was rejected by Mahathir when he returned to Malaysia. Singapore was to compensate them with two parcels of land in return for the railway lands. It was not revealed why Diam signed the POA in the first place. Was he awe-struck when he faced LKY? Why did they reject the POA? I think they believe they lost out too much in the bargain.
To this day, M still mentions that the Malays in Singapore suffer as a minority in their own country. He still thinks Singapore belongs to the Malays. The railway land is their valuable bargaining chip. They can squat there forever.
#51) self serving leaders
Please don’t be too harsh to Student. As a student he has learnt his history well: LKY indeed has built Singapore into a prosperous country which you have benefited from. Now he feels you are ungrateful. He also learnt that LKY is helping Vietnam, China, and those countries that value his wisdom. Maybe LKY is assessing whether Malaysia values his wisdom before helping them.
As a student, he didn’t know much about LKY when he wrote that he is a gentleman. I quote from a magazine article which is also applicable to this gentleman – “He used every conceivable instrument of the state, every trick in the book to stack the deck in his favour and against his opponents”
Gentleman – a matter of relativity – between Mahathir and LKY, most westerners will find LKY more acceptable and admirable. Mahathir have been called all sorts of names so the comment on LKY is considered mild. Both are shrewd and power seeking politicians who and have no qualms about crushing the opposition, sometimes overdoing it.
I congratulate student for making a simple straight forward point. Why are all the ‘adults’ hammering the student for making a simple point from his heart? Come on this is blogging and we are here to hear from each other’s opinion and not steam roll your personal agenda.
Be objective.
On railway land, it can only be there for a thousand years and only for the purpose of operating a railway.
they went there, shake hands,enjoy fine culture before recce recce and their king, a few days later, shot the idea down.
the king quite smart hor?
55) Thinktok
Being objective is not one of the qualities some posters here at TOC possess. Being emotive and resulting in irrational postings, and attacking any views that deviates from their view. Being in a permanent state of frustration, being in the state of mind as one who is victmised by the whole societal system, blaming somebody else for all the things not going on well in their personal life.
So they will naturally find it extremely challenging to hear from each other’s opinion and not steam roll your personal agenda.
In a movie (forgot the title) conversation between Tom Cruise (as a military investigator) and Jack Nicolson (role of some big shot military guy)
TC: Give me the truth, now!
JN: You can’t handle the truth
55) Thinktok
///On railway land, it can only be there for a thousand years and only for the purpose of operating a railway///
You are correct. The 1918 colonial ordinance allow the use for purpose of operating a railway for 999 years.
The POA superseded the 1918 colonial ordinance
The entire issue should be located in a broader historical context. Malayan Railway land, covering over 217 hectares and stretching 20-30 kilometres into Singapore territory, was acquired under a 1918 colonial ordinance specifically for use by Malayan Railway (Keretapi Tanah Melayu or KTM) for a period of 999 years. That same ordinance limits the use of this land, of which the main railway station is situated on prime land.
However, under a separate bilateral arrangement on 27 November 1990, known as the Points of Agreement (POA), Malaysia and Singapore decided to depart from the 1918 Railway Ordinance to facilitate joint redevelopment of the Tanjong Pagar Railway Station and the lands adjacent to the track owned by KTM.
Malaysia’s subsequent reluctance to go ahead with the 1990 agreement was based on the fear that it might eventually be forced to give up proprietary control over some or all of KTM’s land in Singapore
the POA is a Government-to-Government agreement between Malaysia and Singapore concerning railway lands in Singapore. It was signed on 27 November 1990 between then Prime Minister Lee Kuan Yew on behalf of Singapore and then Minister of Finance Tun Daim Zainuddin on behalf of Malaysia. Under the POA, the KTM railway station would be vacated and moved from Tanjong Pagar to Bukit Timah in the first instance. The land at Tanjong Pagar would then be vested in a limited company for joint development (60% for Malaysia and 40% for Singapore). All railway lands south of Bukit Timah other than Tanjong Pagar would revert to Singapore. When the MRT station reached Woodlands, and that took place on 10 February 1996, KTM may within five years, move its station from Bukit Timah to a site in Woodlands adjacent or close to the Woodlands MRT station. In that event, two additional pieces of land in Kranji and Woodlands would be vested in the limited company also for joint development. All other railway lands south of Woodlands other than Tanjong Pagar, Woodlands and Kranji sites would revert to Singapore. The POA was explicit that there will be no other compensation for Malaysian railway land outside the three big pieces at Tanjong Pagar, Kranji and Woodlands.
Now is 2009. The KTM have been “illegally squatting” here for over 13 years liao.
“Being objective is not one of the qualities some posters here at TOC possess. Being emotive and resulting in irrational postings, and attacking any views that deviates from their view. Being in a permanent state of frustration, being in the state of mind as one who is victmised by the whole societal system, blaming somebody else for all the things not going on well in their personal life.”
ahh..kopitiamtiamahpek..whu tok tok u must poke poke people with that comment hah?
what you imply hah? u very objective ah? people not agree with u or garbermen are neuratic or erotic ah?
i think hor, you mouth smelly smelly need drink more liang char /not kopi/ before posters lausai at u then u know.
“Being objective is not one of the qualities some posters here at TOC possess. Being emotive and resulting in irrational postings, and attacking any views that deviates from their view. Being in a permanent state of frustration, being in the state of mind as one who is victmised by the whole societal system, blaming somebody else for all the things not going on well in their personal life.”
are you implying you are very objective and others who disagree with you or the government are neurotic or erotic?
i think you need to stay away from kopi and drink more liang char before forumers squat on you.
a very typical pap style. can’t win, demonize others and anyhow brand people as …psychopath. ah pek, you aright or not?
59) tehahma
60) whacko
Thank you both for providing evidence for my post @ #57
to Thinktok and Student,
I have read through all the comments and I am truly surprised the replies to “Student” are considered hammering when it called for “Student” to elaborate. This is what you have claimed and you are not objective.
I also feel your insinuations about the intelligence level of the Malaysians is uncalled for. I do have many bright Malaysian class-mates and friends.
32) sand
Sand is abundant on this planet. Very true.
It is the cost of transporting it.
Currently we are getting the sand from Vietnam, so that drives up the cost.
Interestingly, years back, some middle east countries toyed with the idea of towing and shipping icebergs from the north pole to solve their water problem. Same problem there, transportation cost make it not economical. I also wondered how they prevent it from melting.
the down and out don’t need sand kicked in their faces. ah pek, you are the evidence of your own insecurity.
Keep on ranting. Taz all you can do, other then stab yr successors, for licking up to S’pore?
Ask yrself why they doing this? S’pore has the $$$$.
Anyway, M’sia has for. Remember the founder of Malacca? He sucked up to China because iit was to his adv to do so?
So shut up and go awat.
58) Kopitiam Apek
Thanks for the very insightful posting. I have confidence that they are correct. So if the POA overrides the 1918 colonial agreement then it is a matter of time Singapore will put its foot down.
There are some loosers in Singapore. Because they loose a hawker’s licence, or got summons for parking on double yellow line, they turn against the authority. Very shallow indeed.
I am going to Hawaii for a month holiday. If I get a computer I will continue my posting, if not, I will just enjoy.
clap clap clap. we need more people to stand up for coffee spiller.
see ahpek, i helped your popularity. :)
66) Thinktok
Hey, Kim Jong Il is aiming his ballastic at Hawaii, no?
But then, no worries lah, it’s probably a US boogieman.
Thanks for your advice. Kim Jong Il with so many test firings had literally disarm itself. Korea is full of hot air, the US is just playing along.
Singapore needs a ‘Kim’ so we don’t have a reserve to quibble about. No one to throw darts at! Everyone will be so poor and hungry that we will not have computer to start with.
62) another student
Why must student elaborate while the rest of the ‘negatives’ don’t have to elaborate.
Regarding malaysian intelligence, I am not insinuating that they are low. I am saying Mahathir’s intelligence is above the average malaysians that is why he can get away with half truths. Please don’t put words in my mouth.
I am not even saying the national average intelligence of malaysians is high, very high or super high. All I am saying is that MM average intelligence is higher than most malaysian. Anyway this statement is from the Malaysians themselves.
So please keep it at that and don’t escalate
68) Thinktok
///Thanks for your advice. Kim Jong Il with so many test firings had literally disarm itself. ///
Yes. You made a good point. Never thought of it that way. True. They probably run out of ammo : )
Just hope Us will not use this as a excuse for a launchpad to start another gruesome war in Asia.
Anyway, many decades from now, Kim Jong Il will be remembered for his unique hairstyle.
68) Thinktok
///Everyone will be so poor and hungry that we will not have computer to start with.///
The darts-throwing people here is a by-product of success
Hokkien say “chia pah buay pow”
Don’t know they are having it so good
Like fishes do not know water, until it is out of it.
History repeat itself Remember the moustache
fella called Hitler Now we have this guy
with a funny hairdo Kim If he is mad and
has hallucinations he may just land a big
one in Hawaii and let some Americans go
first before he does soon And we have this
mad fella across the causeway who
cannot differentiate fact from fiction He
is not in power but behave he is It takes
great craft and minds to deal with such
people Fortunately we have the leaders….
Yes?no?
The world have change since the middle kingdom. We want to be the middle kingdom in term of innovation and creativity. If kopithiam ah pek can sell nasi lemak to 2 billion people at $1, that $2 billion.
The fear is due to their past leader. They have been putting down Singapore in the past to get elected and Singapore economy keep getting stronger. If the people do not understand the truth, fear is the natural response.
If we can make a money at Iskandar, I rather do it 6 miles away than 6000 mile away. Think of all the carbon dioxide we put in the atmosphere.
Mahathir’s deed will be record in history and history will not be kind to him.
We been running rings around him for 30 years, who won’t be mad?
Anyway, let me work on my super duper nasi lemak recipe. If 2 billion people tucking into my nasi lemak, they will not be fighting each others.
To Dr. Mahathir,
It was presumptuous of you to think Badawi will listen and follow when he was the Malaysian PM. Learn from LKY, nothing beats having an obedient son as PM and a daughter-in-law to help run state funds.
You are shrewd Dr. Mahathir, but LKY is still the master in the art of hoodwinking.
LOL
That Mahathir has nothing to loose already. His hatred for Singapore will be remembered. We must have offended that guy. Maybe for not lending/giving him money during the last world economic crisis. Charateristic of free old man is ,usually they got alot of time to reflect back on old days, naggy and hard headed.
Fight lah, fight lah. Activate reservists lah. Not good enough to take over train station ah?
In the financial crisis his son was in deep financial trouble. Mahathir tried to borrow money from Singapore to bail out his son and country, but Singapore wants to charge interest, ask new water pact etc. Mahathir forgot he is dealing with Singapore and got furious as in Malaysia borrow money no need parliament to know, no need for collateral and no need to explain.
Australia call him a ‘recalcitrant’. Only in Malaysia he can survive. Singapore is a small resource deprived country and Malaysia is well endowed. Yet he has no heart for Singapore’s predicament and want us to sink.
Should we grant him his wish?
how to bypass the malaysian railway laws bypass?
is singapore lacked of brilliant legal eagles
or is singaporean too dumb to have a good legalgitor in hands?
i know how to berhenti the malaysian railway tracks in 1 phrase/sentence
yes malaysian railway tracks land do belon to ktm inc
without a doubt
HOWEVER
the railway tracks do NOT include lands that cut across the railway tracks
and LTA should have known better
afterall LTA is great in issusin summons in side road/desker road/johore road and buslanes
lta by law can closed any roads that cut across the malaysian railways tracks if IT WANTs to
remembered angmokio
singapore technologies flatted properties
lta already closed a few road and designated it into singapore tech ince ah kong road
just liked oxley rise
so is DARE a problemo in closing the roads that can prvent the malaysian railway tracks from cuttin across?
the answer my fellow singapooriums
is
aye aka mai or mai aw nia…………..
[i]Student on June 20th, 2009 6.59 pm 45) Only a bigger fool like you will think that LKY think all S’poreans are fools. I think LKY is a gentleman and he use his intellect to help Singapore and any country that values his wisdom. You are ungrateful and possess a closed mind.[/i]
indeed you all har
never even thanked leekuanyew personalLEE
without him today
who else can be our prime minister?
he scarified so much for you singapooriums
that he send his belove son to led singapoor out of poverty
you all are lucky
leekuanyew didnt send in moses or david marshall to be the prime minister
also without leekuanyew 2nd son
today you ungratefool singaporeans would not have cococola to drink @ all
most probadLEE you all had to drink oliver lum urines suomemore
last but not least
without leekuanyew scarified his one and only daughter
all the younger childrens would have to be born from kranji turb club stables
somemore only on 1 day per year
december 25th….
lets all cheer for leekuanyew
may he visit jesus early…..
>On railway land, it can only be there for a thousand years and only for the purpose of operating a railway.
whahaha, I invade ur house & I will only invade for 80 yrs and only for the purpose of staying free at ur house
An eminent Malaysian sharing his insights on the difference between corrupt and efficient government.
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/opinion/breaking-views/30040-lee-kuan-yew-keeps-corruption-at-bay–tunku-abdul-aziz
Hi Jones #86,
Thank you for alerting us to this Interesting article by Tunku Abudl Ariz.
I like what he said about Singapore vs Malaysia particularly: Lee Kuan Yew is far from perfect. His record on human rights and media freedom is well-documented, and there is not a great deal to choose between his and ours. We should wipe off that feeling of smugness.
However, I think the main purpose of Tunku Abdul Aziz’s article is to advocate the Malaysian Government to do something about corruption. It is not meant to be a praise for Singapore or Lee Kuan Yew.
85) toiletmatter
There was no invasion. Singapore belongs to Johore once and to Malaysia a second time. But an agreement is an agreement and we have to respect it.
Anyway the original railway agreement has been superceded by mutual consent under the POA. Malaysia is trying a U-turn but we have to leave it to the professionals to decide.
83) malaysiatidakboleh
///the railway tracks do NOT include lands that cut across the railway tracks
and LTA should have known better
lta by law can closed any roads that cut across the malaysian railways tracks if IT WANTs to
remembered angmokio
singapore technologies flatted properties
lta already closed a few road and designated it into singapore tech ince ah kong road
just liked oxley rise
so is DARE a problemo in closing the roads that can prvent the malaysian railway tracks from cuttin across?///
Are the roads that cross the tracts KTM land or our land?