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From Reuters:
LONDON/SINGAPORE, June 3 (Reuters) – Singapore state investor Temasek sold its stake in British bank Barclays Plc (BARC.L) several months ago at a big loss, people familiar with the matter said on Wednesday.
After spending over 1 billion pounds ($1.7 billion) on shares in Britain’s second-biggest bank in the last two years, unlisted Temasek may have lost over 800 million pounds on the investment, according to calculations by Reuters.
Temasek’s loss is in sharp contrast to Abu Dhabi which sold more than 11 percent of the bank’s shares on Tuesday, making a $2.5 billion profit in just seven months.
Temasek sold its near 2 percent stake in December and January, two of the sources said. The sources asked not to be named due to the confidential nature of the investment.
“It’s true that they sold in December/January,” a person familiar with the deal told Reuters.
It is further evidence that Temasek is shifting away from banks, after it lost about $3 billion on an ill-timed investment in Merrill Lynch.
Read the rest of the Reuters’ report here.
From the Straits Times, June 4:
Temasek and Barclays both declined to comment when contacted by The Straits Times Wednesday. A Temasek spokesman said: ‘We don’t comment on unsourced reports.’
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Under Lee Hsien Loong’s leadership, this is an honest mistake and we should move on. If you take Temasek’s total profit from when it was first conceptualized, losing billions is peanut.
I think we have too much money here and the people mismanaged them badly.
No oone seems accountable here and that probably is the reason why the mistakes kept repeating itself.
Though they have make billions previously, the losses are much more than the gains combined.
Sad day for Singaporeans…
what to do…many claimed that we have given them the mandate to rule us. It’s too late to demand real accountability now.
Let’s move on
It’s ok. Just stay cool. Sometimes a loss is gain to `some’ people if you know what I mean. It’s how you channel things. BUT, someone is watching. You can run but you cannot hide. You may think you are invincible. Hey, think again!
The gain? where are they? The lost, keep it a secret after all sooner or later the citizens are going to pay for it, so ? what’s their next step be? win over another term and all those losses will be made back, singaporeans are all nothing but true suckers of the century.
after all they’ve already get HC out of TH to safe ground so nobody is going to answer for it except the new appointed ang mo chap taking all the blame, so family happy ever after . . . . .hip hip horray!
with the continual of losses this way, singaporeans can now kiss your ass and say goodbye to all your cpf monies, nothing will be left by then, not even for your coffin will be spared.
I advocate for a CPIB probe on this and the series of related losses that ‘Corporate’ Singapore faced in the last 18 months.
Was there any mismanagement and mishandling involved?
Who were involved in the decision making?
Were the decision makers qualified to make decisions?
Who were involved in appointing the decision makers above?
Was the appointment transparent? Were there enough notification for competetion of places? Was the waiver of competition clause used? If Yes, what were the justification?
At the very least the details of all related losses should be audited and compiled without interpretation and be made available to the public.
worried that after election, there will be more increases in whatever we have to pay now which already hard for us to substain.
Gee, another long term investment bites the dust.
And the camel-riders show S’pore how to make money. And MM, PM and SM keep lecturing the sons of the desert that they need S’porean expertise.
The dynamic trio must be living in a parallel uniiverse.
As so far astronomical loss, all reserves and assets of what we have for last 50years are just almost wipe out. Amazingly, none of the people responsible for the loss is accountable . Uniquely Singapore.
Look, the NMP and NCMP can raise whatever voice against GST increment, but without power to vote, we can start preparing for GST 13% to account for the someone’s honest mistakes. Vote those GST out…
In USA, Fed Chairman has to face Congress, Treasury Secretary has to face Congress, GM, Ford, Chrysler has to face Congress to answer for their actions.
Here, who do they face when they lose billions, husband and father-in-law.
We should all just read Reuters / AFP and other foreign news agencies instead.
What good is ST if it doesnt even print NEWS???? LAPDOGS!
hush hush indeed…there’s a chinese saying: Papers cant wrap fire!
The amount of dirt being swept under the carpet will soon be taller than mt everest.
what is scary is that Tharman was in parliament explaining the losses and this was not even mentioned.
Is that a dereliction of duty?
I believe there is enough data for the opposition parties to put up a case in the next general elections to score some upsets. If their analytical engines are intently pursuing data, highlighting the findings from General Household Survey 2005, the upcoming statistical release on income and expenditure and the snowballing deterioration that follow would perhaps be a good strategy tp start. I believe the opposition should aim to steer at least 50% of the discussions away from municipal (town council) politics such as sheltered pathways and lift upgradings. This should be left to civil societies (not sure which one but it should happen soon).
However, the information must be made palatable to the average Singaporean and not like a political science or economics thesis. Without such seriousness, it will be difficult for the opposition to expose the ‘mollycoddled’ men in white.
If we had a free press, proper checks and balances, debates on policies rather than hush hush shut up and sit down MIW knows best, then ALL these losses might well be prevented! NO???
Can someone pls tell me once more that democracy and civil liberties is not needed?
12) ram on June 4th, 2009 8.03 am
Face congress once only…
face husband and father-in-law also scary you know… and furthermore got to face everyday,… imagine kena f**k and black face every dinner time, also very sian one you know? :)
reporter: “have you really dispose those bank related investment?”
temasek: “Temasek invests with the objective of delivering sustainable returns over the long term.”
reporter: “I repeat, have you really dispose those bank related investment?”
temasek: “we report our portfolio returns not just for a single year, but for various time horizons”
reporter: “can you come straight to the point and tell us if you really dispose those bank related investment?”
temasek: “This move to balance risks against opportunities is part and parcel of our discipline of investing and divesting to deliver sustainable long-term returns on our entire portfolio.”
reporter: “Hello? Can you tell us how much have you lost?”
temasek: “We are mindful of the risks we face as we invest”
reporter: “#*$%, can you just give me a direct answer?”
temasek: “We reinforce this risk-return balance through a compensation framework which puts the institution above the individual, emphasises long term over short term, and aligns employee and shareholder interests for both the upside and downside, over the medium and long term”
reporter: “#$*@^%&, I give up!!!”
Are those involved in the continued losses of the nation reserves subjected to ISD, these are monies belonging to the people of singapore you know.
It would be good for Sporeans to know what are the total gains versus total lost since the day Temasek and GIC started their investments. If the sum total minus all that were lost still shows hefty gains in their total investments, then I think it is only fair to say that the ROIs of their total investments are satisfactory. Profits and loss are part and parcel of any investments, hence TH and GIC should not be afraid to show Sporeans what they have gained and what they have lost. This would be more transparent to all.
Losses, LOSSes, LOSSES……
very hsian leh.
But how much is the TOTAL COMPLETE ABSOLUTE L O S S for the ENTIRE PORKFOLIO?
How is the People’s future gonna be affected?
Zero effect? sure or not????
Temasek and Barclays both declined to comment when contacted by The Straits Times Wednesday. A Temasek spokesman said: ‘We don’t comment on unsourced reports.’
Can they sue Reuters for this? or should I put it ‘Do they dare to sue Reuters? for publishing this untrue story . . . .
Those people employed by Temasick and GIC are there to buy and sell “things” from the financial markets and are paid $millions in terms of salaries, perks, allowances and bonuses every month/year, with perhaps other incentives too (such as housing loans, scholarships, grants and club memberships).
They collect their pays, perks and bonuses every month/year and are only too happy to simply just buy and sell, irrespective of whether they make a profit or a loss on the taxpayers and citizens’ money.
Worrying Questions:
1. How are their performances assessed? On what basis?
2. How do they get appointed and/or promoted? On what criteria?
3. How do they get rewarded/punished? On what basis?
4. How do they get their bonuses, allowances, perks and even housing loans (as in the case of Dr Ong Seh Hong when he was working for GIC, before joining Ren Ci Hospital), etc.? On what basis?
5. How do they account to the people whose money they are using to “buy and sell” financial products in the name of “Long Term Investments”?
I believe this news is intended to relate “Singapore’s Temasek sold Barclays stake-sources” to a financially literate audience. Any comparisons and evaluation of Temasek’s loss is inappropriate. For example,
“Temasek’s loss is in sharp contrast to Abu Dhabi which sold more than 11 percent of the bank’s shares on Tuesday, making a $2.5 billion profit in just seven months.”
Why compare absolute returns when the capital outlay might be vastly different? Furthermore, why compare investments across different time frames? Abu Dhabi’s investment ended 6 months later than Temasek’s. It probably started at a different time. Why not look at the growth of capital over a similar time frame?
The answer, of course, is because the point of the news is to inform that Temasek sold its stake in Barclays. It wasn’t meant to be an evaluation and comparison of Temasek’s performance.
What to do, this is their playground, they can do whatever they like. Anyway, why can’t they just admit the investment is a big screw up…a big mistake and hiring people with short sights. The M of F worst, giving the same excuses as the one when town council lose money because of Lehman Bros. Can he give a better excuses. He is obviously not explaining the main reason why why why the 2 SWF is losing loads of money. “GURU” is right about the reporter, hahaha. As the chinese saying goes, “WEN FEI SUO DA, DA FEI SUO WEN”
25) tiredsingaporean on June 4th, 2009 10.03 am
“Temasek and Barclays both declined to comment when contacted by The Straits Times Wednesday. A Temasek spokesman said: ‘We don’t comment on unsourced reports.’”
Unsourced reports?
I thot I saw CNA ticket taped last nite about this boo boo?
But tiredsingaporean, they declined to comment because they can do so.
so, what are mere mortals gonna do?
I know, lets move on.
#19) If only
‘ Can someone pls tell me once more that democracy and civil liberties is not needed?’
…………………………………………………
The diehard 66% of the electorate will still believe in the PAP. The percentage maybe lower at the next GE but the PAP will still get 97.6% of the seats in parliament.
I hope I am wrong.
another buy high sell low..just how STUPID can our SUPER TALENTED highflyers get? sigh…maybe LHL will add another 9 after this
[ Temasek sold its near 2 percent stake in December and January, two of the sources. ]
Guess who was CEO then? The one who got the labour award. The way Temasek is run, it’ll take less than the 5 years mentioned by LKY for Singapore to be ruined. Now we know why the CPF minimum sum just went up.
31) Edward on June 4th, 2009 10.09 am
“The diehard 66% of the electorate will still believe in the PAP. The percentage maybe lower at the next GE but the PAP will still get 97.6% of the seats in parliament.”
Let define this 66.6% clearer – it is Not Based on the entire population of voters.
It IS based on ONLY those who are not in Walkovers. And how many of these are in Walkovers? A LOT.
But I fear many singaporeans still do not clearly understand this and Assume there IS so many supporters as they may have assumed it is based on the entire population of voters.
Likewise, 33.3% may be a substantially large proportion, it is only based on the same ‘principal’. As with every election, the rules change.
Only when ALL Voters get to VOTE is the percentage MEANINGFUL as indicator of Actual Level of Support.
Sadly, I dare say no one knows how many support or want the system to Change as for the last many elections, not all voters are given the chance to vote.
#11) Daniel
‘Look, the NMP and NCMP can raise whatever voice against GST increment, but without power to vote, we can ……………………………………….’
………………………………………………
We must thank a Mr Png Eng Huat for his letter ‘Only an elected opposition can cast a vote of no confidence’ to the ST on 2/6/09. The NMP and NCMP scheme is to discourage more citizens unhappy with a undemocratic PAP from voting in more opposition members into parliament. As revealed by LHL during a 2006 GE rally the PAP wants the number capped at 10.
The PAP is afraid to accept the Proportional Representation MP system as practised in Thailand because the opposition MPs will definitely increase beyond 10.
Anyway, it will be many more GEs away before the the opposition can secure at least 43 seats to cast a vote of no confidence even if the PAP becomes corrupt and ineffective.
lol…no wonder year after year..we see the minimum sum rising….looks like when it is time for me to retire..the minimum sum will raise to maybe 500k? All in the name of inflation? I beg to differ. More in the name of their incomptencies.
Anyhow, this place is so special…I mean where’s the accountability? I think Tharman telling us that TH made alot of money is not good at all. Should he be telling us about how they are going to deal with the losses? It is uniquely singapore :’(
Another major fiasco! well, ain’t it funny….the one who claim success and lead us into more golden years seems to be the one that bring up down the hill of failure….changes needs to come before singapore is ruined
Oh, the Oracle of Omaha will sure try to stay on the opposite side of the world from TH since TH is the opposite of his investment policy
if we continues with huge losses, i think we can kiss our money good bye. Ho Ching what the hell are you doing?!
What has our president got to say about this massive losses of Singaporean money? Hello…can someone wake him up, he can be heard snoring, at istana, even from my home. Somebody head must go. This is a serious capital crime (by china standard).
http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/sub/…35909,00.html?
Abu Dhabi sells Barclays stake, gains US$2.5b
Move raises fears other big investors may also cash out
(LONDON) Abu Dhabi sold more than 11 per cent of Barclays, making US$2.5 billion from an investment that helped the British bank through the financial crisis and raising fears more may cash in on a recent rally in bank shares ……….
Comapring at how the Middle East smart people with Temasek, results show.
BOA and Barclay loss is a shame.
They are contrast!
hongjun
Free News for ALL to see :
http://www.scotsman.com/business/Singapore–sold-Barclays-shares.5332637.jp
“Temasek’s loss is in sharp contrast to Abu Dhabi which sold more than 11 per cent of the bank’s shares on Tuesday, making a $2.5bn profit in just seven months.”
Wow, congrats to Abu Dhabi. Excellent talents there.
#34) No One Knows Actual Disapproval rating
“The diehard 66% of the electorate will still believe in the PAP.”
…………………………………………..
This is a general statement as during the past few GEs the PAP got about two-third of the total votes. From SMC results, I believe the real diehard PAP supporters is about 40% which PAP candidates in PP and Hougang easily obtained while the diehard Opposition supporters is about 20% which one opposition party member managed to obtain even though he did not actively campaign.
So, the PAP needs only to obtain about 10% more votes from the “fence-sitters” while the Opposition has to work three times harder. Of course, there are many other obstacles for the opposition.
Look at the report at :
http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssFinancialServicesAndRealEstateNews/idUSL334812220090603?sp=true, and it’s true also that Aby Dhabi can make a gain from the shares of the same bank ?
Declining to comment is not an option. It’s giving the impression that the organisation and policy makers don’t even know how to explain the loss (1 level lower than making a loss and being able to explain it).
So just as the finance minister used the period 2003 to 2008 to explain a $56b gain (is this a matter of selecting an appropriate period to illustrate a gain), if we start the clock from 2008 to 200X, we would be making a huge loss by now, right ?
#21 Guru..
I had a good laugh…thanx…
How come Tharman did not mention this..and now it has leaked….
Lets all Sing….and do a Dance….and we will forget it…Can HC come up with a song PLEASE…hahaha,,,
bunch of jokers…got no idea how nature’s law and economics work.
funny how Abu Dhabi…made money and Temasek is losing money….terribly
I just want to know who bought the shares…and is gaining now…..
SINGAPORE: Finance Minister Tharman Shanmugaratnam has said any view of Temasek’s track record as an investor should not be based on any individual transaction but on how it had performed over the years.
Speaking in Parliament on Thursday, he said Temasek had grown by a net S$56 billion over the course of the boom-and-bust market cycle that started in 2003.
Source: Channel News Asia
Mr. Finance Minister, may we ask, if Temasek is transparent enough to provide all information with regards to investments all these years?
Where is the accountability after all these major losses?
If assuming there are profits gain? Where is it being disperse to? Who benefits from it?
Or is Temasek creating an environment for a few individual to pocket super big pay checks and sucking dry our reserves?
Even after all these losses, you are still trying to comfort us with previous unsubstantiate gains. Is the government going to conduct an inquiry with regards to all the losses?
If it wasn’t for ‘a mole’ that leak this disturbing information on Barclays, won’t we be kept in the dark?
I guessed the departure of our beloved HC was so timely that she won’t be put in anymore limelight.
What is the governance of this country becoming?
All your Singaporean borned and bred sons and daughters.
Many of whom worked hard for the country are being displaced by cheaper migrant new Singaporeans that have not even held an M16 before.
We are in dire straits, is the gov’t really helping the citizen?
We are in need of aids right now!!!
I believed most TOC readers here saw Lim Say Swee singing the off-beat chinese song in some Union’s event. We do not need circus act and spinners. We need real calibred and compassionate MPs who can understand what is the real situation on the ground.
Should we be grieving, or should we let the matter rest? Let’s really give it a thought!
It’s good to cut loss. Well done.
We still have hundreds of billions left so it’s ok to lose only a few billions
I think it’s a good decision made. I’m proud of them cutting losses. It’s pain but it’s shiok after you cut and lose only a bit of money. At least there is no need to see it sink anymore. If they want they can anytime buy again now since it’s still cheap from the all time high. If they double up now they may have chance to double or triple the profits. Green shoots is real so better buy now than wait till it double or triple again then buy I think
The time has came,
please wake-up Singaporean.
Before it too late……..
Tax payer money,
Is Our money,
No body responsible for it.
I believe if we look at the long term performance of Temasek, they have made billions and billions and billions of dollars. Hence one has to look into long term and not short term contra losses