Your statement hits the jackpot. Very true.

///but which country in the world has managed to eradicate poverty, injustice and exploitation completely?///

None, to the best of my knowledge. It exists in an ideal world only

//The fact is that there were lives lost as a result of a crackdown directed by the government on protesters who were largely unarmed. Rather than using a using a disproportionate amount of force (tanks on humans), is there a better way to control the situation which may be getting out of hand//

One could say the same about the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki – wasn’t there a better way of dealing with it than killing so many civilians in such a horrible way? Did the subsequent rise of Japan as an economic power (2nd largest economy in the world today) justify these killings? One could argue even if they had not dropped the bombs, Japan would eventually have surrendered, but on what terms?

As for Tiananmen, depending on which reports one reads, the student protestors were given time to vacate the Square and they did so. The killings (whatever the scale) did not occur in the Square. I am not defending the Chinese government’s actions (whatever they may have been, depending on which version of events one reads) but one needs to put events in context. Economic reforms, like democracy, work well only in a stable society. If China had descended into chaos, would the economic reforms have worked? Or even implemented? Yes, the reforms have not resulted in better conditions for all, but which country in the world has managed to eradicate poverty, injustice and exploitation completely?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d8C4AIFgUg

“War,
What is it good for
Absolutely nothing

war, I despise
Because it means destruction
Of innocent lives

War means tears
To thousands of mothers eyes
When their sons go to fight
And lose their lives

War, it ain’t nothing
But a heartbreaker
War, friend only to the undertaker
It’s an enemy to all mankind
The point of war blows my mind
War has caused unrest
Within the younger generation
Induction then destruction
Who wants to die
Listen to me

war, has shattered
Many a young mans dreams
Made him disabled, bitter and mean
Life is much to short and precious
To spend fighting wars these days
War can’t give life
It can only take it away

Peace, love and understanding
Tell me, is there no place for them today
They say we must fight to keep our freedom
But Lord knows there’s got to be a better way

War,
What is it good for
Absolutely nothing” -Edwin Starr

///. If the Chinese economy do not grow at more than 6% there is very high risk of social unrest.///

Some says 8%.

///Singapore’s children has no such problem.///
And some grow up ranting here on TOC

The lyrics of the song by this child singer is meaningful:
Tell Me Why- Declan Galbraith :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg_MxONabNc

Pardon me if I sound over-zealous in chastising the Chinese government for its role in the “Beijing massacre” and its attempts at justifying its actions. I may sound too emotional, though I doubt anybody can blame me when we are talking about loss of lives here.

We can question the way we bring forth our arguments, the simplicity of our thought processes and the limitated understanding of this incident, however simple or as complex as you suggest.

The fact is that there were lives lost as a result of a crackdown directed by the government on protesters who were largely unarmed. Rather than using a using a disproportionate amount of force (tanks on humans), is there a better way to control the situation which may be getting out of hand? I may not be an expert on crowd control but from an ethical point of view, I will never agree that state directed violent crackdowns resulting in a massive number of deaths can ever be justified. Why did the government wait for the situation to reach boiling point before sending in troops? Could preemptive arrests be a better option?

All these chatters on the internet is not available to the majority of chinese in the rural areas. Democracy and keeping of pet dogs are fashion statements and mostly affects the people who have not known hunger or hardship.

The opportunities in China would be relatively less then Singapore for the layman but the latter’s consumption is so small and will not make an impact.

China has double the land mass of India, yet its arable land is only half that of India. If the Chinese economy do not grow at more than 6% there is very high risk of social unrest.

So compared to the TAM incident, one must realise that China cannot have any misteps. Only the West are interested.

Chinese running to England or Geylang is common feature for the forseeable future. It is out of necessity and hunger and not lack of DEMOCRACY, FREEDOM or HUMAN RIGHTS etc. But if one woman working in Geylang can make enough money to support one child through school, the future of that child will be enhanced.

Singapore’s children has no such problem.

Ignore what the Apek is saying. He is getting senile. We need people like you to be around to give moderating balance.

thanks, very interesting

MUST WATCH!!!
http://www.911docs.net/911_american_empire.php

Including Vietnam.
And since US lost and left, no dominos have fallen.
But a whole nation brutally scared by decades of wars based on a theory someone cooked up in the Pentagon.

and Vietnam

Agent Orange and the post war deformed kids US left behind:
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2004-02/05/content_303315.htm

and the one million who died in the killing fields in Cambodia

Gilbert Goh

//// from abroad. I dont know how but i will try my best to continue the struggle even when abroad.////

Thank you, you may want to keep the struggle to yourself.

//// I will be moving back to Sydney soon (14 June) and hope that I can provide a vocie even from abroad. I dont know how but i will try my best to continue the struggle even when abroad.////

Leaving so soon?

“How could you leave without regret, am I so easy to forget?” – Engelbert Humperdink

“Fly to your tommrrow, leave me to my sorrow” – Bad Company “Seagul”

////// Tiananmen massacre,…….. this was what the West want you to believe. ………just go and get rich. Look at China day, he should be the great man who saved China. ,,,,,,//////////

The West wants China to disintegrate like USSR, to be like the Middle East fragmented and in perpectual conflict,

Oftentimes they will spot the seeds of dissent in a country and will lavishly supply fertilisers to help it that grow into giant oaks of dissent, and when necessary, give them political asylum in the West, and then use them to ignite political instabilty in those countries by long distance remote control.

Since the colonial days, World domination has been a addiction of the West.

Twin Towers
Hiroshima and Nagasaki
Iraq
Afghanistan
Israel
Palestine
Syria
May 13 Indonesia

etc, etc

Don’t just selectively pick on one.

sorry ah soh
I could have been more specific
I meant human languages.

horses are man made? how come i didn’t know that? by whom. Bukit Turf Club?