This is a sad story. Our foreign workers are treated like dirt.

I wonder why so many foreigners are allowed in when there is hardly job available for them.

The ones that approve their work permit must either be blind.

Something must be done in this ministry – they are underperforming for so many months now.

It is a shame.

Have the police got to the bottom of this? Have the police checked out the Owner of the property? What is the connection between the Owner and the agent running this? Can a Owner deny not knowing what goes on in his premises?

Disgusting.

I am ashamed of being a Singaporean.

What are the scholar mandarins doing? They must be out touch with reality.

Sing – first class everything.

Sing – a caring society.

You must be stupid if you believe the gamen is caring.

Check out conveinences stores exploiting “student” labour circumventing the labour laws making them do grave-yards shift with no special night allowances. The commisioned labour agencies who in turn exploite these”students” Have we become a nation where the poor worked for the rich (cunnings) over a meagre sum of monies. Check out these “student-pass” holder, in reality they worked full time plus grave-yards shifts with very little or no pay – all in the name they need to graduate Is there another worse word for “EXPLOITATION”

Who issed these “student pass”? Do they have a duty to check out what these “student” really do in SIN? Were these pass used to help certain sector businesses do business by exploiting the poor and clueless “students”

The Government of Singapore should hire more jobless citizens, put them into the ministries that need manpower.

Why invest so much in something that is high risk, then to feed our own citizen ?

What kind of logic is this ??

Something is not right here..

#4) Plen…mmmm a very interesteing name…have i heard of it somewhere…

You are right….overseas student working…night shifts…without allowances…or a decent pay…
Foriegn workers…they pay about SGD$6,000 to come here to work and this is what they get…

Who gave them the permits….did they check…no way…just stamped…
this rubber stamping instititions must be better organized & informed….

One wonders why…but then, when you look at the ministers running the show…you know why they are like that….

Singapore is IMPLODING FROM WITHIN…..

looks like govt employees are disgusted with their leaders and the direction it is heading….thus, such services occur and reoccur….

To stop this…Introduce Competition….Political Competition in Parliment…Question the damn minister for such a state….he’s getting paid by the millions…

only then we will and can move forward….Elections seems to be around the corner..perhaps end of this year…

I feel sorry for the dead worker’s family & the other workers…Is there some sort of collection for the unfortunate guy. Please let me know.

Gilbert Whos care! Just collect Worker Levy $300.

If I’m the ministry, I will put priority on $$$$$$!

the people who cause the workers’ death through negligence should be held accountable, ranging form the security guard to the company management who has so grossly neglected the welfare of these people. There should also be a board of enquiry on the police as to why no action was taken when they inspected the dorms. The police should be held accountable as well!!

Well Done! Andrew Loh, Gilbert Goh and Leong Sze Hian etc etc!

Online Citizen is the Number One Singapore Blog! Keep it till 2011 election!

God Bless Online Citizen!!!!

It is shocking to see so many unemployed Banglas in Singapore. Why does our so called 1st class Home Team security gatekeeper ICA allow them to come in to be unemployed? Is ICA stamping the passports blindly without even looking at them and the passports? ICA must account for the death of this unemployed Bangla Mohd Kamaluddin for allowing him to come and die in Singapore.

It’s outrageous that such blatant exploitation of fellow human beings took place and is continuing to take place in a self-proclaimed first world country run by leaders who are paid many times what other world leaders are paid! Is there really nothing these “leaders” can do to put a stop to such exploitation? By choosing not to do anything when they have the power to do so makes them just as guilty as the perpetrators of the exploitation. Their hands are equally stained with the blood and tears of the exploited workers.

Just feel very helpless and sad for those workers, I am sure that this is not first time such incident happened in singapore, or all over the globe. I remembered watching another documentary featuring similar plight in dubai and middle east. And also similar news in south korea, japan etc.

They must have heard of such cases before. Why do these workers still rushed to work even they have to pay the agent a huge sum of money? Who are the agents that coaxed them to work oversea?

>> toolang

“It is shocking to see so many unemployed Banglas in Singapore”

I am not surprised. Unemployment is rising across all countries now- even Singaporeans are jobless. The situation is a timing problem- before Lehmen Brothers collapsed (just end last year), the economy was still doing well. Now projects have unexpectedly stalled, leaving the Bangladeshi on a two year contracts, in a tight spot.

Not having a job is a tragedy in terms of loss of livelihood. But it is something that everyone grapples across the world.

But paying agency fees before working is something that opens workers to exploitation. When they are retrenched, not only they don’t earn anything (which is happening all over the world), they make a loss in terms of agency fees!!

The problem is why workers are made to pay agency fees before work. Unfortunately, this is a practice that happens in their home countries.Sg govt can compensate workers their agency fees but question is should sg tax payers pay for the profits of their home agents? Or should sg companies compensate the workers for their agency fees that their home agents collect?

I think the injustice is where the worker pays fees in anticipation of recovering the fees and get higher wages over two years of employment to the agent, but that does not materialize. The right thing should be agents refunding workers agency fees in proportion to their remaining length of their employment contract.

On Singapore side, we should ensure that workers get paid the wages in full for the months they worked in Singapore. In event of bankruptcy (due to the crisis), FW wages like all other bankruptcy proceedings should be given top priority.

IMO, on a personal level, we should be compassionate about the plight the workers are in- jobless but saddled with debt. We should, out of our own free will, reach out and help them. But at a societal level, it will be unfair to force Singaporean taxpayers or companies to compensate for agency debts collected by their home agents.

what to do…the end justifies the means in SG

The BIG question is why are FW allowed into Singapore when is no work. The first criterion for issue of a work permit must be that the FW has secured a job. Why allow FW in to stay unemployed?

Another other BIG is what does MOM do with the FW Levy collected. Is MOM treating this collection as just free income?

MOM must take action to eliminate such pitiful happenings in Singapore. Remember, we are a caring society. Why is it that there seems to be any move by MOM to stamp this tide? Do the minister and ministry staff have no sense of pity and compassion? Power is in their hand, so do something about this sad state of affairs.

As a Singaporean, I am ashamed that we are paying pittance to people who do our dirty jobs whether they are local or foreigners. If we can afford to pay millions to our ministers, let us give a decent wage to our cleaners and labourers and construction workers.

Where is Goh Chock Tong with his EQ? Where are you Mr Goh? Do you care at all? Or are you continuing to talk crap.

I think when something goes wrong, we should crucify ministers or mandarins. frankly i think thee middle-tiers managers who are also collecting a decent salaries have a duty to know what is happening.. and are paid to do their job properly. The minister is under seige with so many responsibilities – were they told the whole truth? All the middle manager need do is to check out personally what goes on with these “Student” pass holders & check more frequently.

Point here is “Pay them” accordingly to labour rates if the stores are asking them to work grave-yard shifts and there should be no middleman exploiting & collecting fees while these poor soul slough it out and take only part shares.

Did these appointed agencies collect portion of these “students” work monies ie exploiting these “students”

Why so many here without work – $1500 per workers agency fees. 1000 workers x $1500 = $1.5 millions. In a society where your TOP man is paid millions, the middle ranking will say WHY work so hard – work for what? It becomes a moral issue between GREED and INTEGRITY.

Money & GREED exceeds all evils.

#19 oops
I meant “—- when something goes wrong, we should NOT crucify ministers or mandarins. frankly i think these middle-tiers managers …………………”

>> 17. Summer

“As a Singaporean, I am ashamed that we are paying pittance to people who do our dirty jobs whether they are local or foreigners….. let us give a decent wage to our cleaners and labourers and construction workers.”

Agreed. The qns is where is the problem?
Employers of FWs (including those who have maids) can have a choice to pay higher salaries. But nobody wants to. In fact, many employers do not even consider non-monetary things such one off-day for maids.

Of course, we can get the govt to set a minimum wage, mandate one off day and FORCE everyone in SIngapore to comply.

But the very fact we have to do that is either because
(i) Singaporeans can’t take initiative to make a difference (e.g. tipping cleaners, giving off-days, give higher pay)

(ii) majority of people in society do not really care about it. some may pretend to, but when they can make a difference, they choose not to.

If SIngaporeans really care, there will not be a problem in the first place.

#20 Plen

True, as well…the middle management should be held more accountable, since they know the field. However, a minister must know what’s going on…and not when things go wrong.

Getting paid by the millions….
I think one should know what to do when the economy goes down.
FW’s don’t need to stay for 5 months without jobs.
They should be sent back home, then with the data available, should be given first priority to come back when the job pertaining to his skill arrives…
this can help him(FW) to save the agency cost and be happy with Singapore’s system.

MOM just seems to be in so much trouble. FW lah , employment stats lah…… some fellows there are just sleeping….and doing what they are told….
….time for implosion…

I meant “—- when something goes wrong, we should NOT crucify ministers or mandarins. frankly i think these middle-tiers managers …………………”

You have weird logic.

The minister and mandarins pick the middle-tiers managers. Hence, the former responsible for the behavior and performance of the latter.

last nite my toilet flushing system broke down, it so smelly the whole nite. Damn those million dollar ministers who can’t even built a proper toilet.

24) Ahgong

amazing link

Exploitattion of human labour since the days the Americans exploted the Africans to be slaves persist up to this present day. It respects no boundaries and perpetuate every corner of this world. The essential ingredients for this to exist is human greed and human desperation. When there are desperate people in need of work and greedy people wanting to make money without conscience, this happens.

#14 RW

///We should, out of our own free will, reach out and help them. ///

Good point. There are many kind hearted people involuntary civic groups that put their personal time effort and money to help others in need.

But interestingly, with the internet, we now have a group of citizen journalists who go around searching and sensationalising such news, kick up some dust, feel heoroic for helping them by bringing awareness and then move on to the next items that is newsworthy.

The age of TV has taught everyone on this planet the power of the media, and even in this video, you can those being interviewed understand this.

Very interesting indeed.

Exploitation is a big word but do you juys know that a lot prefer to be “exploitated”? They are willing to borrow thousands to pay their agents back in their home country so that their wish of getting employed oversea can come true otherwise they remains a miserable unemployed back home.

Do you guys forgot that not too long ago your grandfather was pennyless, shoeless and jobless when they squeeze into the Kongsi house when they 1st came here or you guys can only remember that today you haven’t taken your usual bow of bird’s net soup?

simple math.govt gets levies, employers exploit cheap labour, agents thrive on huge commission, only workers bring home shite.

karma is on its way.

To Apek

the job of journalists is to go around searching for news and bring awareness to readers. I dont think they are paid for this (unlike SPH reporters), so what more do you want?

that’s not all. how many times have you seen workers being ferried to and from work in the backs of lorries, many of which don’t even have roofs? it’s simply miraculous that there hasn’t been an accident yet. (or has there?) has anyone even seen dogs being transported like that? for the love of the jupiter (in this case, read ‘money’), they’re not called CARGO. they’re PEOPLE.

28) ma bew yeng woh

/// Exploitation is a big word but do you juys know that a lot prefer to be “exploitated”? They are willing to borrow thousands to pay their agents back in their home country so that their wish of getting employed oversea can come true otherwise they remains a miserable unemployed back home.///

Agree. Good to read more view on TOC with your line of thought.
That is still very true in many parts of the world now.

///Do you guys forgot that not too long ago your grandfather was pennyless, shoeless and jobless when they squeeze into the Kongsi house when they 1st came here or you guys can only remember that today you haven’t taken your usual bow of bird’s net soup?////

Many in TOC seems clueless of this. But we need to recognise their birthright includes high grade bird nest soup at low cost and remember no waiting in plastic chairs, please,

30) Small Time Businessman on July 4th, 2009 10.30 pm To Apek

///the job of journalists is to go around searching for news and bring awareness to readers. I dont think they are paid for this (unlike SPH reporters), so what more do you want?///

I am not refering to any SPH reporters, which i a popular target of ridicule in TOC. That is not the context of my post.
I am comparing these so called citizen joyurnalists to the volunteers who put in their time effort and monety help the people they belief need help.

to Apek:

without these free journalists, how will the volunteers know about the real plight of these foreign workers? SPH newspapers?

“without these free journalists, how will the volunteers know about the real plight of these foreign workers? SPH newspapers?”

Plight? Is a big word too.

If foreigner workers have to come here and plight than my suggestion to them is to stay at home. There is a saying that “Nothing is better than home” so why go and plight?

34) Small Time Businessman

are you saying such volunteers did not exist before the age of the internet?

35) ma bew yeng woh

As an eye opener, it may be good to know that there were numerous cases of foreign workers self inflicting injuries at work to obtain workman compensation injury as the amount paid can be rather substantial for them. This is usually co-schemed by unscrupulous people in the legal profession.

And also many illegal overstayers take refuge worker these dormitories.

That is why they sometimes are afraid to report non payment of wages, poor living conditons etc.

As in everthing, there are good workers and there are not so good one.
There are good employers and the not so good ones.

We hope our citizen journalists are aware of the these issues as they broadcast such events with zest.

31) observed:

” that’s not all. how many times have you seen workers being ferried to and from work in the backs of lorries, many of which don’t even have roofs? it’s simply miraculous that there hasn’t been an accident yet. (or has there?) has anyone even seen dogs being transported like that? for the love of the jupiter (in this case, read ‘money’), they’re not called CARGO. they’re PEOPLE.”

This is what I call “Talk no need money” or “Talk only no action”.
So what do you expect a contractor to ferry their worker? Beside budgetting for lorry add budget for coach too? Ask government to hire bus driver to give free transport for foreign worker? or you want company to pay worker so that they can take a taxi to work in the construction site? Haha……. sound so simple to you.
Accident in all cases is result result from careless driver not the lorry.

Look at what happen to the School Bus sit belt issue, the court verdict is because of the careless bus driver resulting in the death of the kid, is not the bus fault. If the driver is not careless the boy do not have to die and we do not have to force bus sit belt down the throat resulting in thousand and thousand of poor parents paying more for school bus fare every month.

“are you saying such volunteers did not exist before the age of the internet?”

did i say that?

39) Small Time Businessman

Good that you did not. My point is that these volunteers were already helping whoever they were helping for decades without the “citizens journalist” telling them that such people are need help exists. They are on the ground, they understand the plight of the people they are helping, they do it with their time, effort and money, from their heart and without publicity.

38) ma bew yeng woh

///This is what I call “Talk no need money” or “Talk only no action”.////

happens regularly on TOC lah.
talk is free. complin is free.

to Apek:

these journalists are already volunteer journalists. If you disapprove of what they are doing, then you should steer clear of TOC. Because almost all articles here are contributed by these volunteer journalists.

please dont contradict your beliefs by visiting TOC

38) ma bew yeng woh

One needs to appreciate the interdependance of labour cost and cost of services and goods. If we want a higher pay, the services and goods in the sector we are in will have to cost more. In order to keep cost down, local labour gets replaced by imported labour. So thus the issue of foreign workers, local pay, and cost of everything are all in a interdependant web.

So if our concerned poster wants our foreign workers to be ferried in lorries, buses, tourist coaches, helicopters, all options are possible, but with coreesponding cost of the end product. It is easy to be so gungho speaking for workers rights, but when these construction workers are shuttled in other than loories, cost will go up for the contractors, which will lead to higher HDB flats, which then peope will blame on high minister pay and Temasek lost billions.

aiyah

42) Small Time Businessman

you steered clear of my questions.

42) Small Time Businessman

very typical reaction to dissending views
is to stay away from TOC
so that TOC become the exclusive domain for those who hold the same views?any view not in line stay out?
doesn’t that sound familiar?
of the accusatoion that gahmen alway do that ?

I agree with RC and Summer. Ironically, our government has taken care of us not poorly, but too well, such that when such seemingly unbecoming episodes happen, we are quick to point fingers at our government.

The point is, how many of us take notice and give aid besides the occasional donations to charities?

Hopefully we can, as individuals, do more to help. Granted, The Online Citizen’s a great platform for such issues to be brought to attention. Now that you’ve known, you are held accountable.

Ed

To Apek:

you know what is TOC all about, and you chose to come here.

Consider this scenario, you know a shop that sells things that you dont like, yet you still visit the shop repeatedly to tell the shop attendants that you dont like their things. What’s the point?

“Now that you’ve known, you are held accountable.”

Yeah, vote out PAP next election

This sad state of affairs has been going on for years.
The parties to blame are in my opinion, Ministry of Manpower (MOM) for what appears to be just ”ineffective” in sorting this mess, unscrupulous agents, Employers, etc etc…the list goes on.

I personally discovered this sad state of affairs about 9 years ago.
And I can say not much has changed.
The people at MOM do not appear to understand the state of affairs in the foreign countries that force them to come here to seek work & the abuse that comes with it.MOM should send their staff to these countries, talk to those workers who have gotten into trouble here to understand the situation, NOT just ”process” the cases…which we singaporeans are good for….we do not appear to have a ’soft’ side to understanding situations!

The fact that we build our first class city state on the misery of these foreigner workers is appalling!
They are abused by one & all, not cared for, turned a blind eye to, etc for us to have new buildings, keep our estates clean, trim our trees, collect our garbage…..and no one except for a few non-profit organisations that try to do something.

In the past I have asked MOM why not introduce an accredition system for agents, maybe even employers.This will stop to a large extent the abuse.
If the agent has too many complaints against them, they will be stopped from acting as agents.
Of course MOM should be smart enough to make sure the people behind agency firms are persecuted NOT the company as the latter can be closed down easily & a new one started.

By accrediting agents, it will save other govt departments money & work too.The police force dont have to round up ”ali-baba” workers.These are ”illegal” workers who decide to break the rules because they have no one to turn to for help……thats how the turn ‘illegal’!
I understand about 20,000 a year are rounded….thats a huge waste of public funding!
No wonder our police force is so busy & takes ages to attend to us (turn up) when called…they are running the merry go round with these ali-baba workers!
On the top of that, they have to be jailed, fed whilst in jail…..another waste of public funding.
There are many other govt departments involved I am sure….even ICA (immigration).
Isnt this all a waste of our funds?

If something can be done at the ”accredition level”, I think alot of misery will be prevented for ALL…..most of all the foreign workers.
Perhaps its true whats been written earlier above, we just dont care…….not even the govt.But if the govt can see the wastage of public funds as I have highlighted above, maybe they will make a MOVE….save money what!

#Kopi Tiam Apek….

You just want to get into trouble….the problem is straight forward…..

no point talking…action is required. Proper system must be put in place. If MOM can’t do it….then who will. These are simple problems, easy to rectify and yet.

Just don’t pay the minister for 1 month and use the money to slove the issues.

Or ask this minister to go to the private sector….see how you get screwed when such problems come up during meetings…..
mmmm, BTW how many times have we seen these same problems.
If this was in the private sector….some people would have lost their jobs….

govt sector..iron rice bowl mah…

50) prettyplace
///You just want to get into trouble….the problem is straight forward…..///

Posting a view point to does not concur with yous is ” just want to get into trouble” ?

48) Small Time Businessman

///// “Now that you’ve known, you are held accountable.”

Yeah, vote out PAP next election/////

Very predictable universal cure for all issues, ya?

47) Small Time Businessman

Firstly, I shall assume that “To Apek” refers to KopitiamApek and thus your post is directed at me

For clarity of whom I am replying to, I rather address you in full as Small Time Businessman , not Small or Time or Businessman or Business or Man
or any other abbreviated form.

///you know what is TOC all about, and you chose to come here.
Consider this scenario, you know a shop that sells things that you dont like, yet you still visit the shop repeatedly to tell the shop attendants that you dont like their things. What’s the point?////

You example of a shop is interesting but whether it is an accurate depiction of TOC is debatable.

“you know what is TOC all about” is but your view point, is that representative view of all in TOC that that is what TOC is all about?

49) silvester

besides MOM, ICA should also take steps to stem out these ali babas.
you correctly pointed out that this issue has been around, I believe not 9 years, but for decades.

years ago, there was a big poliltical blow up when the Thai govt threathened to send their war ship to SG when we rounded up a huge number of Thai ali baba workers.

there seems to be too many cracks in the border of this tiny island to slip thru.

46) Edmond Phon

The by product of success is a minority group of people who behave this way.

///we are quick to point fingers at our government.
The point is, how many of us take notice and give aid besides the occasional donations to charities?
Hopefully we can, as individuals, do more to help. Granted, The Online Citizen’s a great platform for such issues to be brought to attention. Now that you’ve known, you are held accountable.///

But sadly, when there are events that requires physically attendance, the turn up is pathetic. Hiding behind the keyboard and complaining is a favourite pasttimes for some

“you know what is TOC all about” is but your view point, is that representative view of all in TOC that that is what TOC is all about?

Tell me then, what is TOC to you

56) Small Time Businessman

TOC is an online forum.

#Kopi Tiam Apek….

You seem to take pieces of statements out of context to make your point,
You don’t seem to make fruitful siggestions but comment on comments.

And Voting out PAP….yeah perhaps it might cure all Singapore’s universal problems…Why Not….

They don’t seem to do much honestly. Except for what we get in any modern state…but their pay is exceptionally high tough.

And you make digressions far out wide that the initial gist of the matter reported by TOC gets diluted….mmmm…makes me wonder

“TOC is an online forum.”

Exactly. And in an online forum, we discuss issues. Period.

You said this: “But interestingly, with the internet, we now have a group of citizen journalists who go around searching and sensationalising such news, kick up some dust, feel heoroic for helping them by bringing awareness and then move on to the next items that is newsworthy.”

The journalists are just doing their job for their online forum

I re-read all the emails posted here again just now.

There are some negative comments about others here….eg ”just comments online, no action”. But by far & large, I am happy to see quite a few singaporeans are so compassionate :-)
There are quite a few singaporeans who want to build this city on fairness, justice.Thats nice.

Do remember these online sites are monitored by the authorities.
Its a good platform to the authorities to tell them how the people feel & how they feel the authorities should be acting…….caring people in singapore are saying ”we are supposed to be a 1st world society, so our message to the authorities is quite clear here….behave like a 1st world society towards others”.

Sure, it difficult to get things done. Its the system we are up against.
The civil servants (most anyway) just do their jobs & dont care about the background leading to the precarious situations the foreign workers find themselves stuck with.The civil servants are NOT attacking the CAUSE of the problems.
Civil servants are you reading this website? I am sure you are. Please hire more devoted people to work in the civil service. I say this because I had a bad experience many years back when I brought a worker to MOM to complain about not getting his salary.The officer was obviously by his tone & body language unhappy I brought the worker in. Perhaps it was just more work for the officer!
I quickly reminded the officer that he was supposed to be helping the worker, that he was there to ’serve’ the public.That helped. If the worker faces such an officer on his own, he would be intimidated…… then where else can the worker turn to for help?
I should have recored the date & time & name of the officer at MOM; this is a nice time to mention a name!

A bit of background for those here who are less familiar & perhaps for the authorities to take notice too
—————————————————————————————————–
Foreign workers (FW) pay a large sum to get here to work … …about $6000.
(The chinese worker pays $9000! The sum varies.)

About $2000 each goes to the foreign agent, the local agent & the employer!
YES, some employers do collect from potential employees.This is an abuse of the system.
Of course the larger corporates, I think dont practice this, only unscrupulous employers!

Employers can ”employ” an FW, then after a while, for ‘whatever reason’ (hey, I dont like your face) dont like the FW, can send him back home.
Who profits? Everyone, including the employer who already pocketed $2000.
Who suffers, the FW who paid $6000, most of this borrowed back home & he cannot return home because he cant pay his debt as he was depending on his job to re-pay the debt.
In such a situation, the worker rather than face going home, runs a way & becomes an ”ali-baba” worker.

Of course MOM knows this happens & I believe has said to employers that they must not benefit from employing an FW.
To be fair MOM tried to do something…..but again woefully inadequate.
Unscrupulous agents & employers have already got around this…..the $2000 is no longer openly paid to employers… ….there are other ways around eg ”in kind” payments etc etc. The practice lives on.

So again, I say to MOM, look at the accredition route out of this mess.
After all we do accredit almost everything else in singapore…….we even have a love-making (match-making) accredition, why not one for the FW agents?

61) silvester

I must admit you do have a good understanding of the FW situation in SG. Well done and thanks for sharing. It is also good to get the facts of the situation correct as it helps the discussion on stay on track.

You rightly highlighted the black sheeps, the unscrupulous agents & employers who are making money by being registered as a construction company, but in reality operating as a labour exchange.

They exploit this desperation of the workers and get paid (you quoted 2k) per worker in the construction industry, as contractors

As registered contractor, when they successfully they bid for jobs, they get their FW quota entitlement (MYE) . However, they do no such construction work, They subcontract out everything, collect the payments from these desperate workers, and to add insult to injury, charge fee to the subcontractors who are dying for workers, and who are at the mercy of the contractor as only he hold the right to the FW entitlement.

thanks for the background information. i think it really clarify the plight of the workers. most singaporeans think the worst thing for FW is the low pay, long hours, poor working conditions. you just highlighted that it is worse than that.

For a singaporean, when a employer mistreats us, we just throw in the resignation letter and leave. For FWs, they have paid so much to come to work. No matter what comes, they just have to suck it up.

So it really depends on how lucky he is.

(i) employer treats him well, pay him his ‘low’ wages which actually translate to a sizable sum.

(ii) employer treats him badly- deducts his wages, verbally abuse him, force him to work around the clock w/o rest. Some workers cannot take it- so run away, try to go home, purposefully injure themselves so they can get out.

(iii) employer goes bankrupt due to crisis. somethings are unavoidable.
(iv) employer is out to cheat their money by employing them, take their money and kick them out after a while.

IMO, the general public understanding is focus on low wages etc.
no doubt it is low, but it is still something they are ok with becoz of exchange.

it is the rest of the abuses that are the problem- particularly 2&4.
And unlike low wages- which is a market issue that both sides agree on, abuses and cheating are outright wrong and there is no ambiguity on that.

>> 61. silvester

i was wondering one thing- where did you get the number of ali baba number from. ST, police website? seems quite high..

about your suggestion on accreditation- how will it exactly work and help the situation? most of the money changes hands in their home countries. can singapore really do anything about it?

not that i am suggesting you are wrong, but by questioning it, hopefully the idea will become more concrete!

and anyway, you deserve credit for being the first (and only) person who gave a suggestion, on top of commenting. if ‘online citizens’ do that more, this will transform TOC from an alternative information (where we receive ideas) to a alternative ideas sites (where we come up with alternative ideas to challenge the current approach) =)

58) prettyplace

///You seem to take pieces of statements out of context to make your point,///
how so, please elaborate

///You don’t seem to make fruitful siggestions but comment on comments.///
like than the universal solution of kicking out you know who. ?

////And Voting out PAP….yeah perhaps it might cure all Singapore’s universal problems…Why Not….////
which you echoed Small Time Businessman ’s post #48

are these not digressions to you?

///They don’t seem to do much honestly. Except for what we get in any modern state…but their pay is exceptionally high tough.////

are these not digressions to you?

#59
////And you make digressions far out wide that the initial gist of the matter reported by TOC gets diluted….mmmm…makes me wonder////

I wonder too. who is digressing.

60) Small Time Businessman

///“TOC is an online forum.”
Exactly. And in an online forum, we discuss issues. Period.///

That I agree with you. Discuss. Period.

////The journalists are just doing their job for their online forum////

They are doing their job, also agree.

But to refresh your memory how we this got to this point of our debate,

@34) Small Time Businessman

you wrote
///without these free journalists, how will the volunteers know about the real plight of these foreign workers? SPH newspapers?///

read the exchanges from there, which ended with your evading of my question and instead you chose to comment

///you know what is TOC all about, and you chose to come here.///
///If you disapprove of what they are doing, then you should steer clear of TOC////

To quote again what you wrote, in online forum we discuss issues?
Can you please make up your mind?

“But interestingly, with the internet, we now have a group of citizen journalists who go around searching and sensationalising such news, kick up some dust, feel heoroic for helping them by bringing awareness and then move on to the next items that is newsworthy.”

if you can read what you wrote and understand your own english, I rest my case

#too much of Kopi lah u Apek….

67) Small Time Businessman

You have still not answered the original question. If you can’t or do not wish to, it is ok.
We agree to disagree.

68) prettyplace

///#too much of Kopi lah u Apek….///

add this to the other universal answers

[...] Strangers in a Strange Land – TOC: Death of Bangladeshi worker in 2008 [...]

There is another death of a foreigner (allegedly jumped down from building) at Fusionopolis yesterday at 2pm. Something must be terribly wrong for such a young and promising person to commit suicide, is it not?

Nothing was published in the newspapers but the Internet had a field day. Why was TOC not reporting this?

Is there a policy instructing main stream medias not to publish such sad news which may mar the image of Singapore?

Shouldn’t our citizens be made aware of what is going on in the community regarding survival and survivability – in the modern concrete jungle of survival of the fittest?

Looks like the suicide rate must be rising, otherwise why the black-out on such news?

May be this is also an indication that the quality of life has gone down, very much lower than say twenty years back, when the suicide rate was much lower?

Could this be the initial signal that the policy of “Progress at ALL Costs” will also reap a heavy price in terms of lives lost unnecessarily?

Correction: The incident happened not yesterday but rather last Thursday.

Hello All

Thanks KopitiamApek & RW for constructive comments.You guys also have alot of info ( I am learning too) & together we can only hope that the people in charge at MOM & elsewhere will read & constructively take notice too….as we are all here to make a change for the better. Frankly its NOT a wild attack on MOM & others & I hope they also see it that way.

Let me see if I can answer RW’ s question. How do I know its 20,000.
Certainly in 2001 when I had to deal with an ”ali-baba” case (help out), this was the number I came to know. My memory is pretty poor, but certainly it is a large number. What the number is today, I am afraid I dont know.

I know ( guess the cost) what it cost the govt bec I saw the whole process…..arrest, processing, jail, court hearing, re-patriation back home, ICA got involved in black-listing, police sending ‘offenders back & forth to court’ etc etc.
So it is certainly a big cost saver if the govt can stop ”ali-baba” cases from happening in the 1st place. I think quite alot of these cases can be prevented……..as I said if MOM as the 1st gate-keeper does its job….which I am suggesting is some form of accreditation of the agents.
After all we have accreditation of agents for Domestic Help Right?
So why not other workers? Yes women are most vulnerable, but so are men under these circumstances.

How the accredition takes place & what form…..that I supposed can be left to MOM to fine tune. I would suppose , look at what the govt is doing with accreditation of match-making agencies. The model is the same….weed out unscrupulous ones & let the genuine, fair ones remain. Or follow the system for Domestic Help.
So my idea is NOT so original, just stole it from other models.
Whats strange is WHY is MOM so slow to do this when there are models around already? Thats the most important question to ask.

there’s an article which i found very enlightening on Yawning Bread from a guest contributor, ‘Bruce’:

http://yawningbread.wordpress.com/2009/06/19/government-too-sucks-the-blood-and-sweat-of-foreign-workers/

I thought it was a great read and a good counterpoint to how the system stacks up against employers too.

I noticed that lorries and pick-ups in malaysia do not carry workers at the storage areas. my construction friend/boss told me that it is illegal to do so (can someone confirm this please?). if this is true, malaysia is certainly more advanced than singapore in this respect.

74) silvester

//So my idea is NOT so original, just stole it from other models.////

Radical innovation do not occur as frequently as adaptive innovation.
Most creative breakthrough are clever adaptations of existing technologies
You are on track. : )

in the video subtities “police no action no action”.

Hi All

I am not terribly good with computers.
Just realised there is a U-tube video ”plight of migrant workers” on this site.
Watched it & its probably a true reflection of what the conditions are like; conditions that I have only HEARD about all these years.
Congrats to TWC2 for the video………now the whole world can see it.
Hope MOM is also watching.

For those of us here who cant just watch & do nothing…….please look at TWC2 & other sites like HOME to see if you can do a little to help.
These non-profit organisations are always looking for volunteers to help out….in any way you can.

I myself have volunteered a little while back , spoke to them & am waiting for them to call me up for some active service :-)

I guess they want to con foreign workers outta their thousands of dollars & thus, brought them here even if there is no work for them. They do not care if this leads to overcrowding & social problems & most importantly, conning the poor foreigners outta their money & leaving them in the middle of nowhere.

The system here stinks big time.

[...] in a Strange Land – TOC: Death of Bangladeshi worker in 2008 – TOC: Why’re foreigners on social visit passes allowed to work in [...]

[...] All that Kamaluddin received from his employer were two panadol tablets, we were told by his fellow workers. (See TOC reports here and here.) [...]

These are signs that our country is decading and sinking from within. We do not need an external enemy as we had one very big one that is home made.The money we spent on defence is just for show and similarly those millions dollar ministers. I sincerely believed that we are storing problems for the future and one day we SinKaporean will have to pay for it. I just hoped that those responsible are around when the bills come in. Bangladeshi workers are also human although they may be poor. We had truly lost all decency as a human. As a nation, we will continue to be a country of immigrants as local born do not feel they belong except if one is part of the establishment. How many PAP members are there in SinKapore? I know for a fact, that PAP membership is by invitation only. To join the magic circle, one need a sponsor and willing to sacrifice one principles and do what one is told. Greed or integrity?