Here is a report by Channelnewsasia in July 2009 on MM Lee saying that Singapore is not yet a nation:
Despite achieving harmony amongst all races in Singapore, Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew said on Saturday that the country is still a work-in-progress when it comes to nationhood.
“Are we a nation yet? I will not say we are. We’re in transition,” he said at the Orange Ribbon Celebrations which centres on racial harmony.
“Please remember this is an ideal which we may not completely reach, but because we have this ideal, we’ll continue to make progress,” he said.
On 30 October 2009, Law Minister K Shanmugam said Singapore is “not a country” but a city, according to a report by The Straits Times:
‘This is where most people make a mistake…I have tried to explain that we are different. We are a city. We are not a country,’ he told 200 lawyers, many from America, at the New York State Bar Association International Section’s meeting here.
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We pay so MULTI-millions to many of them to govern a place which is neither a city or nation, you mean Singapore is really a corporation ie Singapore Inc in disguise?
Hi TOC, I think your title should be ‘SIngapore neither a nation nor a country’
“Singapore neither a nation nor a city – Ministers”
I can see where you are coming from, but please try and get the basics right — like the headline!
Shanmugam said “We are a city. We are not a country”
So I assume you mean:
Singapore neither a nation nor a country – Ministers
we are neither a nation nor a city cos’ we are a corporation!
MM says we are not yet a nation…Law Minister mentions we are not a country,what will our PM declare? – Singapore is not a country,not yet a nation…sounds like that Britney Spears song – Not a girl,not yet a woman!!
John Connor says – Singapore is an MNC – the ruling party wants to make money,more money,just like the MJ song,”They don’t really care about us!”
does this mean we can tell them to get lost and just let the civil servants run this place?
Minister Mentor and Law Minister are both liars, cheaters. Sue both of them to bankruptcy.
Singapore is a country; more specifically, Singapore is a sovereign city-state.
Semantically, we are not a nation.
Singapore will never be a nation as long as its leaders care only about amassing humongous salaries for themselves. With their outlandish
salaries they will never understand the plight of the poor. Their bottomless
income will always keep them divorced from the true reality and sufferings of the people outside their comfort zone.
Since S’pore is only a city, we need only a Mayor and a City Council. We can do without the expensive wasteful Cabinet and Senior and Mentor Ministers.
“Singapore neither a nation nor a country – Ministers”
Yes I know! We are a hotel right?
ya..we are a city…annexed by, to, with, whatever…. China.
12) Sickening on October 31st, 2009 9.25 pm
Yes, we are a hotel. After all, the foreigners come here, stay a short while, do on with their business and left when it is done. Singaporeans are left to do the menial work.
What do they care as long as the get their million dollar salaries.
we pay and pay them (or you could also consider them sucking us) millions.
I remember LHL once said about paying peanuts and getting monkeys. Well, it seems that we’re paying gold bars and getting incompetent chimps.
But i dont find it surprising, after all, how many times can pap ministers dodge these bullets??
Eventually, one will strike them in the head. And I’d say this bullet is a potential one.
Not a country, not a nation, just a city state, but, a tiny dot of a land has a PM, a MM, a SM, two Deputy PMs and a President to run it. Simply amazing and incredible.
patriot
If it is a city, then it must be a corrupted city by the MIWs.
They decide a policy and carry it out with telling us. We only find out when it is done.
It seems like they have already decided to do away with wet markets. Lately, I notice many of their stooges writing in the forum pages to say how they dislike wet markets. The latest is Ms Betty Ho.
http://www.straitstimes.com/ST%2BForum/Story/STIStory_448535.html
Not sure why they want to do away with wet markets and end the livelihood of more poor Singaporeans. Do supermarkets bring in more money for the government.
I wonder if any more stooges will be writing in. Why do they take us for fools.
This statement makes me ever more determined to seek else where to settle down! There is not sense of belonging as Singapore is neither a country or a nation. Singapore is just a hotel for migrants……….
The vendor was serving three customers who were there before me, so I waited patiently for him to attend to me. In the meantime, more customers came. When the first three customers were gone, the vendor attended to the customers who had come after me. I signalled to him a couple of times that I was next, but each time he turned round to tell me to wait.
Betty Ho (Ms)
She wants wet markets to be closed because of such a petty reason. How can Singapore be a nation. We are not a country. Not a city state. Not even a corporation. We are a prison.
How else can a stooge write in to the form pages of the Shitty Times time and time again pretending to be normal citizens to influence the people in favour of government policy.
Dear Shanmugam,
If we really are merely a city and not a country, why do we need to have passports at all?
Since Singapore is not a country or a nation so we are not citizens of any country or nation, right? Why then do we need to serve NS/reservist? So we can’t be charged for AWOL, right?
Hey guys, such statements are wake up call. We are not a country or a nation. We are PAP playground and we serves NS to protect PAP family. Singaporeans are betrayed!!! Many of the laws in Singapore are enacted to protect PAP and they are PAP Law. As such Shamugam has to struggle his way out of the 200 questioning lawyers and when he is in dire state to survive further questioning, he finally told the truth. We are really in deep deep trouble/
To be fair, he probably intended to say that Singapore has no hinterland and (I assume) has to operate/govern as a city. Hence, we are “special”.
Of course, this raises two questions:
1. What does it mean to govern a city? City-Nation-States were common through history, how were they governed? Where there common themes? City-Nation-Island-States were probably rarer, but does that make us more “special”?
2. So, we’re “special” nation governing as a city (whatever that means) … what has that got to do with press freedom?
Shanmugam seemed to fail to explain the conclusion made in his speech. If his point was “asian values” makes us want to control the press, then that really has nothing to do with our being a “special” City-State. The former is tenuously debatable, the latter is simply a red herring with no grounding in logic or reason.
can TOC folks compile a list of most memorable quotes of 2009 & let forumers caste votes? :)
best if can caste more than 1 quote. maybe, just maybe can tease Straits Times by “asking” them to put it in print! waha-hahaa…. :D
12) Sickening
]]]] Yes I know! We are a hotel right?
Well said Sickening. They ripped us off now and all starting to claim credits and enriched themselves. They care for us? No, they are already preparing to move out anytime. Yet we are still stuck looking for jobs.
These bunch of new gayman need 2b killed.
A compilation of MIW’s most memorable quotes here:
http://yoursdp.org/index.php/perspective/political-hors-doeuvre
Seriously, we can be anything they want. A compliant citizen, city dweller. worker, etc etc.
Does anyone think it means anything to them ?
Or matter to them?
As long as they get to profit from us, all actions
taken will be for that purpose, that is all. The rest
are just for show, that is all.
MM Lee and Shanmugam have just admitted what a lot of people believe Singapore is – that Singapore is a corporate inc. It’s obvious from the way this nation, I mean “city”, has been run by the PAP. Look at their corporate CEO salaries! If the LEEgime had its way, Singapore would only have 50,000 people and 4 million foreigners who come and go and merely be pawns in the economic machine.
Singapore would only be a mid-sized city in the USA (where there are at least a hundred cities) yet some of our ministers, and our president, are paid more than the President of the United States.
Guys and TOC U have quoted and quoted WRONGLY leading to misunderstanding.
His point whether you agree with it or not was that Singapore’s politics was more that of the “politics of a city” versus that of politics of a ‘country” . That was fair comment and neither disparages or insults singapore’s status as a country and a city state
Locke
Guys and TOC U have quoted and quoted WRONGLY leading to misunderstanding.
His point whether you agree with it or not was that Singapore’s politics was more that of the “politics of a city” versus that of politics of a ‘country” . That was fair comment and neither disparages or insults singapore’s status as a country and a city state
Locke
Very conveniently said. Singapore is neither a nation nor a country? Singapore is only a city? So, we have been mislead all these years?
In other words, all our ministers are not ministers. Our PM is only a City Councilor and all the Ministers are actually his deputies, Deputy or Assistant City Councilors. And Shanmugam is only an Assistant Councilor in charge of legal matters.
What are MM Lee and SM Goh then? Consultants, Senior Councilors, or Stepped-Down Councilors Who Refused To Retire?
Then why are they demanding to be paid the world’s highest salaries and bonuses? Singaporeans should now ask for money back. Those so-called ministers should only be paid at city councilors’ levels of remuneration. Why is our PM drawing 5 to 6 times the salary of President Obama? Even our Junior Ministers’ pays are higher than that of President Obama!
I think MM is getting too old and starts to make mistakes and has let slip his tongue, and Shanmugan, trying to be too smart, has let the cat of of the bag.
Singaporeans should wake up now.
LOL!
I’ve always felt we’re NOT quite what we are.. but rather, we are WHO we VOTED for!
So very aptly; YOU are what you VOTE..;p
If the job of minister mentor and law minister is to make such unuseful and meaningless comments, it seem like any tom,dick,harry can become minister mentor and law minister of singapore. Which other ministers in the world get paid million dollars a year just to utter nonsense ?
Singaporeans need to vote for cheaper, better and faster MPs to get rid of current useless, ineffective and incompetent PAP MPs and ministers.
Singapore neither a nation nor a country and it’s run by the village people, and leading the pack is the village elder.
But why do we not pay “village salary” for “village service” ?
This is like some sci-fi movie where we got one master mind and the people are clones spewing the same concoction of confusion….sooner or later the system will turn on itself…….
Not a country but each of them take home at least $10 million in total.
I for one don’t know what Lim Swee Say has done so far other than doing a song and dance about ‘upturn the downturn’ to distract us from the current recession. If he wants to perform on stage, he can join mediacorp.
What we want are competent and effective ministers who can raise the standard of living of the aveage Singaporeans.
You will only finds these people amongst the opposition ranks.
http://geraldgiam.sg/2009/10/balancing-an-emerging-dragon/
Mr Giam makes a good point about MM Lee being terrified of China’s intention. Yet he is flooding this country with PRCs. This country is being put at risk for economic gains and they hope that the Americans will help when trouble comes.
Its like an arsonists starting fires and requesting for the firemen to standby.
In principle, only sovereign states can become UN members. Isn’t Singapore sitting in UN?
Sure, then tell the whole cabinet to get lost and save our taxpapers
alot of money.
As a city, Singapore doesnt need a national government.
Just individual town councils to mind their own affairs.
I could not understand the rationale behind the saying that
singapore is not yet a NATION.
and
singapore is not a COUNTRY.
It is a fact that Singapore IS a Country that has 1 CITY.
The fact that it is a City does not mean it is not a Country.
There can be many levels of NATIONhood. Just like Transparency.
Some say there something is Very Transparent, More Transparent or not transparent. Some may even go so far as insisting there is Either Transparency (full transparency) or there is no Transparency. Is the word ‘nation’ used in this way that it either is a FULL NATION or it is Not a Nation? So, should we also say something is Transparent when IT IS and not when it is 50% Opaque?
Since when did people 1st told us that singapore is not a nation when the word singapore and nation were used to describe singapore since long time ago?
I am really confusd by that 2 guys’ words.
I do not recall anyone saying singapore is not yet a nation nor singapore is not a country in the past, say >=5 years ago.
What is the rationale for ‘revealing’ this to the citizenry ?
Some memorable singapore national day related song lyrics:
“This is my COUNTRY, this is my flag….”
“…singapore forever a NATION strong and free….”
did someone pointed out before that the lyrics is inappropriate?
And which wise man decided that a city state that is not yet a nation needs a huge influx of immigrants who are then given almost-instant residency rights and even citizenship?
What the hell??
So… all these years people celebrate national day for what?
Since we aren’t even a nation yet??
Good one Soo Hong Chia.
I guess it should be
“This is my corporation, this is my brand…”
“… singapore forever, a corporation strong and free…”
Or better yet… as some has pointed.. a city of China??
Then can dont serve NS what
Suka they talk just to cover-up whatever sh*t Singapore as a country is facing, and it’s never their fault in any case.
Sigh…
Come on people, time for PAP to step down.
We want new responsible leaders with no strings attached, and deep in our hearts, we still want Singapore as a country, dont we?
And now, according to CNA (http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1015089/1/.html), some more “promising” PAP candidates have been identified for next election, slated for Feb 2012.
Are they really going to take that long?
They may, if they think they need that much time for additional brainwashing and bribery at the grassroots level with small vouchers for old folks (with poor access to their CPF) and the destitute.
I believe this is a red herring.
Times aren’t good. However, their overall inability to spur anything is increasing the rate of resentment. I think they’ve announced the 2012 date to throw off the opposition. Then, out of the blue, a snap election announcement may happen.
I’ve seen this done in tightly controlled regimes (Honduras, Nicaragua, Myanmar, etc). Give false info to lull the crowds…then WHAM! No one sees it coming and the new PAP folks are walked in via GRC and walkovers before you can give your NRIC at the polling station.P puts it down.
Time for talk is over.
Time for action is upon us.
Use your vote responsibly.
Don’t vote for PAP.
“Napoleon is always right” (Animal Farm). ‘Nuff said.
oh my god! what’s our identity then. maybe the PRC is right about us it’s the Lee village.
Great, just great….people get paid only 500k to govern one of the world’s biggest nation….and our dear MIW get paid millions to govern a small city….I just love it….really, i do!
If this is only a city, not a country, why the need for National Service, election every 5 years to elect a parliament and President. Why not just employ the best CEO to run this city? No wonder Singaporeans are so apathetic to politics. In other words, this place is like a BIG corporation with Profit & Loss bottomline so that the top officers are paid millions each year.
After the CONFIRMATIONS by MM Lee and Minister Shanmugan, i now confirmed my suspicion that the Independence of SIN was/is a freak one. I was/is of the view that the Former Master, the British was just looking for anyone for her to give away SIN and well, a local was given it(SIN).
patriot