This govt is really robbing its citizens outright with their profit driven centre policy. Imagine the electric tariff which has just gone up by some 12%+ some recent months ago, and next quarter, they are going to ripp off another another 5%+ out of our basic utilities bills again’ knowing that you people are too weak to do anything about it, and we are already paying the highest electrical bill in the world. What the hell is this govt trying to do?

So simple, My dear “tiredsingaporean”, my answer to you is that this government has to do all these to supplement the multi-billion-dollar loses in its overseas/abroad defective investments at the same time, vehemently increase the already exorbitant salary for the million-dollar-ministers of the miw, do not forget Singpower is under the total control of Temasek Holding!!

Can not defeat foreigners in their countries end-up defective investments than, milk Singaporeans for the survivals of the “cash-life-line” for the miw and their cronies, “milk produce/comes from the cash-cow”, my dear!

###Singaporeans are always the easiest and quickest targets to cash-out in time of urgency with immediate effect###!!!

shihan is a good interviewer. better than those we get from the msm. well done!

Mr. Leong Sze Hian for Minister for National Development any day! :)

Just look at that Mah Bow Tan …Do you think MBT will disclose HDB figures to you ..and bring light to your pressing questions? I doubt so..

Like a bad record spinning, MBT will only tell you, “Flats are affordable…”

VOTE Mah Bow Tan OUT!

The only thing left for us to do after watching this wonderful video is

1. reach out to all apathetic , still living in oblivion joes and jills and have them spend 8 short minutes of their time to really understand the contents of this video.
If they still cannot wake up after this, give up on them is also the right thing to do since it means they are hopeless cases.

But how can these be reached given that by definition apathetic people pathetically will not visit and read alternative websites?

Is the lack of answer for so long not a valid reason for a stronger opposition?
How is so-called subsidy quantified given the people do not know the cost of construction?

A doctorate of Finance sees a problem. Does the majority of the supporters of u-know-who still avoid this issue? If so, why and what is the effect of your stand on the rest of the population especially those over 100,000 households earning less than 2k a month?

The cpf contribution is very little or insignificant to many who earn much more than 4500 given that any basic salary above this sum is not subject to contribution into cpf. You can see who is affected most.

If you supporters still have conscience in you, tell me your reason why here is no need to reveal the construction cost of HDB. The burden will be on you to prove beyond reasonable doubt the why.

come lets debate if you are confident enough of yourselves.

I suspect you won’t even will respond here unless you are confident.

I like the chicken rice analogy. MBT should know Singaporean are not stupid to believe flats are indeed subsidise based on market subsidy methodology. PAPies have been using the word “affordable” for far too long to con Singaporean. No wonder their cash flow keep growing.

Sad days ahead of Sinkies if we keep voting them in to be the gahmen.

So, am i right to say that we base this discussion on statistics given by them?
hmmmmm…….

Leong Sze Hian has again exposes the fallacious reasoning of the PAP.

The PAP has been caught misrepresenting to the public on the affordability of HDB houses.

Mah B. T. are you misleading the public? If not, you better explain how come the HDB’s coffers are getting bigger and yet you claim the HDB is losing money??

It is shocking to hear that the about 210,000 household income is dropping by 1.7% per year for the last 10 years. So compared to 10 years ago they are about 18% poorer.

At the same time the PAP ministers salaries have increased by astronomically.

This is obscene. We need a change of government.

Vote the PAP out, especially Mah Boh Tan.

How can PAP government ministers refuse to give the actual construction cost of HDB even after repeated requests in parliament?

Mr. Leong Sze Hian should be voted into parliament.

If there is a new gonmin in future, i wonder, will we the peas… i mean dwellers get to know what is the construction cost and how much ’subsidy’ we each actually got?

will accounting business boom if it takes decades to dig?

will we know how many got lobang from ….. ?

is there a god? why? ‘cos my halo already gone.

sincerely
Russell de House

6) Chin Tu Lang on December 29th, 2009 4.58 pm
“I like the chicken rice analogy. MBT should know Singaporean are not stupid to believe flats are indeed subsidise based on market subsidy methodology.”

But why and how did MbT never get voted out?

Agree with #10.

regards
kamangutra

Despite its professed role of providing affordable public housing for citizens, HDB is nothing more than a tool for the regime to control Singaporeans and keep itself in power. Only when the majority of Singaporeans wake up to this fact can there be change for the better here.

To #10 & 11

Because Sinkies are smart but ballless. They are afraid of CHANGE. What so bad about CHANGE ? “When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.” Quote from Austrian Neurologist Viktor Frankl

That why I said “Sad days ahead of Sinkies …………..”

If 66 pct do not wake up now, your are correct to ask why MBT never get voted out.

There have been so many answers we don’t get to hear, i fear before 2010, i may burst into flames.

One thing for sure, it is becoming more and more affordable to replace the likes of Mah B T with a new govt. It will be a bonus if a new law is passed whereby any previous intention to hoodwink citizens on public housing matters is deemed a serious offence.

I fully concur that Leong Sze Hian should be in parliament and more.
It is crystal clear who has the citizens’ interest at heart.

Maybe I should rent a stall from HDB to sell chicken rice. I will sell each plate at $4. Then I will ask HDB to lower / even eliminate my rental because I suffer a “loss” of $5 for each plate of chicken rice sold – since a restaurant in some five star hotel sells chicken rice at $9.

Don’t forget the IRAS just intro and forced a new property tax payable by 31 Jan 2010. Check your TV licence, it’s billed together. It’s not just $110 TV licence amount anymore. Add another $200+ more at least.

Mother F*@!@^%king bastards blatantly robbing us without FEAR!

Given a choice, not just VOTE out these demons but JAIL all of them for crimes against the people. End of discussion!!!!!

EVEN IF YOU VOTED IN SECOND-GRADE OPPOSITIONS INTO PARLIAMENT IS MUCH BETTER THAN VOTING AGAIN A SELF-PROCLAIMED FIRST-CLASS PAP GOVERNMENT- THEY ARE JUST A LOAD OF RUBBISH!

And it’s no wonder MBT just came out with another ‘bogey man’ theory of fixed pricing HDB and how that will not make you ‘richer’ in Today… Well done TOC !
You are pressurizing them.

To the 66.6% – Can you see what is happening here? Are you blind? Without pressure or a check, you will not see or know anything that goes on whether it is right or wrong. WAKE UP and Take Responsibility for YOUR CHILDREN’S FUTURE BACK!

In the latest TV interviews, private housing going to go up 2010 and MBT said he would have options to keep housing affordable by distributing more lands and more launches.

How come Dawson flats are at $700,000? ??And the peak executive still selling at $1.2M after 2 years??? They claimed all are oversubscribed by X times. Affordable?

Inconvenient truths to the thesis of unaffordability:

— “9,865 Singaporeans have applied for 1,718 Build-to-Order (BTO) flats at the Dawson estate in Queenstown, or six times oversubscribed.

– ‘the five-room flats which are the most expensive, have proved to be the most popular with over 2,000 applicants vying for the 200 units for offer.”

Fairer criticism would be that the govmin should be building more to meet pent-up demand.

we have 100,000 family earning 1000 or less, and another 1000 family earning 2000 or less.

May I ask HDB if you are earning 1000 or less, or even 2000 or less, how much CPF contribution do you have to afford a HDB flat?

Assuming the lowest HDB flat is 160,000 (You still need to raise at least 3-5k for fitting etc and there is still the renovations), a poor family would have to folk out 650 dollars on a monthly period over 30 years.

Note: They cant buy a studio flat since they r not 55 year old and they need to buy a 3 rm flat. I wonder how they can buy a Queentown and a AMK flat priced at 280k?

They have only 350 dollars left for food, for their spouse and their children…and the ever expensive ulities bills? Property tax bill, tv license, children school fees etc.

And oh yes, they dont have CPF, because they earn too little, so they rather they be paid in cash.

How is it affordable?

Even if a family earns 2000 or less, is it still affordable?

Remember our gov says earning a salary of 2mil is called peanuts. They cant even survive on 2mil, and you expect some1 to survive on 2k or less? What is the logic, may I ask? How come over 800HDB got confiscated last year? 800 families lost their homes every year…is that what HDB meant by affordability? And it is only a lease of 99 years.

If the PAP can give us a good answer, we will be happy.

And oh yes, add in the transport costs too, to get to work. So expensive!

15) CBF govt on December 29th, 2009 6.19 pm
“One thing for sure, it is becoming more and more affordable to replace the likes of Mah B T with a new govt.”

Just a wonderful dream i just had:

Mr Leong alone can be both the PM as well as the Finance chief at the same time. This , i think, is possible as someone may have done it before. Though , of course KJ fits the shoe just nicely if not better. CJ can be the brother.

TKL can be President cum MM especially for Finance and Investments, LTK as Labor chief (see how apt?), Sylvia as chief of crime busting and investigations, .

SKH as Minister of Law, Braema as Minister for National Development cum president of Aware.

Mr Brown as Minister for Sports and Entertainment cum Casino
.
The rest of the cabinet can be fielded by those who wish to join the new gonmin party but at huge cuts or can be fielded by leading contributing exco members of RP, WP and NSP (GMS contributed in mini bon fiasco get-money-back voice up).

The rest can be grassroots leaders with calibre like smiley Seah ah rong. or serve and sacrifice for the people like accepting responsibilities as MPs, Directors and senior management of positions that can be available with Restructuring for better tomorrow.

Last ain’t not least, a conglomerate of private accounting firms both SMEs and international MNCs consulting firms can be formed do peform a once in a life time or half century housekeeping if not checking to get the answers asked by many. Of course, only if these are of public interest and legally and constitutionally acceptable and approved by the chief executive and president .

I woke up and found that this is still a dream.

16) commentator on December 29th, 2009 6.59 pm
“Maybe I should rent a stall from HDB to sell chicken rice. I will sell each plate at $4. Then I will ask HDB to lower / even eliminate my rental because I suffer a “loss” of $5 for each plate of chicken rice sold – since a restaurant in some five star hotel sells chicken rice at $9. ”

Hey , could this be a gimmick used by chicken rice hawkers especially those who newly become chicken rice sellers after the recession costed them their silver-collar jobs? Imagine, the put a signboard there while people queue up buy their rice? Feel value added right?

See, can learn so many new things applicable to ownself. Kudos to Mr Leong.

#6: ((Sad days ahead of Sinkies if we keep voting them in to be the gahmen.))

Stop putting the blame on the people for “keep voting them in”. First, are the people allowed to vote in a free and fair elections? Are the media free and pluralistic to report on alternative views for the people to decide on who should be voted in?

Second, why a dept under the prime minister’s office conducts the so-called elections to make sure the opposition in “fixed” and election results are “engineered”? Why the prime minister, a person with a high stake in the outcome of “elections” announces cooling-off period and other “electoral” rules and regulations that deprive half of the electorate from voting at every “general elections”?

Only the PAP and its apologists and sycophants in its propaganda rag claim that the people support the ruling party with 66.6 per cent votes. And this constant monumental lie is subconsciously accepted as fact by even those claiming to oppose the PAP and regurgitated in places like TOC, blaming the people for continuing to support the PAP.

No one in the right mind would support a regime whose so-called ministers demand and help themselves to millions of dollars in what they call salary while the vast majority is lectured constantly to strive for “cheaper, better and faster” economic growth. Growth for whom?

Stop insulting the people who are being subjected to constant fear, leading a life of uncertainty under a ruthless dictatorial regime based on greed and corruption.

Mr Leong is not a poor man by sg standard.
Even though he is not affected as much as poorer citizens are by policies (eg. CPF, HDB ….), he take it upon himself to voice up for these people and the People in general.

He need not do so having gone into partial retirement.

But i am grateful that he did.

So many highly paid people ignore the problems of the people knowing what is going on. To these, i shout at you “Shame on YOU!” pui!

The govt got 66% of the votes from those who were able to cast. The rest got a walkover. To the extent of how many ppl really support PAP will really be determined by an island wide election, if that ever comes. I still suspect i will get a walkover next election. Have not seen opposition and the MPs are still as unseen as ever.

#28: ((To the extent of how many ppl really support PAP will really be determined by an island wide election, if that ever comes.))

The entire electorate was given a chance to vote in the first ever presidential election in 1993, after a 30-year absence of an island-wide election.

To the utter shock of the PAP bigwigs, that election proved a disaster in that the majority voted for the candidate not supported by the ruling party.

The result: The subsequent two presidential elections came and went without any contest, leading to Singaporeans having a “non-elected elected president”! Uniquely Singapore.

@29

Alas, Mr Ong…missing the People President even now.

HDB is a major tool of political control for PAP government. Together with CPF, the government is the landlord, developer and mortgage provider of more than 80% of the population in this country. It has absolute control over pricing. It is time that housing especially low cost housing should be open to private developers. Market force wlll then be more influencial then the political agenda of the dominant governing party. HDB should just focus on making housing affordable for every citizen.

#31),
Agree with you that HDB must be reformed. Just curious to know if Lee & Lee still has monopoly over legal matters with HDB?

#28

No. We got nominated president. ))))

So if Opposition wins GE in freak election and army dosn’t intervene, how can a nominated president stand up to the elected govmin? His mandate was from MIW not the people.

@ SC Kang,
“I woke up and found that this is still a dream”.

Good for you to be able to have such dreams. It shows you have not given up hope. lol

I tend to believe most endeavours start with some kind of dream.
Afterall, LKY himself started off with a dream, but his dream is turning into a nightmare for many Sporeans. Obscene HDB prices, invasion of FTrash,….

ps: I have similar dreams too except I will be given the task to recover from those
stooges money made during their term in office.

I ask a simplest of all questions to you the so-called highly educated:

Q: Who knows how many would have voted for the PAP if there is no walkover?

A: ???

See if you can answer this question.

Does the DOS knows too?

Spread your knowledge to all around you. To the young, to the old, to your peers, to your opponents. Let them understand politics is important, politics affects even those who do not care, and their generations after.

It might be a wonderful feeling to be with people on your side, but it is much more important and satisfying to challenge the ideas of those who oppose you and planting a winning seed in their minds. We do not need to convert the converted.

We do not much time before the next GE, let’s have positive influence on all around you, everywhere you go. If you have positive passion, people will listen.
If you belong to a walkover GRC ( very difficult to get over this ridiculous nonsense, but since what is offered is a ‘dirty game’, let’s learn the rules and be creative ), make your ideals influence the ticks in the ballots.

Let’s make your silenced voices count. Let us make sure everyone around you do not get used to their limited rights and information.

Can we do this?

Hi,

i’m eagerly waiting for part 2 :-)

thanks.

His take of the statistics soundso much like the army…during IPPT test and SOC test…in order to up the company/platoon performance during the test…Soldiers that regularly failed the test during training are make to report sick so that the performance percentage will not bring the company down…
I wondered how many retired generals are working for the HDB. Kudos to Mr Leong for the Chicken rice analogy…I am getting sick of chicken rice.

#1
Electricity bills going up next month…..

Since Singapore Power (SP) has been privatised by the govt for no good reason, the bills have been shooting up like a rocket!

Claiming is the fuel pricing to be blamed.
But when the fuel price came down, the cost still remain high up….

Does the govt care? Nope they don’t.
The govt is to make sure SP pay tax on time.

PAP is only waiting for the Casinos opening in 2010. They are hoping through casinos taxes, will give the PAP a change to “rebate any costs” to its citizens.

where is part 2?

Alamak,

Even if u vote MBT out, no PAP selected minister of National Development will tell u how much is the breakdown of govt income from HDB, IRAS, LTA, etc profit generating stat boards. Our democratic political system is such that the ruling party RULES! The opposition can only make noise in their own turf. Think man, think…

These stat boards are sophisticated financial institutions that our Govt scholars have come up with. Thank goodness the scholarships did not go to waste as these scholars returned to make more money for the govt. Fantastic ROI! Of course, these high flyers can chose to migrate, and become a high flying advisor like Th**sin who defected to another country… the obscene salary is to retain the talent… makes perfect sense now.

Why should you complain about rising cost of flats? Look from the angle of a flat owner, not a flat buyer. Which other thing in Singapore appreciates in value with age?? Your car? Your chicken rice? Base on statistics (historical evidence, gut feel, hearsay, common sense) while you service your flat loan, the value of the flat increases more than to cover the interest paid for the loan. Isnt that wonderful? Just buy and loan, sure Win! I only complain that they only restrict the players to married couples and singles older than 35yrs old.

Come on, let me in the game… before the bubble burst.

Thank you , Mr Leong for this good explanation.

Ridley believe it or not

During the 2009 economic crisis, when US slashed lending interest rates to help the people cope, the Sin Gov did not do any adjustments.

When private housing fall by 30-50% during the 2008-2009 period, PAP gov public housing increased by 30%. What is the logic?

When other countries simulate the economy by giving money or coupons to the people, the Sin Gov hit an idea and give us the Job Credits. This benefit the huge gov link companies by giving them cash. What about those hit already and jobless? No help. Ask them to go for upgrading, pay money and it call ‘Subsidy’ already and the Upgraders Helpers are again, gov link companies and they made money.

In the entire world, the gov will determine their taxes on a yearly or a few years basis but the Sin Gov have a grander idea to up taxes. They made all taxes on a quarterly basis. Every 3 months, they will come together to decide whether they want to up electricity bills, erp, transport, conservative charges, water bills etc. Any Gov more power than this?

One would have think by having so much taxes, we r a welfare state, but no. Where all our money gone to?

During the 80s, the later Minister in charge of HDB was irony caught for corruption and commit sucide. Without his help to shape and make HDB affordable, we couldnt have a golden period during the 80s and early 90s where the people have spare money. Such irony that we have much of singapore prosperity owed to ‘him’. Now we have uncorrupt ministers but hell yes, greedy and thirsty for money.

Other countries have 1 PM or 1 President, we have a superior superior PM, 1 superor PM and 13+ senior ministers, posts that were specifically created for them. This goes against democacry. Did we ask for it? Did the people voted for such posts? Only in Sin, can u see such a thing.

Truly Uniquely Singapore indeed.

[...] – TOC: Year In Review: HDB flats – subsidy, affordability, prices. – Singapore Alternatives: Mah Bow Tan “Caught off [...]

My definition of “affordable” means able to pay for something in full at one go in cold hard cash. If you HAVE TO get a loan for something, it’s not truly affordable – as far as you are concerned.

No Part Two?

[...] 1 is here: Year In Review: HDB flats – subsidy, affordability, prices. Related [...]

They can’t just increase HDB Flats prices just because how many times oversubscribe.
This is Public Housing, MBT. Like you can’t increase public transport prices because every morning the buses and MRT always crowded.
Maybe HDB should partner with Singapore Pools. For Q number 1 will receive a $100k subsidy for the flat of their choice. Number 2 $80k, Number 3 $60k, Number 4-50 will each receive $40k. Please note: subsidies will be deducted from your sales proceeds should you sell your property after 5 years of minimum occupancy.

Mr Leong you mentioned every year people ask about the actual cost of HDB flat but there are no answers always.

1) Do Singpaoreans have the right to know the actual cost?

2) Do HDB have the right to keep the actual cost secret?

Mr LSH,

Sharing of experience:

As part of SOP, when a point is to be published, it has to be supported by data from certain statistic. So this was the conversation that took place:

Self confessed professional statistician (S) : Sir, what conclusion that you want to derive from this data?

Boss (B): That it is white in color.

Personal Secretary to Boss (P) : But then majority of our data is black. What to do??

S : Don’t worry. As a professional statistician, it is my job to find the right data sampling, with the right statistic method, to produce the right conclusion, that it is white in color.

P : But how can you do that?

S : Leave it to me.

B : That is why I need professional to be around. They know how to work things out in proper way.

So, in simple statistics terms, this is what S did:

1. S tried to find a very complex and recursive sampling procedure that will generate a sampling data that has majority white in color. (Please note that the actual data is majority black in color).
2. Then S tried a find a matching statistic method to produce the desired outcome, that is a conclusion that it is white in color.
3. Having all steps1 and 2 completed, then S and P work together to find justification to each of the above steps, both in statistic and in layman terms.
4. Final conclusion is submitted to B for brainstorming. All likely questions are mapped out, and corresponding answer are formulated.

So, I guess that explains some points that you mentioned about statistic. But then again, not all statistician belong to this category. Many still have true good heart.

aiyoyo

really blur leh, 3room now cost ~S$250000,

how to survive?

economy dont know recover or not?

pray 2010 can help all people in this country…

aiyoyo

Look below the U-tube screen after you are done with Part 1 and you will see part 2.

cpf (if not)…. is the largest bank if to be compared to the 3 local banks….. like co-operative funds that can be easily and readily provided…. however, being a trustee institution, till date, there is no annually audited figures published for the public for viewing.

interestingly, each and every time, cpf is tweaked with petite interest adjusted, is still unable to meet with the ever increased inflation cost.

for the younger generation, getting to be married before age 30 and a hugh housing loans for 25 – 30 years. By then, both in age 60 – so today cpf for the younger generation is to pay for your H igh D ebt B urdens. don even think that both cpf are sufficient for your gracfully retirement.

ThinkAll @”Debt becomes a social, economic and political control.”
LKY publicly said it is his intention to get singaporeans into debt (read: heavy debt) as a way for them to “have a stake in the system” and not “rock the boat”.
The unsuspecting usual singaporean may think nothing about this and might even agree with him, yes people need to be motivated to work and work towards the better good of singapore – but they only need to realize that this means the PAP government is literally imposing crippling indirect taxes on the people and subject them to a lower standard of living which they would otherwise have. (which could develop a viable domestic market – never quite understood the PAP argument that domestic market is based solely on population size. surely disposable income is a better gauge?)
To add insult to injury, the huge capital proceeds from land and property sales are funneled and redirected eventually to our GLCs Temasek, GIC…etc which suddenly owes no transparency or obligation, or for that matter, pay interest to the people of singapore whose money they used.
Not to mention singapore is a highly volatile economy with no social safety net. High debt exacerbates the financial and social stress on singaporeans which indirectly leads to low, almost non-existent birth rates, which leads to the PAP government having the excuse to import foreigners which further increases the social stress factor.
So perhaps singaporeans should stop and think about the symptoms of their lives and question the root causes of them.

35) Wahahaha! on December 30th, 2009 2.56 pm
I ask a simplest of all questions to you the so-called highly educated:

Q: Who knows how many would have voted for the PAP if there is no walkover?
A: ???
See if you can answer this question.
Does the DOS knows too?

Not be surprise if they can cooked up a story later and the whole nation would be a total walkover without anymore GE by just telling you more and more people are threatening the internal security of the nation, possible? yes of course!

It’s an absolute disgrace! Based on MBT’s shameless abuse of “statistics”, we can even conclude that Ferraris are afforable cause most Ferrari owners can afford them.

I saved and saved over many years with my meagre pay to pay and pay for a flat i hope to buy to get married.

Now , all have to be delayed. The price went up again just when i thought i was getting near. The goal post shifted , again, so to speak.

sigh.

i must stop this madness. I have decided. Its this time or no more chance. I dare not imagine my future.

Here is a new artcile regarding surge in HDB prices that I hope will be useful to you:

http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/news/2010/1/27071/hdb-resale-prices-surge-3-8-to-hit-record-high

prepare to move out of singapore if pap wins again. let the 66.6percent enjoy this country……

[...] – TOC: Year In Review: HDB flats – subsidy, affordability, prices. – Singapore Alternatives: Mah Bow Tan “Caught off guard”? – TOC: HDB flats – a [...]

A 5 room HDB in the East was posted in Property Guru with an aksing price of $990,000! Total absudity!

tiredsingaporean on 3 January: Two quotes come to mind.

#1 “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

#2 “Think of the press as a great keyboard on which the government can play.”

Joseph Goebbels is not exactly the role model most of us would want for anything Singaporean…

Have we forgotten that some 38,000 HDB flats were left unsold for a few years sometime around 2001 .Then HDB started the “5 minutes” flat sales…where one can buy a flat in just a few minutes!
And it’s not hard to sell HDB flats anymore when our gates are wide open to so-called “Foreign Talents” .The influx of FTs has since artificially created demand for flats and its spiralling prices.
But the PAP’s quick-fix has overlooked the social costs and burden to Singaporeans…