Photos by: Terry Xu and Shawn Danker/
Note from the TOC team: Part Two of the Face to Face 2 forum was delayed due to technical difficulties. We apologise for the inconvenience.
This is Part Two of a set of two video clips. Part One is available HERE. Transcripts will be available soon
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Some one was talking abt rocking boat.. esp if TJS is elected to the office.
In fact, PAP had rocked the boat when it came to power in 1959.. Hijacked Sg’s parliamentary democracy and used mass arrests, draconian laws and fear tactics to force ppl to accept one party and dynastic rule.
Whereas the power of EP is limited under the constitution. Refer to the bill of EP system initiated by LKY, it is to check the gov on reserve and majoy items listed in the constitution. So we should vote for a right person to have the gut and capacity to check the gov rather than getting a PAP puppet to dance with PM and his team.
@SGVoice,
“I was sitting in the front and… ”
As the people who sat in the front row were there on invitation, and kindly took their time out to attend the forum, do note that it is highly inappropriate to claim to be one of them if you are not.
@candidate
“in any case, gay rights is a political cause unless you can point me to a country where it isn’t”
Of course, hundred years ago, the pesky women fighting for women’s right to vote,was a bad political cause.
So are the blacks trying to have equal rights as the whites.
@ivoteahmeng +Online Citizen,
My Son, Steven is an Asshole, he gave me wrong information all the time .
Anyway ,thanks for update,I will teach my Son ,Steven to behave himself and not ‘distort” or give “false” impression next time.
I say ,Vote for Tan Jee Say !
This forum is well appreciated by me and friends. The PAPees have an overwhelming majority in Parliment. The constitution of Singapore had been changed many many times. When His excellency OTC went against the grail, the parliment amended the constitution to curb his Powers. So the next Independent President will face the same.
PRIME MINISTER MUST HOLD TONY TAN RESPONSIBLE FOR BILLIONS LOST IN TWO FOREIGN BANKS. TONY WAS BORN INTO A BANKING DYNASTY AND WAS FINANCE MINISTER http://singaporereserves.blogspot.com
T0C should sell it to mediacorp and broadcast on Ch5…
@haha
Yup they were and still are political causes.
My say after watching this video :
Both TJS and TKL have done reasonably well.
They are willing to challenge the boundaries of the presidency office. The office of President will only evolve if the elected president is prepared to think out of the box. Tony Tan comes across as an arrogant person. He simply doesn’t have a view of his own on many issues. TCB is too conservative who will only carry out his role as a president within the limitations of the constitution.
Let’s us all unite behind TJS. If TJS is elected to president’s office, it will be a wake up call to the ruling party. Only with TJS as president, the government will be kept on their toes and the ruling party will then have a grater political will to address the underlying causes of Singaporeans’ unhappiness with the government.
To address your unhappiness with the ruling party, please do that during the GE, not during the presidential election. If TJS is voted solely because he speaks against the ruling party, then it is a sad state of affairs.
People need to vote with a clear mind, on who is the most suitable presidential candidate, instead of with emotions.
The way TJS rallies clearly shows that he is banking on the anti-PAP sentiments to win more votes. But as a president, can he truly achieve that huge list of things he promised? I doubt so. A role of the president is different from that of a MP, mind you. Low TK, Chen SM and Sylvia Lim will probably achieve much more for the people than he can.
I just find him lacking the clear mindset, credibility and demeanor befitting that of a president.
@SGvoice
Precisely! That is why I don’t trust TJS, he just gives me the impression he is championing for his own political agenda. Not to mention that I read that TJS was rejected when wanting to join WP, which makes one wonder on the reasons for the rejection. If TJS is that good, why wasn’t he accepted into WP or even into the WP dream team?
Sure, I voted for the Opposition. TJS as President, NO way. Sylvia, maybe a yes. A change does not mean an unsuitable person as President-it is like cutting off one’s nose to spite face. The more TJS speaks, the more votes go to TT. Sigh.
TJS gave a straight answer “NO” he is not against 377A but TKL never even heard of it when the whole of Singapore was AWARE of it and it was Hot!HoT!Hot! for weeks in MSM and internet.
Where was he???? checking CPF,Insurance & Bonds???? Ah!!!!! money first leh.
We need a President to WORK WITH THE GOVT for all Singaporeans’ interest and not work for the govt counter our interest! All of us are already very tired at least for the last 12 years. I HAVE TRIED MY BEST BY DOING NOTHING!!! That’s not the way to go if we Singaporean wish to move forward.
We need a President who is righteous and have no fear when face with obstacles with the govt(Please do not use your head to bang the wall)
From TOC 2 part series, I know who is the best person suited for the job. Campaign slogan etc are just a promotion flyer. You can’t really see or hear a good candidate’s unless you watch them speak from their head and heart.
Well it’s an Mt Everest task ahead if elected but NEVER BE A QUITTER even if you failed to make the govt accept good policy. Many into politic already lost their soul and sold their principles. But sometime you bend a little will do. Good luck “the man”.
I voted PAP in GE2011 because the oppo in my GRC was very weak. But I will vote TSJ for President this Sat!
Looks like those who vote for the opposition are thinking twice about tan jee say…
Same here, I say we vote for the most likely winner other than Tony tan,
That is, tan Cheng bock…
Pro singapore22 August 2011
Looks like those who vote for the opposition are thinking twice about tan jee say…
……………
wah your crystall ball just renew a spotlight?
you can read the voters minds?
TT has no opinion, no answers. All he does is to dodge questions and defend his masters. We do not need another President who will act as a guard dog for the PAP. Let us all unite and vote in TJS to be OUR WATCH DOG to check on the government and hold it accountable. Let us wipe the smirk off the white phony’s face.
Eugene Tan, has a lot of worry that the people, have over expect fm the EP, And the EP promise too much to the voter, As usual someone from the Law School, prefer every thing work straight within the Law _ The EP constitution, event tough President should be above partisan,but is part of the politic,law & constitution are man made, and always made from the leader & group who given mandate by the people, So the Elected President who too given mandate by the people, can INITIATE a constitution change, in due process of law, when he found it necessary for the benefits of the people, so don’t worry too much.
Can we please have transcripts to all these videos? Can’t really view these videos at work. No patience to sit through either.
At 6:46, it says ‘Dr. Tan Kin Lian’
Mr Tan Jee Say has the best potential to be the President that Singapore has been missing all these years. He is already 90% there, the rest 10% will be polished as he gains experience in mingling with dignitaries.
Mannerism is secondary because it can be corrected & takes a bit of experience. Primarily, the passion, the heart & the belief have to be in the right place, ie for the people.
Jan
In a nutshell, you don’t want anybody who speaks against the establishment even if it bullies its own people, to be President. Sorry, we are voting for someone for Singapore & Singaporeans, NOT someone for the PAP/Govt. I think YOU are in the wrong game, NOT Mr Tan Jee Say.
Let me guess the logic behind some PAP ka kias. They think that Singapore is owned by PAP, so in order to stay safely in Sg, we better vote THEIR MAN. Ya, don’t rock the boat or your owners will disown you. Pathetic! Are Singaporeans really that daft?
The idea that gonmin must always be right,
And questioning estab is wrong and
We should Trust without demanding evidence is
Qing Dynasty thinking and not 1st world well travelled well educated thinking.
Else we need millions more FT .
@Michelle-
Back in the 1960′s , people would probably catch hold of “Traitors” like them (Bootlickers ) and put them into a “Pig’s Basket”, before submerging them into the sea to be “drowned” .
These Bootlickers are probably ‘shitting”in their pants now if they were to lose again.
Some of these belonged to the Well fed ,whilst many are just “wannabe’s”
TT … “there will be a female president in the future” and who has managed (lost) billion of funds! Your guess as good as my?
Singaporeans are either politically correct or cowards because they do not dare to mention the ISA, except behind closed doors. This has led the ISA to deepen its hold on us and take us one by one like chickens for the slaughter for 50 years. If some chickens protest by clucking they are immediately corrected by other chickens advising not to mention the obscene fact of our collective lives. So for 50 years the ISD can pick and choose select chickens for the slaughter. At least Tan Jee Say spoke up about the ISD and when stopped he strenuously protested. I salute TJS for his courage and I hope that when he is elected he remains as courageous and will make outbursts at the Government whenever the citizenry gets a raw deal. Out bursts like this clear the air and may even prevent an uprising like the Arab Spring. At any rate, this business of the ISA keeping the PAP in power is obscene and provocative. Its prime movers should be hauled up to the UN Human Rights Council. The prime movers are not in the ISD itself as they are all foot-soldiers but hallowed parliamentarians, now white haired or hairless but still having the lust for life.
“bullying Political Opponents”.
Yes,they are perfect at these.
Look at how WP Mp Chen was “prevented” from attending the 7th Month Ghost festival dinner . ( see Tre )
Just look at how HDB could quietly and quickly “transfer the lease of sites in Alj to PA” and now preventing social Organisers to invite the WP mps to such
events. ( see Sylvia comments )
Don’t knw what to say about all these “Dogs”.
And the Loong Dog can still tell people to work together ?
i think its a smart move from TT to make TJS angry… :P
The call to elect a President that will not be constantly questioning the government on policies is a specious one. At first sight, it sounds logical and appealing to those who argues that there shouldn’t be an alternative centre of power to the elected government. However, a closer examination of this line of thinking reveals several flaws.
The Constitution clearly mandated the Elected President with the task of protection of our Reserves. As envisaged by the government this meant not allowing it to draw down the Reserves for frivolous spending.
The incumbent government obviously didn’t intend that they should be questioned on their policy making decisions and rightly so too. However, insofar as to government policies that will impact our Reserves somewhere down the line in the future it stands to reason the Elected President not only has a moral obligation but a duty to question the government and challenge it vigorously.
Try imagining the duties of a parent. Chief among many others is the duty to ensure that the child is adequately prepared to compete in society and make a good living. There are many bad habits a parent has to prevent the child from acquiring, e.g. smoking, gambling, drinking, taking drugs, etc. A parent can take a passive role by stopping the child from doing any of these bad habits when he or she sees it. Or he can take an active role by ensuring the child never got to the point whereby the child will be tempted or compelled – imagined the child associating with bad people – to do so.
One could argue that the duty of a parent is to provide the child with love and let nature takes its course. If your child insist on smoking and mixing with bad companies, where it is quite obvious he or she will have a bleak future, can the parent do nothing and still claim he has performed his parental duties admirably? No!
If the Elected President realised that impending or even current government policies will lead to the drawdown, weakening, or dissipation of our Reserves should he remain silent for fear of intruding into OB (Out of Bound) Markers? Or, should he take a back seat and simply wait for the inevitable day when he can tell the government ‘I told you so’ and then refuse to sign off on any drawdown of our Reserves?
It is not difficult to imagine when that day arrives the country will be in economic mess and any loss of confidence by the market of its future will push the country over the edge. Try putting yourself in the shoes of the President at that crucial moment when everything he foresaw years ago came true. He will be confronting a real moral dilemma he refused or was prevented from confronting years ago.
It is a Hobson’s choice he will be facing. Saying no to the government’s drawdown of the Reserves can lead to economic ruin for the country and the blame for it falls on the President. Saying yes will only encourage an emboldened government to continue its wasteful and profligate waywardness.
A look down the road tells us we need a strong Elected President that is prepared to be confrontational insofar as the protection of our Reserves is concerned. We need a President that will not remain silent and happily collect his S$4 million annual salary regularly even when told he can’t be informed of the true state of our Reserves because it will take 56 man-year to compute.
In my book only one man has shown the moral courage to do this job: Tan Jee Say. He has shown his mettle staring down Tony Tan’s veiled threats on the ISA issue. The other two hopefuls were merely opportunistic spectators with wet dreams of the annual S$4 million salary, hoping to die rich – I can’t imagine how anyone can ever finish spending so much money in one lifetime in Singapore.
Fellow Singaporeans,
One of the insights I gleamed from the debate; is the “new normal” that TT alluded to. A new normal that on one hand has allowed new voices to be found, silent voices to be heard. Voices that tell the govt that we, as a people, will not go away quietly, will not allow abuses to go uncheck. We want accountability and transparency. We also like our way of life. We choose meritocracy- where the best can surface- whether in academics or in life. We want the clean streets, demand affordable but quality healthcare.
On the other hand, the new normal is unsettling, and leaves me to ponder on a few questions.
1. What are the standards we have for our leaders?
We have objected to TPL/ NS-Dodger but they sneaked through the GRC. By that same measure, so did 2 members of the WP did. Bet Big Lose Big.
By the same measure above, we should also object to Nic Seah, TJS. Wait a minute, we did. They went to the polls and the people spoke.
2. “In the name of liberalism, I trample on yours”
Please respect the choices of the 60.1%. They are not daft, not blind, not illiterate, not cowed in fear, not a boot-licker, ass-kisser and whatever names you have chosen.
The majority – yes the majority have rejected James Gomez and his healthcare in the hdb void deck idea (how to find drs may i ask?). They have rejected the “drop in the ocean” 60b dollar plan. They have NOT forgotten how Aware tried to teach our children the NEW Normal.
And in light of this New Normal- I only ask us to be rational. None of the candidates exactly fit my bill to be a independent EP that has also the decorum to represent Singapore at the World Stage (where we compete). But one candidate spells danger for me- TJS
By the same brush that tarnish TT with favoritism, we should also ask “how” did TJS win the Singtel deal (pull a few strings perhaps?- links to GCT perhaps?)
We choose to be blind and blinded by his thinly veiled hatred for his rejection. He has been rejected by the govt, the private sector, the voters of Holland-BT (where the A team of SDP was fielded). He is a man with unfulfilled ambition. He wants to use 60b to win votes (the exact reason why a EP is put there for).
We are only 46 years old. Only middle age. In the scheme of things, our wealth is temporal at best. Liberalism has to be tempered with pragmatism. Don’t be emotive. Do something for your community to better your fellow citizens. Voting in TJS as a CSJ proxy is not going to do Singapore good.
Voting for any of them will do Singapore no good.
Elected president law should be abolished.
Appointing a holy man to be president is far more safer. This will guarantee peace and prosperity.
@ The Tan Jee Say You Should Know
You’re absolutely right!
If you give a jobless person a job now, he would be so grateful (especially when worl recession is looming near). And he knows deep down that he’s worth at best half a million!
(Well, his last position was a private investor after his last stint with a big bank. So many uncles out there in Raffles Place are also working as private investors)
To all his supporters – why keep harping on his starting job in MTI and later as assistant to the then PM Goh? He has to serve out his bond right, after taking government’s fund to study? And that was probably his first and last decent and proud appointment.
See what happened after that – changed jobs every 2-4 years!
Because he thought the various jobs were not good enough for him??
Because he wants to serve the nation by making sure he can do ‘check and balance’ on the ruling government?
Or because he thinks only he’s fit to take up the noble call of an EP?
We want to move towards a First Class nation and society, and by pointing fingers and almost barking in front of an audience just shows that he’s unable to manage his anger and emotion. I wouldn’t want an employee like him, let alone a pubic figure to represent our beloved Singapore.
Doesn’t need a genius to know who possesses all the credentials among them, and above all, who doesn’t need this kind of pay to start off with?
The race for EP appears close if you read the alternive social media but in my mind the choice is going to be driven by the following selection criterias with equal weighting::
1. Does the President have decorum in its interaction with other as evident from his body language, choice of words and mannerism
2. Can he engage intelligently with world leaders and yet show humility and understanding when dealing with all strata of Singapore Society
3. Does he have clearity of thought and able to commu nicate it in well defined words
4. Can he be independent in his interaction with the government on matters of national interest and civil soceity
None of the EP candates telecast on state TV can provide me with the above answers. The turning point was ‘The On Line Citizien” forum with the 4 EP candidates. I watched closely each of the candidates and rerun the segments to try to fathom each of them. And only 2 candidates come close to the above selection critiria of which Tony Tan is the clear winner unless you want a President who is mirred in rhetoric
TJS has one good property if he is a frying pan – non-stick, better term “Telfon”.
Can’t you see nothing sticks on him as far as any responsibility is called for. Just keeping saying “I don’t know …”, “I don’t understand …”, “I wasn’t privy to …”, “I did not promise …”.
Just imagine when he’s being asked to account or explain for any unfavorabe change in reserve – a SERIOUS answer from him would be “It’s not within my control!”
@doppelganger
i would like to offer another reason why sporeans don’t speak up on the ISA – no relevance to their lives. my life goes on and i’m free to speak up. i honestly don’t fear being hauled up by ISD and i doubt you do otherwise you won’t be here.
a general observation i have of some observers here is that they have a disdain of those who don’t share the same interest as they do on certain issues.
BANK TYCOON TONY LOST OUR SWEATSTAINED, NATIONAL SERVICES MONEY ON HIS PET FOREIGN BANKS TOYS. http://singaporereserves.blogspot.com
WHO IS MORE INVOLVED? TONY OR WONG KS
@Hq
yes. you are right. my dad lived through those days and emphasized that was how power was secured after 1959 – hooligan way by man in white.